[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No way. Sure we've had issues with the banks and bail outs and that but we're clawing our way back again and getting on top of things. Things have improved majorly in the last 12 months in regards to work etc.

What do they mean by that statement anyway, Have you ever been to Ireland? Makes us sound like we're a third world country or something

Anyway, just because one country might be doing better than another doesn't mean you want to switch nationalities lol If Germany is doing better than England would the English all want to become German?

This is good Niamh! I'm still coming to stay there if we vote no on the 18th!

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Lee.

This is good Niamh! I'm still coming to stay there if we vote no on the 18th!

anytime

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

The truth is, there will be uncertainties were Scotland to be independent, not just for the Scots but also for the English,Welsh and those in Northern Ireland too.
The futures of all those Nations needs to be addressed if the Scots vote 'yes'.

However, Wales and Scotland particularly have had a pretty bad deal within the UK from successive govts.of both parties and even moreso from this coalition disaster we have had for the last 4+ years.

Fear of the unknown should not be barrier to taking the challenge.
The rest of Europe,other Nations too along with the USA would want Scotland to succeed if it said 'yes'.
I also firmly believe it would be in England's,Wales and N.Ireland's interests too to support and ensure the stability of Scotland being so close a neighbour.

The only person talking sense for me at present is Alex Salmond on this,he knows there are uncertainties and challenges ahead but he feels Scotland,no matter what govt. it chooses for itself can rise to that challenge.

All we hear from the no camp, is as he says negative statements and threat after threat.
I heard today that if the Scots vote yes, then in 2016 the Scots MPs elected to Westminster would be gone and there would have to be another election.
Nonsense, that will depend on the result of the 2015 election anyway.

If as the polls suggest,Labour were to win say a 40 overall majority,which is the present guide from the polls.
No further election would in fact be necessary,losing the Scots seats would reduce the Westminster parliament to 591 seats, If Labour had a 40 overall majority,losing the likely 42 Scottish MPs they had would still leave them with an overall majority
in double figures.
Likewise if the Conservative party scraped in by say a 5 to 10 overall majority then again no new election would be necessary as that overall majority would rise in Westminster.

Instead of harping on about all the negatives and things that may need to happen, the 'no' campaign should be spelling out exactly in clear detail all the new powers Scotland would actually get.
While similar,there are 3 varying degees of transfers of power on the table, now which one will 100% be given to the Scots,that we don't know as the 'no' campaign will not spell out the full detail..

I think Alex Salmond is well aware that Westminster 'will' have to work closely with an independent Scotland,no more walking over the Scots by Westminster but dealing on an equal basis with them.

I know this post appears to favour independence and maybe I have come round to thinking Scotland could do better on its own.
My view now however stems from what I believe has been a disastrous and negative 'no' campaign,that still appears to take the Scots for granted by talking 'at' them and not 'to' them.

The way for Westminster to help ensure financial stability for all is to say what they will likely be forced to say if Scotland votes 'yes' and that is, yes Scotland can operate the pound still.
It would be folly for Westminster to refuse and obstruct an independent Scotland doing so,that would cause massive problems for the citizens of the remaning original UK countries.

On that point,I really feel Alex Salmond has won the day and with the EU likely to do all it can to support an independent Scotland,it may well be that it is the bumbling, incompetent politicians we have been left with, that have the greater struggle after a 'yes' result..

Great points joey. the scots and nation of inventors and with great change and great problems you get great invention. Of course there will be problems to solve but that should never stop a country from striving to be fairer and more caring to its populace.

[Crimson Dynamo]

David Cameron, Nick Clegg and Ed Miliband are on a flying visit to Scotland today. Use this to highlight the clear choice we have next week - taking Scotland's future in Scotland hands, or leaving it in the hands of an out-of-touch Westminster.

"The Westminster parties have confirmed that a No vote won’t deliver a single new job-creating power or the protection we need for our NHS. Remind friends and family that only a Yes vote ensures:

Our NHS and other public services are completely protected from future cuts and NHS privatisation in England;

We get the job-creating powers we need;

Scotland will always get the governments we vote for.

Scotland is one of the very wealthiest countries in the world, which means we can choose independence with confidence. It also means that with a Yes, we can make sure our vast wealth delivers much more for the people who live here. This is a very powerful message for the final week of the campaign, so speak to as many people as possible."

-------


just got this via email

[the truth]

hopefully devo max will be enough. but are the tories really trying to lose scotland? their last ditch desperate attempts are all backfiring , the more tories they send last minute to jockland the more desperate they appear and the more it winds up the scots. the scots hate the tories with good reason. they destroyed their economy and many communities under thatcher. as in the north and throughout the welsh valleys, they detsroyed the steel works, the copper, the coal, the tin, even the lime quarries and all other industries. the stories i could tell you would make you cry. im sure you all know o people destroyed by thatcher flooding the coal mines , of the best coal in the world. compare it to belgian coal it takes 3 times longer to burn welsh coal as the seams are richer and way deeper like blaenau and hatfield


theyre rightly sick to death of westminster self serving politics which lets face it is a cesspit of lies deceit self serving tossers. the main issue is that london and the south will take care of its own before scotland and also theyre so far away from scotland they dont have an intricate knowledge and hands on approach to the changes that need to be made in scotland. the wealth in the south compared to the rest of the uk is disgusting. it shows the sheer gluttony of london when you consider, wales has only just hoted a sitting president for the first time ever ? how nuts is that. US presidents have been going to london for over 200 years.....this is one tiny example of the vast chasm between london and the rest of the uk. its got to stop. every region is as important as the other.

[arista]

[Don't destroy Britain just to give the 'effing Tories a kick'
PM Cameron close to tears in plea to save the Union.]


I say!
how nice of you to be using local lingo
PM


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...hare-debt.html

[lostalex]

maybe in a few years the rest of the UK will vote to join Scotland?

[Z]

I feel like I'm living in a cuckoo clock, the Yes campaign basically didn't have a leg to stand on all this time, they were fighting an uphill battle trying to convince the people of Scotland to dip a toe, then a leg, then their whole selves into the unknown and all the Better Together "campaign" had to do was not sling mud back at the Yes campaign, whose campaigning method of choice has been to try and make the No side look stupid - not only did they completely take the bait but they then sent Alistair Darling to try and make them look good in a televised debate and he took the bait on live TV and now they have "call me Dave" Cameron taking the bait 8 days before the referendum. I actually think the yes campaign might win now, and I would never have predicted that in a million years. It's not because the Yes lot have been particularly good, it's because the No lot have been spectacularly bad. I'm on the fence and in principle I think I'm still a no voter but I wouldn't really care what the result was either way anymore. I can't call it anymore. I think a marginal yes victory or a marginal no victory.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Z

I feel like I'm living in a cuckoo clock, the Yes campaign basically didn't have a leg to stand on all this time, they were fighting an uphill battle trying to convince the people of Scotland to dip a toe, then a leg, then their whole selves into the unknown and all the Better Together "campaign" had to do was not sling mud back at the Yes campaign, whose campaigning method of choice has been to try and make the No side look stupid - not only did they completely take the bait but they then sent Alistair Darling to try and make them look good in a televised debate and he took the bait on live TV and now they have "call me Dave" Cameron taking the bait 8 days before the referendum. I actually think the yes campaign might win now, and I would never have predicted that in a million years. It's not because the Yes lot have been particularly good, it's because the No lot have been spectacularly bad. I'm on the fence and in principle I think I'm still a no voter but I wouldn't really care what the result was either way anymore. I can't call it anymore. I think a marginal yes victory or a marginal no victory.

Why he is up there?
they hate being told what to do

[arista]

Live Debate on Ch4HDNews

its the under 20 year year olds
that can swing the results
many more young want the Yes vote


And is so great that some Scottish Labour
are now voting Yes.


Life In The Fast Lane

[joeysteele]

It is a pity that since David Cameron took the trouble to go up to Scotland that instead of preaching to invited/selected audiences and doing the rounds of the bigger businesses,he actually took the time to 'talk to' the ordinary citizens of Scotland.
Unbelievable how this PM treats 'ordinary' people of any nation.

[Northern Monkey]

Said on C4 that to go independant Scotland would need around Ł130 Billion in reserves,They actually have Ł15 Billion.They could try to join the EU and dip into their funds but it would take too long.Apparently.

[arista]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

It is a pity that since David Cameron took the trouble to go up to Scotland that instead of preaching to invited/selected audiences and doing the rounds of the bigger businesses,he actually took the time to 'talk to' the ordinary citizens of Scotland.
Unbelievable how this PM treats 'ordinary' people of any nation.

Yes and the Labour Leader
doing the same



Thats why a Live Debate
with the young on Ch4HDNews is better

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by arista

Yes and the Labour Leader
doing the same



Thats why a Live Debate
with the young on Ch4HDNews is better

No disagreement from me as to that but he has been round the streets a little more as has amazingly Nick Clegg,(never ceases to amaze me that Clegg dares to face any voters anywhere)..

David Cameron is however supposed the be the prime Minister of the whole UK and for me he should,instead of all these months sitting doing very little,have been fighting personally and doing more to protect the union.
Rather than be panicked into doing something at the last minute that again falls way short of what he needed to.

[Josy]

Originally Posted by Z

I feel like I'm living in a cuckoo clock, the Yes campaign basically didn't have a leg to stand on all this time, they were fighting an uphill battle trying to convince the people of Scotland to dip a toe, then a leg, then their whole selves into the unknown and all the Better Together "campaign" had to do was not sling mud back at the Yes campaign, whose campaigning method of choice has been to try and make the No side look stupid - not only did they completely take the bait but they then sent Alistair Darling to try and make them look good in a televised debate and he took the bait on live TV and now they have "call me Dave" Cameron taking the bait 8 days before the referendum. I actually think the yes campaign might win now, and I would never have predicted that in a million years. It's not because the Yes lot have been particularly good, it's because the No lot have been spectacularly bad. I'm on the fence and in principle I think I'm still a no voter but I wouldn't really care what the result was either way anymore. I can't call it anymore. I think a marginal yes victory or a marginal no victory.

You will care in the end because no matter what happens it's going to mean big changes for our country, atm the country is split down the middle and I just hope it can come back from that after this referendum, all I'm going to say is make your own decision, I have lost count of the amount of comments I have seen over the pst couple of weeks saying 'I'm not telling you how you should vote BUT' then go on to list reasons on why you should vote for what they think is right, so do your own research into things, you still have time and make sure you vote because every vote is extremely important.

[lostalex]

so when does Ireland get to have a referendum? or maybe we should just allow some parts of Scotland to become separate?

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Josy

You will care in the end because no matter what happens it's going to mean big changes for our country, atm the country is split down the middle and I just hope it can come back from that after this referendum, all I'm going to say is make your own decision, I have lost count of the amount of comments I have seen over the pst couple of weeks saying 'I'm not telling you how you should vote BUT' then go on to list reasons on why you should vote for what they think is right, so do your own research into things, you still have time and make sure you vote because every vote is extremely important.

I don't think the split is as bad as it seems. From what I've seen, people seem very able to discuss politics and independence and have it get heated, but then still be laughing and joking together when the topic changes to something else. Also... We're Scottish (and, after all, British) and therefore terminally accustomed to disappointment . Whichever side "wins", it's unlikely to spark riots, just a sense of "oh ffs. Oh well. Just have to make the best if it ". I mean... No one was jumping off bridges when the Tories got into power 4 years ago... And basically NO ONE wanted that.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by lostalex

so when does Ireland get to have a referendum? or maybe we should just allow some parts of Scotland to become separate?

The problem with ever trying to have a "proper" referendum in N.I (which I assume you mean, as R.O.I is already... well... a Republic...) is that the division is completely wrapped up in sectarianism. It could (and probably would) spill over into violence very quickly.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The problem with ever trying to have a "proper" referendum in N.I (which I assume you mean, as R.O.I is already... well... a Republic...) is that the division is completely wrapped up in sectarianism. It could (and probably would) spill over into violence very quickly.

No, i didn't mean the so-called Republic of Ireland, i mean All of Ireland, just like All of Scotland gets to vote...not just the parts that are pro Brritish, but the whole thing.

or should just SOME parts of Scotland then also get to vote for independence?

after this referendum should we then have a vote for just certain parts of Scotland to become their own republic?

[michael21]

Originally Posted by Josy

You will care in the end because no matter what happens it's going to mean big changes for our country, atm the country is split down the middle and I just hope it can come back from that after this referendum, all I'm going to say is make your own decision, I have lost count of the amount of comments I have seen over the pst couple of weeks saying 'I'm not telling you how you should vote BUT' then go on to list reasons on why you should vote for what they think is right, so do your own research into things, you still have time and make sure you vote because every vote is extremely important.

the whole of the uk should get to vote as it we affect some outside scotland i say feck off scotland england don't need you

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by michael21

the whole of the uk should get to vote as it we affect some outside scotland i say feck off scotland england don't need you

If England could vote for independence then, would you vote for England to become independent from the rest of the UK?

[the truth]

we wouldnt vote for independence in england because the majority is in the south and theyre wealthier than everywhere else so were happy with the status quo overall

[user104658]

Originally Posted by lostalex

No, i didn't mean the so-called Republic of Ireland, i mean All of Ireland, just like All of Scotland gets to vote...not just the parts that are pro Brritish, but the whole thing.

or should just SOME parts of Scotland then also get to vote for independence?

after this referendum should we then have a vote for just certain parts of Scotland to become their own republic?

R.O.I and N.I are not two parts of the same country, though...

Originally Posted by michael21

the whole of the uk should get to vote as it we affect some outside scotland i say feck off scotland england don't need you

The fact that David Cameron and the other big players in London are currently sweating, simpering and casually ****ing in their pants right now suggests that England DOES need Scotland... to stay as prosperous as it possibly can, at least.

Some might argue that that's because the two are "stronger together"... but given that Scotland only has 5 million people - less than 10% of the overall population - the cynic in me wonders if it might not be because Scotland is, in fact, far more resource-wealthy per head and is being sucked dry by a population-heavy, resource-scarce London...

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

R.O.I and N.I are not two parts of the same country, though...

they were once, and shouldn't they decide as a country.

[lostalex]

The irish should decide as a nation, with no british interference. All of Ireland.