[Pyramid*]

this week they showed many of the travellers all congregating at the burial spot of a one of the sons - paying homage and respect on the boy's anniversary.

My initial reaction watching this was seeing them all there, sitting about and around the grave, complete with cans of booze, sitting, standing around drinking out of cans as they paid their respects - and to be perfectly honest, I was pretty appalled.

I understand the parents, immediate family etc, close friends wishing to visit - but I couldn't help but think of that them all standing around slugging beer and cider - how totally disrespectful to those who may be attending the burial of their own loved ones, in services which are naturally sad and sombre in nature and that as much I found it touching that so many of the travellers had actually gone to visit the graveside - I was equally as disgusted that they felt it was more than fine to sit there and have their own quiet but boozy party going on.

Far as I can see, in the main, those who have taken part in this documentary surely to christ cannot honestly think that it will show travellers in a good light or reflect well upon them? How anyone could think that a large squad of people, swigging booze at a graveside would be a positive image of their culture/tradition etc, totally dumbfounds me.

If you were burying a loved one of your own or attending a funeral at the same time and saw this: how do you think you would feel about it?

[Kerry]

I was uncomfortable watching it. Especially as I was quite sure I saw some of them casually sitting on other gravestones slugging lager. It'd certainly piss me off if I was visiting my loved ones graves but travellers tend not to be people to be reasoned with..... Most people would have to walk away and come back another time. Not something anyone should have to do

[Zippy]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

My initial reaction watching this was seeing them all there, sitting about and around the grave, complete with cans of booze, sitting, standing around drinkin got of cans as they paid their respects - and to be perfectly honest, I was pretty appalled.

I can't believe theyre allowed to do that!

I'd be disgusted if my brothers grave was there and I was visiting on his birthday or something

such selfish scumbags

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

I was uncomfortable watching it. Especially as I was quite sure I saw some of them casually sitting on other gravestones slugging lager. It'd certainly piss me off if I was visiting my loved ones graves but travellers tend not to be people to be reasoned with..... Most people would have to walk away and come back another time. Not something anyone should have to do

I didn't tape it, but I think I saw that as well - certainly they were standing on/ around the other graves etc.... and yes, I would be incensed if it was happening on my loved ones grave. I'm pretty sure if non travellers were to disrespect their loved ones burial spot in the same manner, they'd have something to say about it.

As I say, from the pov that many wanted to be there to 'show there respect' to the dead son - the manner in which they did it, with total disregard to the significance of the place, of the quiet, peaceful, serene nature of a place of rest that is not theirs soley - I thought they showed complete selfishness in their own needs/wants with no regard at all for others.

Unsurprising that Travellers get so much grief from so many if this is typical of what goes on and what they think is acceptable - given that they are part of society.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Zippy

I can't believe theyre allowed to do that!

I'd be disgusted if my brothers grave was there and I was visiting on his birthday or something

such selfish scumbags

Without a word of a lie - it wasn't even surrepticious. All very open, cans in hand, passing out the 'carry out' etc, standing, sitting, lying around the gravestones, grass area, seating area and footpath. Discreet it was not.

[Kerry]

Not to mention the music blaring from the car

[Zippy]

Oh I did see it. Just couldnt believe it was allowed.

this show aint winning them fans

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

Not to mention the music blaring from the car

I can't recall hearing that tbf, but in saying that - I think I was stunned from taking in what I was seeing that it possibly never registered.

The one other image sticking in my mind is the father in his white vest top, kissing the photo of the son that was on the headstone, and seeing it look as though he'd spat on it (not deliberately, it just sort of looked like it happened accidentally) - whilst he had his can of beer in hand and raised the can to the gravestone to signify 'toasting'.

The trailer (no pun intended) for next week's show, highlighted a traveller saying that they were proud and honourable people. I didn't see much honour being bestowed to those who may have been sharing the cemetery that day to visit their own loved ones buried there.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Zippy

Oh I did see it. Just couldnt believe it was allowed.

this show aint winning them fans

Ahh... see what you mean!!! That's the thing I can't understand: where on earth did any of those that are taking part in the filming of these things, think that this would 'help their cause' - help in trying to bridge the gap between traveller and non travellers and the animosity that exists. What did they truly believe would be beneficial for all this to be filmed.

Certainly things can be edited and misrepresented / manipulated:- but there needs to be core activity to work on - and they were most certainly all there, behaving in this way - and I wouldn't be surprised if there was editing on that footage - I have a feeling that what we saw was the tamer, more 'palatable' viewer friendly version.

[GypsyGoth]

I thought it was a nice way to celebrate someone's life. Shame they don't do it for girl gypsies who die.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by GypsyGoth

I thought it was a nice way to celebrate someone's life. Shame they don't do it for girl gypsies who die.

You seriously think it was nice to see a large group of adults hanging around a grave, doing nothing much other than standing about, slugging booze, passing cans around each other and not respecting the other burial grounds of others non travellers? Words fail me.

[GypsyGoth]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

You seriously think it was nice to see a large group of adults hanging around a grave, doing nothing much other than standing about, slugging booze, passing cans around each other and not respecting the other burial grounds of others non travellers? Words fail me.

I've drank in a graveyard with friends at night.

And it's good to see people going to one and having a sort of celebration. Also I don't think they were disrespecting other peoples grave.

Plus it was their custom, and I didn't see anyone complaining.

[Kerry]

Actually, a thoughts just crossed my mind.... they slug beers by the graveside. I dread to think where they relieve themselves Piss up a gravestone?

No, it's not respectful in the slightest and I'd actually wonder if many of the dead would want to be 'worshipped' that way

I've no problem with how people wish to live their lives but if they want respect from 'outsiders' they need to be respectful of them too. Travellers (many, not all) simply are not

Remember that student pissing up a war memorial? How the nation hated him? Well, think about it........

[Kerry]

Originally Posted by GypsyGoth

I've drank in a graveyard with friends at night.

And it's good to see people going to one and having a sort of celebration. Also I don't think they were disrespecting other peoples grave.

Plus it was their custom, and I didn't see anyone complaining.

Because people daren't. Ever encountered a travellers threat? It's not pretty. Usually involves at the very slightest a brick though your window

[Judas]

Originally Posted by GypsyGoth

I've drank in a graveyard with friends at night.

That hardly makes it ok. I've still not watched the programme in question, but this thread has finally inspired me to do just that now.

[Kerry]

Originally Posted by Judas

That hardly makes it ok. I've still not watched the programme in question, but this thread has finally inspired me to do just that now.

Apparently (though don't quote me) next weeks is the more 'civilised' side

Check out C4 OD if you want to see the others

[Kerry]

Last weeks episode with the disrespect in question

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by GypsyGoth

I've drank in a graveyard with friends at night.

And it's good to see people going to one and having a sort of celebration. Also I don't think they were disrespecting other peoples grave.

Plus it was their custom, and I didn't see anyone complaining.

That doesn't mean it was correct behaviour. Nor respectful - indeed, hanging around drinking in graveyards tends to be something underagers do at night because there is no one around to see them drinking.

You think standing around en masse drinking cans of booze at a graveyard can be classed as an appropriate place to celebrate anything?

What about the time old tradition and custom of graveyards being places of peace, of calm, respectful, reflective dignity or doesn't that count?

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

Last weeks episode with the disrespect in question

Thanks for that. the very last section covers this topic..... yes, music blaring out from the car - as per Paddy... the mother plays them every year and doesn't care who hears it or doens't hear it. A squad of people tramping all over other people's graves whilst Paddy and his mates lift crates of stongbow out of car boots to pass around, to have along with their cigarettes. And I'm quite sure their fag butts will be left dropped where they stood....all over other people's graves.

Nice touch are the boxes of booze lying around at the gravesides.

In fact, at the end, pause and you'll see 2 men, sitting on someone else's headrest, being used as a seat, talking and drinking, with one of them with their feet inside the little brick boundary that's been laid. Yep, this is really respectful stuff.

[Kerry]

A lot of the time the police daren't touch them either. Is it even legal to drink there? And who's driving the car? Aren't they causing a nuisance? They get away with alsorts as people are sh!t scared of their reputation

On the plus side they do seem to be moving on by the generation...... (slightly)

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

A lot of the time the police daren't touch them either. Is it even legal to drink there? And who's driving the car? Aren't they causing a nuisance? They get away with alsorts as people are sh!t scared of their reputation

On the plus side they do seem to be moving on by the generation...... (slightly)

Isn't drinking in a public place illegal? So is earning money on the side and not paying tax - but that's not stopped many (not all) travellers of this ilk doing precisely that.

Having watched the 'Cemetery' scene again, I didn't quite fully appreicate how many were there, how spread out over the area they were, or quite how many other people's graves they were trampling around.

As for the girl dressed in the pink shorts, demin boots.... can you imagine some other funeral party arriving, to bury their child and being met with that lot, with music belting out of car stereo, imagine a priest trying to say service with all that going on around.

[Kerry]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Isn't drinking in a public place illegal? So is earning money on the side and not paying tax - but that's not stopped many (not all) travellers of this ilk doing precisely that.

Having watched the 'Cemetery' scene again, I didn't quite fully appreicate how many were there, how spread out over the area they were, or quite how many other people's graves they were trampling around.

As for the girl dressed in the pink shorts, demin boots.... can you imagine some other funeral party arriving, to bury their child and being met with that lot, with music belting out of car stereo, imagine a priest trying to say service with all that going on around.

I think drinking in a public place is one of those grey areas. I know I've seen areas in the city centre which say 'drinking in this space is prohibited' which would lead you to believe anywhere else is fine. That said, I think it's at police descretion. Basically sitting and sharing a bottle of wine with a loved one in the park would be fine. Rioting through a graveyard....... well you'd like to think not...

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

Last weeks episode with the disrespect in question

At what point does this bit get shown?

[Kerry]

Originally Posted by MTVN

At what point does this bit get shown?

Towards the end I believe

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

Towards the end I believe

Ok thanks Kerry I'll have a look