[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Is the uk law really that..my goodness..

Im shocked at that and very upset.

It is awful.Anyone who’s been to even the 12 week scans knows that your baby’s not just a collection of cells by then and at the 21 week scan they look like a fully formed little person.
It should be limited to before 12 imo.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

It is awful.Anyone who’s been to even the 12 week scans knows that your baby’s not just a collection of cells by then and at the 21 week scan they look like a fully formed little person.
It should be limited to before 12 imo.

Before 12 weeks isn't enough time imo and 12 weeks gives the person enough time to first of all find out they're pregnant and secondly a little time to process that and give their decision the thought time it deserves. 12 weeks is when an embryo becomes a fetus so that's probably why there's that cut off point being proposed. Also, I've had 12 week scans and it really doesn't look like a baby at that stage, it looks like a bean

[Beso]

So a married couple find out the kid they have been trying for is now concieved....they split 11 weeks down the line...the wife can then abort without consulting her estranged hubby?

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by parmnion

So a married couple find out the kid they have been trying for is now concieved....they split 11 weeks down the line...the wife can then abort without consulting her estranged hubby?

She can consult him - but for obvious reasons she has to make the final decision.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Before 12 weeks isn't enough time imo and 12 weeks gives the person enough time to first of all find out they're pregnant and secondly a little time to process that and give their decision the thought time it deserves. 12 weeks is when an embryo becomes a fetus so that's probably why there's that cut off point being proposed. Also, I've had 12 week scans and it really doesn't look like a baby at that stage, it looks like a bean

Well my two didn’t look like beans
They had heads and bodies and you could see their bones.

I think later than 12 weeks for rape or medical complications should obviously be allowed.

I also know of somebody who had five abortions before deciding to keep number six.I would put a limit on the amount too so they can’t be used as contraception.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by parmnion

So a married couple find out the kid they have been trying for is now concieved....they split 11 weeks down the line...the wife can then abort without consulting her estranged hubby?

Or in some cases they concieve unintentionally and the woman decides to keep it but the man says he isn’t ready to have kids then she has it and stings him for thousands of £’s over 18 years.
Or the man might want the kid but she just terminates it without considering what the father wants.

Basically he has no rights to his kid.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

Or in some cases they concieve unintentionally and the woman decides to keep it but the man says he isn’t ready to have kids then she has it and stings him for thousands of £’s over 18 years.
Or the man might want the kid but she just terminates it without considering what the father wants.

Basically he has no rights to his kid.

My body my choice but want your cash input, it is not a black and white issue in those cases

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

Well my two didn’t look like beans
They had heads and bodies and you could see their bones.

I think later than 12 weeks for rape or medical complications should obviously be allowed.

I also know of somebody who had five abortions before deciding to keep number six.I would put a limit on the amount too so they can’t be used as contraception.

Awful, when my sister was doing her nursing training and she was only in the midwifery dept for 3 months she said it was an every day occurrence

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

She can consult him - but for obvious reasons she has to make the final decision.

But she can also NOT consult him..she might be so pissed at him that she goes and murders his unborn baby to spite him.

[Smithy]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Politically which was your original point Southern Ireland is not part of the British Isles, so we don't have to be in line with anything

Maybe I should have just put first world countries like I initially planned to, my mistake

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Smithy

Maybe I should have just put first world countries like I initially planned to, my mistake

I expect Niamh is preparing the case for a lengthy ban

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by parmnion

But she can also NOT consult him..she might be so pissed at him that she goes and murders his unborn baby to spite him.

You can't rely on hyper specific hypotheticals with liberal use of overtly emotional language to make a point against abortion because that hypothetical isn't universal.

It's a woman's body at the end of the day, it's her choice.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by parmnion

But she can also NOT consult him..she might be so pissed at him that she goes and murders his unborn baby to spite him.

I find it hard to believe a woman who had planned a baby would abort it out of spite. She would more than likely make such a decision out of panic about coping on her own.

[Greg!]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Politically which was your original point Southern Ireland is not part of the British Isles, so we don't have to be in line with anything

It is part of the British Isles though nnn

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Smithy

Maybe I should have just put first world countries like I initially planned to, my mistake

RUN Smithy RUN.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Greg!

It is part of the British Isles though nnn

Not in my world

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I find it hard to believe a woman who had planned a baby would abort it out of spite. She would more than likely make such a decision out of panic about coping on her own.

You believe that even after that mad cow with the acid attack.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

RUN Smithy RUN.

Is that the dog from the movie after he got his balls fondled by a dog lover?

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

You can't rely on hyper specific hypotheticals with liberal use of overtly emotional language to make a point against abortion because that hypothetical isn't universal.

It's a woman's body at the end of the day, it's her choice.

Ok...how about so pissed at him she hurls acid all over him as he sleeps resulting in a slow painfull death...is that more believable.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Ok...how about so pissed at him she hurls acid all over him as he sleeps resulting in a slow painfull death...is that more believable.

Throwing another ultra specific hypothetical (one which has nothing to do with the subject at hand) does not make your original point any less flawed.

[arista]

Dublin Live Debate Ch4HD News now

[AnnieK]

I am very much Pro Choice and believe that as women we do have more rights to choose what happens to our bodies BUT I do believe that men deserve a voice in debates such as this. Contraception should definitely be both parties responsibility if they do not want sex to result in a pregnancy.

[arista]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TGF9jBSr3c

The debate carries on.
ch4news

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by parmnion

You believe that even after that mad cow with the acid attack.

It’s not the same - that woman is a psycho.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

I am very much Pro Choice and believe that as women we do have more rights to choose what happens to our bodies BUT I do believe that men deserve a voice in debates such as this. Contraception should definitely be both parties responsibility if they do not want sex to result in a pregnancy.

I just believe that we are too far removed from the pregnancy process to try to dictate what women can do with their bodies. Men are just spectators really, we can offer support but we don't go through the risks or the trials and tribulations of it.

I think contraception is a different issue entirely. As you said it's both party's responsibility to make sure they are safe. I've always thought it was odd when you go to certain places and there'll be a condom machine in the men's room but not the women's. Anyone that's sexually active, regardless of gender should have condoms tbh.