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vesavius · Yesterday, 08:19 AM

It came across as confused and heavy handed in the way that he delivered it and it was also heavily edited so that may have done him no favours, but the lad was right.

I think George should have been more specific... He should have differentiated between British and English.

British is a very wide umbrella and doesn't really have a specific culture. The Scottish are very different to the English for example, and the existence of the Empire has broadened that term even more of course. I feel many parts of the old Empire could rationally consider themselves British. I have no issue with that. Rishi Sunak or David Lammy are British. They are not English though.

English, and I fee this is what George was really meaning, is more specific. It is to be part of a cultural story that goes back generations... It is a unique modern expression of a combination of different influences from over hundreds of years. A British Indian has a different story to a British Englishman.

George is correct. Multiculturism (a neoliberal creation that only serves to allow them to move cheap taxable labour around faster) has served to dilute the English identity. It HAS created division and friction as special interest groups inevitably assert themselves. It HAS served to damage the core social fabric of this country. It HAS made us all demonstrably unsafer and understandably less secure. It has turned a high trust society into a low trust one.

When we have elected local representatives more interested in building an airport in Pakistan than dealing with the issues of their elected city, of course there is a problem. When the voice of the native population is suppressed in case it offends a given religion because many in that religion see killing as a justifiable response, of course we have a problem.

George has many of the right ideas but lacks the ability to express them.

TBC, I am pro slow controlled immigration and cultural integration, I am anti fast uncoltrolled immigration and multiculturalism. Don't come at me with any kind of 'racist' nonsense, I am not anti immigration.

Crimson Dynamo · Yesterday, 09:12 AM

amen

Vicky. · Yesterday, 09:16 AM

I disagree with his politics (so far anyway) but I bloody love him

bots · Yesterday, 09:24 AM

we have lost identity as new cultures come in to the country. Brits do exactly the same when they move abroad. Immigration should always be controlled and Blair was an idiot when he signed us up to free borders. Prior to that, things were pretty good

Zizu · Yesterday, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bots

we have lost identity as new cultures come in to the country. Brits do exactly the same when they move abroad. Immigration should always be controlled and Blair was an idiot when he signed us up to free borders. Prior to that, things were pretty good

… and isn’t Blair back on the political scene ??

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Livia · Yesterday, 09:55 AM

Great post, Vesavius. I agree with every word.

Zizu · Yesterday, 09:55 AM

Excellent take on things !!

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MTVN · Yesterday, 02:07 PM

I don't necessarily disagree but he did word it very clumsily and clearly there's some nuance here as our large South Asian populations are largely because of our colonial legacy in those countries. We've also had Indian and Pakistani communities in our country for a very long time most of whom have integrated well and brought a lot to this country

Vanessa · Yesterday, 02:13 PM

He's a great housemate to be fair. But he needs to be careful, itv aren't as tolerant as channel 4

Mystic Mock · Today, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanessa

He's a great housemate to be fair. But he needs to be careful, itv aren't as tolerant as channel 4

That's unfortunately been made very clear.

Crimson Dynamo · Yesterday, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

I don't necessarily disagree but he did word it very clumsily and clearly there's some nuance here as our large South Asian populations are largely because of our colonial legacy in those countries. We've also had Indian and Pakistani communities in our country for a very long time most of whom have integrated well and brought a lot to this country

they did up until Tony Blair

now its out of control

Zizu · Yesterday, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

I don't necessarily disagree but he did word it very clumsily and clearly there's some nuance here as our large South Asian populations are largely because of our colonial legacy in those countries. We've also had Indian and Pakistani communities in our country for a very long time most of whom have integrated well and brought a lot to this country

From what I have noticed ( in the NW) whilst there are some obvious exceptions ( I’m thinking absolutely wonderful individuals) many of these asian communities do anything but integrate- far from it .

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Vicky. · Yesterday, 02:36 PM

Not sure if this is a spoiler or not so

Spoiler:

Zizu · Yesterday, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Not sure if this is a spoiler or not so

Spoiler:

Did they show Sam picking him up on it ?
Honestly can’t remember. I’ve been watching the shows, the after shows and the lengthy live streams…plus I have the man flu
( just before someone points out that I once mentioned that I notice minor details)

If they didn’t show the chat then maybe they should have done..

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OnTheRight · Yesterday, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Not sure if this is a spoiler or not so

Spoiler:

I think I'd last 30 seconds in the BB house.

Lister of Smeg · Yesterday, 04:36 PM

George is the only one with a backbone in that house the rest are weak

GoldHeart · Yesterday, 05:12 PM

George can believe what he wants,but I don't know why he has issue with people being patriot of their own country, isn't that exactly how he feels about the UK himself . Like Zelah said,can they not be proud to be both British & Pakistani or whatever heritage or background they are ? .

Is he going to tell Nancy she can't wave the Italian flag ,or Tate the Scottish flag and so on ? .

There is a difference between nationalism & Patriotism , you can respect other countries aswell as your own .

Also he is talking about the different languages being put up around the UK ,but like Caroline said...you can go abroad and English is also put up .

Brits will go to Spain expecting the locals to automatically understand them ,whilst they themselves refuse to learn Spanish. Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone ,if you're well travelled or whatever...I would like to think you'd try to learn the language,even if everyone in the country spoke fluent English

.

Crimson Dynamo · Yesterday, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

Also he is talking about the different languages being put up around the UK ,but like Caroline said...you can go abroad and English is also put up .

It was a silly point as English is spoken worldwide and is almost a universal language, save China

She should stick to lesser matters

vesavius · Yesterday, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

George can believe what he wants,but I don't know why he has issue with people being patriot of their own country, isn't that exactly how he feels about the UK himself . Like Zelah said,can they not be proud to be both British & Pakistani or whatever heritage or background they are ? .

Is he going to tell Nancy she can't wave the Italian flag ,or Tate the Scottish flag and so on ? .

There is a difference between nationalism & Patriotism , you can respect other countries aswell as your own .

Also he is talking about the different languages being put up around the UK ,but like Caroline said...you can go abroad and English is also put up .

Brits will go to Spain expecting the locals to automatically understand them ,whilst they themselves refuse to learn Spanish. Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone ,if you're well travelled or whatever...I would like to think you'd try to learn the language,even if everyone in the country spoke fluent English

.

I don't think he has a problem at all with others being patriotic about their own country, I think he just wants to right to patriotic about his without being challenged or being told that that English culture 'doesn't exist'. He wants to preserve his, as others demand the right to preserve theirs. I think that's ok.

Just to say, Nationalism is a fine and valid political position. It is not inherently even right wing and many socialist organisations have been nationalistic. The SNP has been for most of it's existence, for example. It's not a bad thing thing to be nationalistic.

If I did move to another country permanently I would def learn the language. A few pensioner boomers in Spain is not the same though as the replacement of near entire boroughs and even cities with foreign nationals.

English is a special case language wise... it is the de facto global language (through Empire and then the US). A Korean, for example, benefits from English being up because around 50% of Koreans speak English and Korea is one of the lower ranking East Asian countries for it. It's not for the benefit of the English, it's because it's the closest thing the world has to a shared tongue. I watch Asian survival shows and when Koreans, Chinese, and Japanese are grouped they always use English as their shared language.