[InOne]

Originally Posted by jedward fever

thats personal but no.

Well these people have parents too, and sometimes they are as shocked as anyone. Not all of them come from broken homes, which is a mistake people often make.

[Angus]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

Until anyone in here says they have kids and wouldn't kill for their kids I'm not going to bother posting

It's no coincidence that all the ones who actually have children are of a like mind - it's oh so easy to be tolerant and reasonable when you have no emotional investment in the issue, or any experience of the feelings you have once you become a mum or dad. My eldest son who became a father himself a year ago, told me he had no idea he would feel the way he did, it was overpowering for him and he has told me that he would die for his son, and would never, ever let anyone hurt him. To me that is a normal feeling for any parent and is not something that you can explain or teach your children. They will feel it themselves when they have their own children, so there is no need for explanation. Like it or not, those that don't have children have absolutely NO idea of what that feels like. They can imagine it, but not actually feel it.

But what truly pisses me off is the naive moralising of people who have had little or no experience of real life but feel qualified to lecture me on ethical issues. Until they have suffered the terrible loss of a loved one at the hands of a lowlife piece of scum, they do not know how they would react. Unfortunately, some of us have already been faced with such a loss and know only too well.

And justice, by the way, is defined as fairness and equity in our dealings with others, therefore the punishment should fit the crime. If that equates to an eye for an eye, then so be it. The moment you try to interfere with that concept of fairness and equity by trying to bring other factors such as the deeply flawed Human Rights legislation into the mix, justice can no longer be done.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by happyland

Dezzy, it really isn't about acting superior and it certainly isn't a copout.. As a mother, I would want anyone who seriously harmed my children dead. I can't help it, it's just how I feel. I think most, if not all parents would probably feel the same.

Yes, I'm aware of that Lee, and I'd feel exactly the same if it were anyone I loved that was harmed, but we'll get nowhere as a society if we hand out retribution in that manner, particularly since this problem wont go away with one Paedo killed by the relatives of the victim, you know? There's plenty more out there and are we to deal with all of our social taboos and criminals in that way?

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by jedward fever

thats personal but no.

Well isn't that hypocritical? You can't pick and choose when it comes to the law it's either all or nothing. You can't advocate violence but makes yourself immune from it's effects at the same time.

Make up your mind.

[Kerry]

Think I'll go and enjoy the rest of my night.....

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by InOne

Well these people have parents too, and sometimes they are as shocked as anyone. Not all of them come from broken homes, which is a mistake people often make.

still from a netural perspective i think these bastards deserve to die.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by jedward fever

still from a netural perspective i think these bastards deserve to die.

Well seen as all these mothers keep going on about how they'd like to kill a peado or see one dead. Was wondering what they'd do if it was one of their own.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by thebeast

If the murderer is a murderer and is 100% PROVEN then I don't care if they are killed.

I think LIFE in prison for MOST offenders if the best option!!

You should watch a great documentary about how many errors in justice that have been made in the States throughout the years, but sure the innocent prisoners have already been executed. It happens. Anways, that's me going off on a tangent there.

[Kerry]

Originally Posted by angus58

It's no coincidence that all the ones who actually have children are of a like mind - it's oh so easy to be tolerant and reasonable when you have no emotional investment in the issue, or any experience of the feelings you have once you become a mum or dad. My eldest son who became a father himself a year ago, told me he had no idea he would feel the way he did, it was overpowering for him and he has told me that he would die for his son, and would never, ever let anyone hurt him. To me that is a normal feeling for any parent and is not something that you can explain or teach your children. They will feel it themselves when they have their own children, so there is no need for explanation. Like it or not, those that don't have children have absolutely NO idea of what that feels like. They can imagine it, but not actually feel it.

But what truly pisses me off is the naive moralising of people who have had little or no experience of real life but feel qualified to lecture me on ethical issues. Until they have suffered the terrible loss of a loved one at the hands of a lowlife piece of scum, they do not know how they would react. Unfortunately, some of us have already been faced with such a loss and know only too well.

And justice, by the way, is defined as fairness and equity in our dealings with others, therefore the punishment should fit the crime. If that equates to an eye for an eye, then so be it. The moment you try to interfere with that concept of fairness and equity by trying to bring other factors such as the deeply flawed Human Rights legislation into the mix, justice can no longer be done.

Cheers.

I seriously don't mean to preach. But as you say, until you hold your baby. Nothing competes. And I'd love to see peoples posts here once they'd had kids. You'd give anything, everything for them. Well, most parents.

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by setanta

Yes, I'm aware of that Lee, and I'd feel exactly the same if it were anyone I loved that was harmed, but we'll get nowhere as a society if we hand out retribution in that manner, particularly since this problem wont go away with one Paedo killed by the relatives of the victim, you know? There's plenty more out there and are we to deal with all of our social taboos and criminals in that way?

We're getting nowhere as a society as we are! It's just a joke! The whole justice system is a shambles!

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by InOne

I agree they should never be allowed back into society yes. But think we should make use of them to help other kids in the future.

Yes. We need to get some answers then!!

I don't think we will. It is going to be an ongoing cycle......

A peedo commits a crime - a peedo sent to jail - a peedo released - the same peedo likely to re-offend!!

All the knowledge I have is that the peedo is in jail for LIFE so there is NO chance for that peedo to commit the crime again.

At the same time.. there will be another peedo out there.. doing something awful to another child.. or maybe even the same one

Then yet.. the cycle continues.

At the end of the day.. the child who has been raped or whatever is unlucky.

The child needs more help after the tragic ordeal than the rapist does.... because the rapist will be living behind closed doors for the rest of their life anyway.. if the law was changed

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Well isn't that hypocritical? You can't pick and choose when it comes to the law it's either all or nothing. You can't advocate violence but makes yourself immune from it's effects at the same time.

Make up your mind.

if its a personal matter my views would go out the window,like if you have a child and he/she gets abused your views would go out of the window and if you say otherwise then your lying.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by thebeast

Yes. We need to get some answers then!!

I don't think we will. It is going to be an ongoing cycle......

A peedo commits a crime - a peedo sent to jail - a peedo released - the same peedo likely to re-offend!!

All the knowledge I have is that the peedo is in jail for LIFE so there is NO chance for that peedo to commit the crime again.

At the same time.. there will be another peedo out there.. doing something awful to another child.. or maybe even the same one

Then yet.. the cycle continues.

At the end of the day.. the child who has been raped or whatever is unlucky.

The child needs more help after the tragic ordeal than the rapist does.... because the rapist will be living behind closed doors for the rest of their life anyway.. if the law was changed

You're making it sound like the kid just gets left there to deal with it on their own. Of course they get loads of help to deal with it.

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by Lucy.

I don't even understand why you'd want them dead. It's such a cop out, what if the child was murdered? Then the child and the murderer is dead and people start to forget about what that person did, least when their in jail it's not forgotton and their made to deal with it for the rest of their life. I agree sentences should mean life, but they shouldn't mean death.

Oh it will be remembered allright.......

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by angus58

But what truly pisses me off is the naive moralising of people who have had little or no experience of real life but feel qualified to lecture me on ethical issues. Until they have suffered the terrible loss of a loved one at the hands of a lowlife piece of scum, they do not know how they would react. Unfortunately, some of us have already been faced with such a loss and know only too well.

I wasn't aware you had an encyclopaedic knowledge of all our lives. Who are you to say if we've lived or suffered loss? I lost my uncle to a knifing in a churchyard yet did I want the murderer dead? NO. I felt incredible anger I won't deny that I still do now but the killer's death wouldn't have brought my uncle back and it wouldn't have eased my family's pain. He's still dead and we would still grieve.

How dare you make such assumptions on our lives, acting all superior to us when you know nothing of adversity we've faced in our lives.

I know how the law works and I know what it is to lose someone so don't you DARE tell me otherwise just because I don't believe in capital punishment.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I wasn't aware you had an encyclopaedic knowledge of all our lives. Who are you to say if we've lived or suffered loss? I lost my uncle to a knifing in a churchyard yet did I want the murderer dead? NO. I felt incredible anger I won't deny that I still do now but the killer's death wouldn't have brought my uncle back and it wouldn't have eased my family's pain. He's still dead and we would still grieve.

How dare you make such assumptions on our lives, acting all superior to us when you know nothing of adversity we've faced in our lives.

I know how the law works and I know what it is to lose someone so don't you DARE tell me otherwise just because I don't believe in capital punishment.

Well said.

[Lucy.]

Originally Posted by InOne

Well said.

I concurr.

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by setanta

You should watch a great documentary about how many errors in justice that have been made in the States throughout the years, but sure the innocent prisoners have already been executed. It happens. Anways, that's me going off on a tangent there.

Okay.. then in some cases.. okay capital punishment may be wrong.. but like I said.. LIFE IN PRISON sentences should be increased......

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I wasn't aware you had an encyclopaedic knowledge of all our lives. Who are you to say if we've lived or suffered loss? I lost my uncle to a knifing in a churchyard yet did I want the murderer dead? NO. I felt incredible anger I won't deny that I still do now but the killer's death wouldn't have brought my uncle back and it wouldn't have eased my family's pain. He's still dead and we would still grieve.

How dare you make such assumptions on our lives, acting all superior to us when you know nothing of adversity we've faced in our lives.

I know how the law works and I know what it is to lose someone so don't you DARE tell me otherwise just because I don't believe in capital punishment.

well im surprised you aint agreeing with me and other posters on here considering you had a traumatic past.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by thebeast

Okay.. then in some cases.. okay capital punishment may be wrong.. but like I said.. LIFE IN PRISON sentences should be increased......

But sure you're backtracking now cuz a few posts ago you said that life imprisonment is draining the economy of much needed money, you know?

[Kerry]

Dezzy calm down. If we want sob stories I'd lost both my parents before I was 10. My Grandad too and only today one of my daughters school friends got knocked down! It was my mothers anniversary just a few days from my birthday which was yesterday and TBH I'm not feeling too good with my daughter in shock. But lets wallow huh?!?!

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by setanta

But sure you're backtracking now cuz a few posts ago you said that life imprisonment is draining the economy of much needed money, you know?

No.. the rehabilitation!!! If we tested EVERY single person in hospital and that for their crimes of rape.. it is not worth it for every one of them!

I am not back tracking at all.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by jedward fever

well im surprised you aint agreeing with me and other posters on here considering you had a traumatic past.

Why? Capital Punishment helps no one, it doesn't make the pain go away and it doesn't undo the damage. It just causes more.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

Dezzy calm down. If we want sob stories I'd lost both my parents before I was 10. My Grandad too and only today one of my daughters school friends got knocked down! It was my mothers anniversary just a few days from my birthday which was yesterday and TBH I'm not feeling too good with my daughter in shock. But lets wallow huh?!?!

So it's okay for you to shut me down but when i've got a 'reason' to feel the way I do it's a sob story?

HYPOCRITES. The lot of you.

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Why? Capital Punishment helps no one, it doesn't make the pain go away and it doesn't undo the damage. It just causes more.

Not if it was the law though???? Crime would still be at the same rate I reckon! Just one less because they are not going to come out of jail or they are already dead.