[the truth]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I do also wish that more people would consider adoption as an option. People often quote the "over-stretched care system" as a reason not to, but that is in fact only because of older children entering care. There is a HUGE demand (from infertile and same-sex couples) for adoption of newborn babies. I've heard people argue against it saying that it isn't fair because of how hard it would be for the mother to give up the child but... wtf? When the alternative is just killing it in the womb? Ummmm...

exactly, killing the baby is the cowards way out in a society that lacks the care , patience and compassion to simply build a better system that makes it easier for parents to have children and foster or adopt them where necessary. adoption is evil unless in cases of rape of serious health risks

[GypsyGoth]

Abortions for everybody!!! *point point*



Yay abortions!!

[Liam-]

Originally Posted by the truth

pretty sure? you havent got aclue what your etalking about , tens of thousands of women complain they felt pressured and rushed into having abortions and felt that no one took the time to explain all the other options available. the pressure can come from the medical staff, the her parents, her family, her partner , her new partner etc etc vast numbers of women regret it forever, so too do many fathers

Please don't tell me i don't know what I'm talking about, that is beyond patronizing.
Yes, some people may live to regret it and some may feel pressurized by people to go through with an abortion, but that doesn't mean that it's a bad thing over all, some woman have abortions early on in their teenage years because they wouldn't be able to cope with a baby or they weren't supported by their family or the father, or they weren't financially stable, but in the future turn their life around and find that they could have dealt with keeping the baby.. but most of the time when someone has an abortion, at that time it would have been the right thing to do, for the woman and for the sake of the child that could have been.

[Braden]

I don't think it's right per se, but there are circumstances where abortion is a rationalised thing to do (like most people have said, rape is one of them).

I think it comes down to the whole "who am I to tell someone what is right and wrong", if someone wants an abortion I would uncomfortable with even suggesting that they're wrong to do so.

[Dollface]

Originally Posted by Ninastar

IMO it's totally wrong... I think there's a disgusting 'idea' if you will, that if people have unprotected sex, they thing 'well if worse comes to the worse, abortion'. I think people dont realise how wrong it is in most cases. It's so easy to get an abortion here, i know quite a few girls that have. and I personally think it's wrong.

However, I do think it's it's just as wrong to 'force' someone to have that baby. I guess I'd rather people 'abort' their unwanted baby, than raise a baby they never wanted.

I just wish these people who wanted to abort their babies would give adoption a thought. It rarely happens in this country and I think it's such a shame. I think a hell of a lot more needs to be done. My worst hate in the world is bad parents. Some people just shouldn't be them... I find that in most cases, the parents are the worst are ones who didn't plan on having them/hardly even like kids. I just wish they'd realise that kids aren't just something you can raise with having no clue about. You have to care about them and do everything you can for them... Anyway, that's going OT...

Too long didnt read - I don't really believe in it, but I think it's better than allowing people who might not handle being a parent, become a parent.

I agree with this

[Vicky.]

I'm not sure people are rushed into abortions, however the proper care is definitely not there.

Against my original judgement (I have written about this before on here anyway), here goes. I had an abortion at 15/16 years old after being spiked and ending up pregnant. I wrote a lengthy post about it a few years back but from what I remember it was quite graphic explaining exactly what happens exactly in an early abortion, so its pretty grim so I wont dig it up. However, long story short..I was told I would get to see a psychiatrist person to make sure I was making the decision for the right reasons and stuff before taking the first tablet. The day I went, the psychiatrist was off work..but they still went ahead and gave me the tablet anyway. I never felt rushed into making the decision, and also it was a surprisingly long process given that its best doing it earlier in the pregnancy. Took about 2/3 weeks overall as 2 doctors had to agree and stuff.

Edit. Actually http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/foru...8&postcount=75

Do not click that link if you are easily upset, especially in matters like this as it is quite graphic for on here.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I'm not sure the argument against it is quite that it would be hard to give up the child...more along the lines of hard to go through 9 months of pregnancy (from my experience that is NOT easy at all) and then labour, and then to give the child up. I know we are more medically advanced today too but there is also still risks involved with labour and birth. I very nearly needed a blood transfusion with my latest child :S

A vast amount of the risk is BECAUSE of medical advancement, but that's another debate entirely . Anyway, I do understand that pregnancy takes a massive and permanent toll on the body, and I'm by no means saying that adoption should be a default. Just that I don't think many people even actually put any real thought into it. I don't think it's properly SUGGESTED as an alternative, to those who do feel strong enough to carry on with the pregnancy but don't feel able to care for a child. I don't think it's explained that a newborn being adopted into a good home is all but a certainty, and many think that the child would "just go into care". Basically, I think that anyone going to their GP to discuss an abortion should be given literature on adoption to read before they come to a final decision... but, they're not. In fact, very few questions are asked at all.

[Ninastar]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I do also wish that more people would consider adoption as an option. People often quote the "over-stretched care system" as a reason not to, but that is in fact only because of older children entering care. There is a HUGE demand (from infertile and same-sex couples) for adoption of newborn babies. I've heard people argue against it saying that it isn't fair because of how hard it would be for the mother to give up the child but... wtf? When the alternative is just killing it in the womb? Ummmm...

well said!

[joeysteele]

This is always a hard one for me to comment on as being Male,I accept it is easy for me to say this, that and the other as to the issue but never having to go through all the main trauma myself.

I have in the end voted wrong but it should still be the Mother's choice.

I would prefer it not to happen but accept in some situations,a decision may have to be made, at that point I would agree with and support the woman as to whatever her decision may be.

Some great posts on here as to this and all make good reasons either way.

[Livia]

I would never want to drive abortion into the backstreets where it was before it as legalised. I also believe every child should be a wanted child. We've already got thousands of unwanted and neglected children in care. People who spent time and energy campaigning against abortion might to better to raise their flag in that particular battle instead and make sure children who are already here are not pushed from pillar to post, unloved, unwanted and neglected.

As for the adoption solution... very few women choose that option, although it seems to be the one men support most. And it's not hard to see the reason why. And as for doing it for same sex and childless couples... if they really - really - want a child, there are enough unwanted children begging for someone to love them.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

A vast amount of the risk is BECAUSE of medical advancement, but that's another debate entirely . Anyway, I do understand that pregnancy takes a massive and permanent toll on the body, and I'm by no means saying that adoption should be a default. Just that I don't think many people even actually put any real thought into it. I don't think it's properly SUGGESTED as an alternative, to those who do feel strong enough to carry on with the pregnancy but don't feel able to care for a child. I don't think it's explained that a newborn being adopted into a good home is all but a certainty, and many think that the child would "just go into care". Basically, I think that anyone going to their GP to discuss an abortion should be given literature on adoption to read before they come to a final decision... but, they're not. In fact, very few questions are asked at all.

I think you're underestimating the thought most women put into having an abortion. I'm sure the vast majority consider every avenue before they make probably the toughest decision of their life. I'm sure there are very few women who don't look at every aspect.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by the truth

exactly, killing the baby is the cowards way out in a society that lacks the care , patience and compassion to simply build a better system that makes it easier for parents to have children and foster or adopt them where necessary. adoption is evil unless in cases of rape of serious health risks

Harsh words from someone who will never have to carry and deliver a baby but has so very much to say about it. I'd say the real coward's way out it to make someone pregnant and then leave her to get on with it.

It is not a baby at the point it's aborted, it's a foetus. Continually calling it "a baby" may be provocative but it isn't true.

[AnnieK]

I am pro choice.

I personally would never consider abortion unless it was absolutely medically advised. I spent many years going through fertility treatments unsuccessfully but would still not condemn anyone who considers abortion. It is the mother who has to go through with the pregnancy including the hormone driven feelings, the long and often excruciating labour to then be flooded with another swirl of hormones that make the most "ready" mother often turn into a gibbering wreck. If she does not feel up to that how she could go through it and give up her child is beyond me which is why I feel a lot of people dismiss adoption.

What also makes me very sad is the number of potential adopters who will only consider babies. The number of older children and sibling groups which are begging for forever homes is astonishing. Certainly the older children are often more affected by the circumstances they have lived through but surely they are as deserving of a loving family and I know had I not had my "miracle" baby I would have adopted and age wouldn't have been a huge issue for me.

[hijaxers]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I do also wish that more people would consider adoption as an option. People often quote the "over-stretched care system" as a reason not to, but that is in fact only because of older children entering care. There is a HUGE demand (from infertile and same-sex couples) for adoption of newborn babies. I've heard people argue against it saying that it isn't fair because of how hard it would be for the mother to give up the child but... wtf? When the alternative is just killing it in the womb? Ummmm...

Giving up a child - whether forced or a willing decision is something that truly does affect the rest of your life - it is not as simple as other members seem to think especially when plenty of adopted children have been placed with not very nice people ! You only have to watch families reunited to see the trauma and believe they only show the happy ones! I could go on about this subject forever having been forced by my family to have a child adopted ! Fortunately the last private adoption in my city before the law changed.
i do feel the truth is never black and white ! I just think is marvellous that kids these days are more in love with their phones than exploring what the other sex has to offer

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I'm not sure people are rushed into abortions, however the proper care is definitely not there.

Against my original judgement (I have written about this before on here anyway), here goes. I had an abortion at 15/16 years old after being spiked and ending up pregnant. I wrote a lengthy post about it a few years back but from what I remember it was quite graphic explaining exactly what happens exactly in an early abortion, so its pretty grim so I wont dig it up. However, long story short..I was told I would get to see a psychiatrist person to make sure I was making the decision for the right reasons and stuff before taking the first tablet. The day I went, the psychiatrist was off work..but they still went ahead and gave me the tablet anyway. I never felt rushed into making the decision, and also it was a surprisingly long process given that its best doing it earlier in the pregnancy. Took about 2/3 weeks overall as 2 doctors had to agree and stuff.

Edit. Actually http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/foru...8&postcount=75

Do not click that link if you are easily upset, especially in matters like this as it is quite graphic for on here.

It's for reasons like this it's impossible to ever make a decision either way, no 2 scenarios are ever identical and I would never judge anyone for doing what is right for them.
I think that the situation as it is in Ireland is draconian.

[hijaxers]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It's for reasons like this it's impossible to ever make a decision either way, no 2 scenarios are ever identical and I would never judge anyone for doing what is right for them.
I think that the situation as it is in Ireland is draconian.

I agree Irelands attitude should have been left in the dark ages - the sad history of whats happened in the past - to girls and boys should be enough to at least get people talking about changing the future:

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by GypsyGoth

Abortions for everybody!!! *point point*



Yay abortions!!

using my gifs

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by the truth

spoken like a truly ignorant person who doesnt care about the mass murder of millions of healthy babies, in addition to the pressure put on women to have abortions and the lack of time taken to offer them and the fathers time , counselling and support to show them all the options open to them, including adoption, shame on you

Shame on you for your wilfull ignorance and your continued misogyny. Once again, Embryos are not babies, they are a collection of non-sentient cells. They are about as close to being a baby as your fingernails are. Calling them babies just makes you sound like a fool.

Stop trying to sound like you care about the women in these situations, we all know that you don't. You have no understanding of this situation and it's obvious by how blindingly moronic your posts are.

[Anaesthesia]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Shame on you for your wilfull ignorance and your continued misogyny. Once again, Embryos are not babies, they are a collection of non-sentient cells. They are about as close to being a baby as your fingernails are. Calling them babies just makes you sound like a fool.

Stop trying to sound like you care about the women in these situations, we all know that you don't. You have no understanding of this situation and it's obvious by how blindingly moronic your posts are.

[Angelika]

Its a very complicated choice and issue.

Its should never to be used as contraception and always remembered that all surgery carries risk but that unregulated back-street abortions carried an even higher risk to life.

[Princess]

I am pro-choice but I do think it's more complicated than that. I'm not sure I could ever one, not unless the child was severely disabled. It's up to the mother and whether she feels she can support the baby and if she can't, then that's her choice and no one elses.

Abortion is illegal in Ireland and it infruriates me. Women can still get abortions but they have to fly to the UK to do it, so basically only people who can afford it can get an abortion. Women are always going to get abortions, they might as well have one safely.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Anaesthesia

I am an adoptee, so I guess I'm glad my mother didn't believe it was the right thing to do!

Saying that, I am 100% pro-choice, with more or less the provisos Livia has already expressed.

if it had been left to the devices of many on here you would have been killed in the womb and never had achance to live or get adopted. You need to seriously think long and hard about that monumental life or death fact

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I'm not sure people are rushed into abortions, however the proper care is definitely not there.

Against my original judgement (I have written about this before on here anyway), here goes. I had an abortion at 15/16 years old after being spiked and ending up pregnant. I wrote a lengthy post about it a few years back but from what I remember it was quite graphic explaining exactly what happens exactly in an early abortion, so its pretty grim so I wont dig it up. However, long story short..I was told I would get to see a psychiatrist person to make sure I was making the decision for the right reasons and stuff before taking the first tablet. The day I went, the psychiatrist was off work..but they still went ahead and gave me the tablet anyway. I never felt rushed into making the decision, and also it was a surprisingly long process given that its best doing it earlier in the pregnancy. Took about 2/3 weeks overall as 2 doctors had to agree and stuff.

Edit. Actually http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/foru...8&postcount=75

Do not click that link if you are easily upset, especially in matters like this as it is quite graphic for on here.

i agree the proper care isnt there, thats why we are the worst abortionists in the western world with over a million babie skilled off per 6 years, horrific...i think its 1 in 5 babies and murdered in the womb in this shameful country

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Braden

I don't think it's right per se, but there are circumstances where abortion is a rationalised thing to do (like most people have said, rape is one of them).

I think it comes down to the whole "who am I to tell someone what is right and wrong", if someone wants an abortion I would uncomfortable with even suggesting that they're wrong to do so.

maybe you should be uncomfortable suggesting theyre right to kill a baby

[the truth]

Originally Posted by LiamPRW

Please don't tell me i don't know what I'm talking about, that is beyond patronizing.
Yes, some people may live to regret it and some may feel pressurized by people to go through with an abortion, but that doesn't mean that it's a bad thing over all, some woman have abortions early on in their teenage years because they wouldn't be able to cope with a baby or they weren't supported by their family or the father, or they weren't financially stable, but in the future turn their life around and find that they could have dealt with keeping the baby.. but most of the time when someone has an abortion, at that time it would have been the right thing to do, for the woman and for the sake of the child that could have been.

complete and utter nonsense. the sake of the child that could have been? the child is dead , killed forever , silently temrinated and never given a split second of life on earth to fulfill their potential.