[arista]

"could there have been someone actually in the apartment at this time??? "

Yes Josy anything is possible.


But loads of kids are missing
they do not get on every TV News



I would prefer real news
on this not
it staying 6 years and all with no
solid updates

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zee

I think my first thought would be that she'd been kidnapped, if the window was open, though...

I don't think I would, especially if the other two children were still in the room

[Josy]

Nah I agree with Niamh, my first thought would be that she had woken up again like the night before and wandered.

[Cherie]

But the later sighting of someone carrying a child would put Gerry having dinner with his friends wouldn't it

[Z]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

I don't think I would, especially if the other two children were still in the room

Originally Posted by Josy

Nah I agree with Niamh, my first thought would be that she had woken up again like the night before and wandered.

Yeah but if you're a worst-case-scenario person like I am (and I believe Kate McCann is too) then your mind jumps to the worst possible conclusion... and unfortunately in this case, she was right to think so. If you have unscrupulous men looking to kidnap toddlers to sell into the sex trade, they're not going to take babies, they're going to take toddlers. I'm of the opinion that the people who took her are not the people who have her right now, I believe they were just middle men who go out and do the dirty work and then sell the victims onto someone. It's quite possible they kidnapped her, took her to the beach and someone in a boat sped off to an unknown location. If the kids were sedated, as has been suggested in this thread (there was no mention of that in the Crimewatch report that I noticed but I'm assuming that it's been reported somewhere else?) then Madeleine wouldn't have even put up a struggle, she could well have been asleep the entire time if she'd been drugged by her parents.

Just a combination of sloppy negligent parenting and awful, tragic coincidence.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by arista

"could there have been someone actually in the apartment at this time??? "

Yes Josy anything is possible.


But loads of kids are missing
they do not get on every TV News



I would prefer real news
on this not
it staying 6 years and all with no
solid updates

if it was your child, you would want it on the news everyday until you had news.

[Z]

Another thing to consider is that the people who took her may well have been murdered or committed suicide once the case became a global news story, I'm sure it can't be great for your conscience if you're kidnapping little kids from their families to make your money; if they were working for an employer, they may well have been taken out because they posed a risk to the crime ring if they were caught by the police. I've studied human trafficking fairly extensively, this is all quite possible.

[arista]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

if it was your child, you would want it on the news everyday until you had news.

No I am not that Greedy

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by arista

No I am not that Greedy

a strange choice of words!
your allowed to be selfish when its your child.

[arista]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

a strange choice of words!
your allowed to be selfish when its your child.

WRONG


The Police contact you with All Updates
NOT the FECKING TV NEWS

[Josy]

Originally Posted by Zee

Yeah but if you're a worst-case-scenario person like I am (and I believe Kate McCann is too) then your mind jumps to the worst possible conclusion... and unfortunately in this case, she was right to think so. If you have unscrupulous men looking to kidnap toddlers to sell into the sex trade, they're not going to take babies, they're going to take toddlers. I'm of the opinion that the people who took her are not the people who have her right now, I believe they were just middle men who go out and do the dirty work and then sell the victims onto someone. It's quite possible they kidnapped her, took her to the beach and someone in a boat sped off to an unknown location. If the kids were sedated, as has been suggested in this thread (there was no mention of that in the Crimewatch report that I noticed but I'm assuming that it's been reported somewhere else?) then Madeleine wouldn't have even put up a struggle, she could well have been asleep the entire time if she'd been drugged by her parents.

Just a combination of sloppy negligent parenting and awful, tragic coincidence.

Zee I honestly think if she was a worst case scenario type of person then there is no way at all she would have left her children in that apartment by themselves, she would know of the dangers of leaving them alone like that.

Running to the restaurant and shouting they have taken her is a really odd thing to do imo even if she was in shock.

[James]

I don't know if I have misunderstood the facts here, but isn't it the case that for the parents to be involved in their daughter's disappearance then all seven of the people they were with at the restaurant that night have to be lying and covering for them?

That's not very credible.

[Z]

Originally Posted by Josy

Zee I honestly think if she was a worst case scenario type of person then there is no way at all she would have left her children in that apartment by themselves, she would know of the dangers of leaving them alone like that.

Running to the restaurant and shouting they have taken her is a really odd thing to do imo even if she was in shock.

I dunno, I can completely understand (though I don't support) why they felt safe leaving their kids in an apartment by themselves if everyone else was doing it and they felt safe with their system of going back to check on them every half an hour. Then of course when the worst case scenario happened, she immediately felt guilty for leaving them in the first place. They were swept up in the innocence of being in a crowd; if everyone else is doing it, it seems innocent and totally fine because nobody else had had a problem with it.

When I was beaten up on my birthday I first said to my friend "do you think I should call an ambulance?" and then tried to joke with the paramedic that it wouldn't have happened if I'd had a smaller forehead. People say and do bizarre things that don't make sense when they're in shock.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by James

I don't know if I have misunderstood the facts here, but isn't it the case that for the parents to be involved in their daughter's disappearance then all seven of the people they were with at the restaurant that night have to be lying and covering for them?

That's not very credible.

Yes, and I believe if they were lying someone would have slipped up by now.

[Nedusa]

It's all very strange that on that one particular night an international Paedophile gang just happened to be targeting praia del Luz that particular night and they snatched one toddler ?

No Portuguese police investigations showed up any criminal or unusual Paedophile activity in that area of the Algarve around that time ?? So was the abductor a chancer, a Paedophile on holiday ? It does sound unlikely and the window of opportunity to snatch her was desparately short, it would have taken nerves of steel or perhaps one than one person but again we are back into International Paedophile gang territory.

No ... The unpalatable and shocking truth of this whole sad story is that the parents know what really happened that night and are actively involved in perpetuating this abduction story for evermore...

I for one hope new real evidence comes to light and this case is blown wide open inasmuch as the McCanns themselves are finally forced to admit the truth about what happened to their little girl on that fateful night....!!!!!

[joeysteele]

This case is to me a massive mystery and I really have all sorts of thoughts as to it running round my head everytime I hear more of it.

I haven't any children yet, I have though been a child and I know my Parents and all those in my family who have children would not and no way even at home, let alone in a foreign country, would any of those parents leave a 3/4 year old with younger twins on their own for any length of time let alone for possibly hours.

I just don't get this case at all and really think it best I keep my own counsel as to what I think in the main but somehow,although I applaud any investigations into it being made further,I am not expecting any conclusive positive results in the end from this new investigation.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Josy

Zee I honestly think if she was a worst case scenario type of person then there is no way at all she would have left her children in that apartment by themselves, she would know of the dangers of leaving them alone like that.

Running to the restaurant and shouting they have taken her is a really odd thing to do imo even if she was in shock.

Yeah, "They've taken her" is very odd. "She's gone" or "I can't find Maddie" or something. The phrasing is weird.

Originally Posted by Zee

I think my first thought would be that she'd been kidnapped, if the window was open, though...

True. If the window was closed with a shutter down, I wouldn't presume my 3 year old had forced her way out of it.

Originally Posted by Cherie

But the later sighting of someone carrying a child would put Gerry having dinner with his friends wouldn't it

What do you mean?

I think the guy seen walking towards the beach with a kid was spotted after 10pm IIRC? So between the time Kate found Maddie gone and the police arriving.

But of course at this point, as James points out, their 5 other friends would have been with them at the apartments checking their own kids, helping look around for Maddie. If Gerry disappeared on foot with her they'd have noticed and therefore would have to be lying to cover for him, which takes the theory even further into absurdity.

[Nedusa]

If they were in fact covering up her accidental death then I find it hard to believe given the shock and grief stricken state they both would have been in , that they could plan and put into operation the perfect abduction scenario , that they could move and safely dispose of their little girls body and still give interviews to the police that were credible and plausible.

You would think they would have missed some vital piece of evidence or left some clues as to what actually happened .

Makes me wonder if perhaps a third party was involved ??

I don't know... Like most people this case is so confusing and unusual from so many angles...

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

It's all very strange that on that one particular night an international Paedophile gang just happened to be targeting praia del Luz that particular night and they snatched one toddler ?

No Portuguese police investigations showed up any criminal or unusual Paedophile activity in that area of the Algarve around that time ?? So was the abductor a chancer, a Paedophile on holiday ? It does sound unlikely and the window of opportunity to snatch her was desparately short, it would have taken nerves of steel or perhaps one than one person but again we are back into International Paedophile gang territory.

No ... The unpalatable and shocking truth of this whole sad story is that the parents know what really happened that night and are actively involved in perpetuating this abduction story for evermore...

I for one hope new real evidence comes to light and this case is blown wide open inasmuch as the McCanns themselves are finally forced to admit the truth about what happened to their little girl on that fateful night....!!!!!

Why would there have to be other activity? They're hardly going to remain in one area kidnapping children with search parties/police investigations that occur after just one child goes missing.

They don't have to be a chancer. They repeated their evening routine 4 nights in a row. Someone watching and following the pattern and then seizing the opportunity or any other possibilities are not implausible.

A pedophile on holiday? There are people who live/work/operate abroad, they don't have to be "on holiday".

If they had done something, then why wouldn't they lie low after the case was closed and they were officially dropped as suspects? Making worldwide appeals would not be in their interests.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

If they were in fact covering up her accidental death then I find it hard to believe given the shock and grief stricken state they both would have been in , that they could plan and put into operation the perfect abduction scenario , that they could move and safely dispose of their little girls body and still give interviews to the police that were credible and plausible.

You would think they would have missed some vital piece of evidence or left some clues as to what actually happened .

Makes me wonder if perhaps a third party was involved ??

I don't know... Like most people this case is so confusing and unusual from so many angles...

But it being nigh on impossible for them to have covered up an accident means a third party was involved? From where?

Third party or not there would be more evidence.

[Z]

Originally Posted by 08marsh

Why would there have to be other activity? They're hardly going to remain in one area kidnapping children with search parties/police investigations that occur after just one child goes missing.

They don't have to be a chancer. They repeated their evening routine 4 nights in a row. Someone watching and following the pattern and then seizing the opportunity or any other possibilities are not implausible.

A pedophile on holiday? There are people who live/work/operate abroad, they don't have to be "on holiday".

If they had done something, then why wouldn't they lie low after the case was closed and they were officially dropped as suspects? Making worldwide appeals would not be in their interests.

Take a look at the illicit drugs trade in Ibiza for example, with the case of those two girls being jailed in Peru - the gangs that operate the drug cartels are British men on the Spanish island! People are equating these hypothetical kiddy snatchers with respectable people with predictable patterns. The world of human trafficking is far more normal than people would ever want to imagine.

This clip is from a documentary about a man trying to get his wife back after she was trafficked by a friend of the couple. The man at the start of the clip was the one who trafficked her. He told her he could get a job for her. Instead he trafficked her, she had no idea what was coming next, she trusted this man. Sex traffickers aren't obvious.

Youtube video

[Lee.]

I honestly do not believe for a minute that the McCanns had anything to do with madeleines disappearance.

[Vicky.]

The Metropolitan Police team refuses to be critical of the previous inquiry in an effort to foster good relations with Portuguese police.

Six local officers based in Faro have been appointed to liaise with British police. But DCI Redwood hopes that ultimately the Portuguese investigation will be reopened.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/madeleine-m...2.html#tikTGfJ

That could be interesting

Especially with the libel case going on. Can't see the McCanns being too impressed with this at all...

[Z]

The main problem with this case is that there are an infinite number of variables and possibilities to explain what happened that night, and a lot of them are down to the McCanns and their negligence, which clouds everyone's view of what happened whether you believe they are guilty of covering up her death or had nothing to do with her disappearance. Constantly raking it up in the news is the only way the McCanns can keep the case alive, but it's not impacting on public perception of them in a unifying way because all the factors are still totally unpredictable.

[Braden]

It's so difficult to watch the McCann's sit and talk about Madeleine, especially not knowing the truth.

I genuinely want to believe that they didn't have anything to do with it, but I can't help but think otherwise. Watching the reenactment last night and knowing that Madeleine told her mother that she was crying along with her brother was upsetting to watch. And if I find it distressing I know that her parents would have done something about it, which would result to her not being able to cry on that specific night. Giving her sleeping pills would have sorted that problem.

If I'm wrong then I hope that the outcome is revealed sooner rather than later. I don't think anybody deserves six years of heartache.