[Jamie89]

This is the video:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34625512

This is a further article where she talks about Caitlyn Jenner, who apparently just wants to steal limelight from proper women!:
http://www.theguardian.com/books/201...germaine-greer

The reason I find this so interesting is that it's Germaine Greer who's saying these things. I would have thought a feminist intellectual would better understand the dangers of repressing people. Of course she's entitled to her opinion I'm just very surprised that this is her opinion. For example, saying "they don't behave like women" is basically saying that all women should behave a particular way, which surely is blatant misogyny?

[JoshBB]

She is a TERF - trans-exclusionary radical feminist.

I dont recognise TERFs as feminists at all, because they are essentially saying that the most important part of being a woman is having a vagina. Quite hypocritical given all that shes said.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

She is a TERF - trans-exclusionary radical feminist.

I dont recognise TERFs as feminists at all, because they are essentially saying that the most important part of being a woman is having a vagina. Quite hypocritical given all that shes said.

No she's just a TIT.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

No she's just a TIT.

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

No she's just a TIT.

That too.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

No she's just a TIT.

And an exceedingly, ugly, misshapen tit too. She has not one feminine hormone in her body - which is why she has rattled on about 'Female Eunuchs' and other crap. It's no great shakes to drop out from a race you cannot compete in. Time she shut up.

[Jamie89]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

She is a TERF - trans-exclusionary radical feminist.

I dont recognise TERFs as feminists at all, because they are essentially saying that the most important part of being a woman is having a vagina. Quite hypocritical given all that shes said.

Yes. And she's intentionally specific in referring to male to female transexuals and not the other way around. As if to imply that her problem isn't with transexualism in general but more about protecting an ideal of what a 'proper woman' should be

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by LiamBB

Yes. And she's intentionally specific in referring to male to female transexuals and not the other way around. As if to imply that her problem isn't with transexualism in general but more about protecting an ideal of what a 'proper woman' should be

Yeah. This is why so many radical feminists tend to not be feminists at all, they just hate men. (and even women born as men)

[the truth]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

Yeah. This is why so many radical feminists tend to not be feminists at all, they just hate men. (and even women born as men)

spot on, shes evil pure and simple a spiteful bigot her motivation is all based on male hate....she was on question time a few years ago and said all fathers were perverts and teach their daughters how to seduce men etc etc sick....watch this crap its hard to believe....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjVDYPAuRh0

and to think she was the biggest voice behind the so called feminism rise in the 1960s and 70s....her revisionary history is very dangerous and is used to brainwash young children especially young girls who are taught to hate men. I know several young girls taught feminism all with A grades in all their exams who have NEVER heard of Lloyd George, the man who fought tooth and nail to get women the vote and working class men the vote and who taxed the rich first and created the welfare state national insurance contributions which later formed the nhs. how can feminists not even teach kids about Lloyd George? because hes a man?

[user104658]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

She is a TERF - trans-exclusionary radical feminist.

I dont recognise TERFs as feminists at all, because they are essentially saying that the most important part of being a woman is having a vagina. Quite hypocritical given all that shes said.

LOL at there being an acronym for this

[Raph]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

She is a TERF - trans-exclusionary radical feminist.

I dont recognise TERFs as feminists at all, because they are essentially saying that the most important part of being a woman is having a vagina. Quite hypocritical given all that shes said.

Josh you're the man! (pun intended haha)

[Kizzy]

To play devils advocate can a transitioned female ever truly think/act as a female having not experienced patriarchy or socialisation as a female child?

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

To play devils advocate can a transitioned female ever truly think/act as a female having not experienced patriarchy or socialisation as a female child?

all little girls have a unique child hood experience. a trans girls also have a unique experience as a girl.

there is no definitive "girl" experience.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by lostalex

all little girls have a unique child hood experience. a trans girls also have a unique experience as a girl.

there is no definitive "girl" experience.

I disagree there very much is a male and female gender experience of primary socialisation, if you went through your formative years as a boy that experience will be lacking I would have said.

[Josy]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

She is a TERF - trans-exclusionary radical feminist.

I dont recognise TERFs as feminists at all, because they are essentially saying that the most important part of being a woman is having a vagina. Quite hypocritical given all that shes said.

Wouldn't that be a womb?

[Ashley.]

Originally Posted by Josy

Wouldn't that be a womb?

You're right

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Josy

Wouldn't that be a womb?

This is the thing I find most confusing about the mechanics of a sex change. How can you be a woman or a man with the internal bits of a different sex. Is the operation really a sex change or a castration or in the case of a woman to man cosmetic enhancement.

If you become a man but then have a baby like a woman, something recently spoken about as news, are you still a woman and not a man at all?

If you want to be a woman but can't procreate as a woman or have a menopause when the time comes are you really living a woman's life? What about menstruations?
By the same token if you want to be a man but can't procreate like a man are you really living the life of a man?

Is the change really a satisfactory conclusion, does it make you the sex you desire to be or is it a band aid?

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by lostalex

all little girls have a unique child hood experience. a trans girls also have a unique experience as a girl.

there is no definitive "girl" experience.

I agree here.All kids have their own unique experiences as children.No matter their gender.I'd say gender only comes into the equation as they get older.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

I agree here.All kids have their own unique experiences as children.No matter their gender.I'd say gender only comes into the equation as they get older.

You don't think boys and girls are treated differently at all, and boys and girls don't interact with each other differently?
I think that's primarily what helps shape gender identity and prepares men to be men and women to be women.
That's not to say that men can't be women or visa versa, however expecting trans people to have the life experience as the opposite sex is impossible as it just didn't happen.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

You don't think boys and girls are treated differently at all, and boys and girls don't interact with each other differently?
I think that's primarily what helps shape gender identity and prepares men to be men and women to be women.
That's not to say that men can't be women or visa versa, however expecting trans people to have the life experience as the opposite sex is impossible as it just didn't happen.

But one boy can have a totally different experience to another and the same with girls.I don't think gender plays a huge role until later on.I mean kids are kids.They might play with different toys or whatever but it's not a major thing.

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

To play devils advocate can a transitioned female ever truly think/act as a female having not experienced patriarchy or socialisation as a female child?

Transgender children feel oppression in a way much stronger than any cisgender little girl would be my response to this.

[Jamie89]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

To play devils advocate can a transitioned female ever truly think/act as a female having not experienced patriarchy or socialisation as a female child?

Well it's a good point, and honestly I don't know which is why it doesn't bother me necessarily if people have germaines views because at least it raises a debate, my main issue here is just that its a supposed feminist expressing what I feel are very misoginistic views. I suppose your question raises another which is, how should a woman think/act? Is it how we expect them to based on archaic stereotyping or is it however feels natural to them? I do have a close friend who is a female to male transexual and I had no idea until he told me, but how important should that be anyway compared to how he feels inside? I think these are the things that germaine is overlooking in favour of a more superficial and narrow minded approach to gender identity

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LiamBB

Well it's a good point, and honestly I don't know which is why it doesn't bother me necessarily if people have germaines views because at least it raises a debate, my main issue here is just that its a supposed feminist expressing what I feel are very misoginistic views. I suppose your question raises another which is, how should a woman think/act? Is it how we expect them to based on archaic stereotyping or is it however feels natural to them? I do have a close friend who is a female to male transexual and I had no idea until he told me, but how important should that be anyway compared to how he feels inside? I think these are the things that germaine is overlooking in favour of a more superficial and narrow minded approach to gender identity

It's the censorship I object to, as an academic an intellectual an author and a Woman why is she denied voicing an opinion?
socialisation is not archaic stereotyping when it suits, nor is it misogyny to counter any discussion with debate on the issue.

[Jamie89]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It's the censorship I object to, as an academic an intellectual an author and a Woman why is she denied voicing an opinion?
socialisation is not archaic stereotyping when it suits, nor is it misogyny to counter any discussion with debate on the issue.

She's not denied an opinion she's entitled to it, as are those who disagree with her. I haven't said she should be censored. My point is that what she's saying sounds misoginistic because of her implying that women should act a certain way, which surely goes against feminism?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LiamBB

She's not denied an opinion she's entitled to it, as are those who disagree with her. I haven't said she should be censored. My point is that what she's saying sounds misoginistic because of her implying that women should act a certain way, which surely goes against feminism?

Yet the vid is about her being restricted from speaking on the subject somewhere.
She isn't implying anything, feminism is a female issue.
It's not misogynistic to suggest becoming a woman does not make you privvy to all that being a female entails, it doesn't it's a lifelong learning curve.