[jaxie]

Juncker has given a speech and in it is pushing the need for military HQ and a European army. I find this idea disturbing. We have NATO and member states have their own forces. Why is a European army needed?

[arista]

With soon , no UK
and soon less USA help
he thinking much down the road

[Northern Monkey]

What were all the inners and EU politicians saying before BREXIT again?
"There will be no EU army".
Of course we all knew they were just waiting for the Brexit result before they went ahead.

[Livia]

It was a predicatable speech. Bash the UK for hate crimes against immigrants (even though no evidence has been produced yet that they actually were hate crimes); state categorically that hating other people is not the European way.... except WW2, obviously... and let's not talk about the rise of neo-Nazism in Germany and other countries. It's an exercise to demonstrate that the EU is still viable and to try to calm other countries who know damn well that if they had a referendum, it'd go the same way as the UK referendum.

And incidentally, who the **** voted to Juncker to speak for the whole of Europe? No one.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Livia

It was a predicatable speech. Bash the UK for hate crimes against immigrants (even though no evidence has been produced yet that they actually were hate crimes); state categorically that hating other people is not the European way.... except WW2, obviously... and let's not talk about the rise of neo-Nazism in Germany and other countries. It's an exercise to demonstrate that the EU is still viable and to try to calm other countries who know damn well that if they had a referendum, it'd go the same way as the UK referendum.

And incidentally, who the **** voted to Juncker to speak for the whole of Europe? No one.

[Kizzy]

They do need to galvanise as they can no longer trust their neighbours not to align with countries with appaling human rights records (as in you can no longer trust the English)
as more and more incidents of corruption are exposed it highlights just how undemocratic we are becoming.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Livia

It was a predicatable speech. Bash the UK for hate crimes against immigrants (even though no evidence has been produced yet that they actually were hate crimes); state categorically that hating other people is not the European way.... except WW2, obviously... and let's not talk about the rise of neo-Nazism in Germany and other countries. It's an exercise to demonstrate that the EU is still viable and to try to calm other countries who know damn well that if they had a referendum, it'd go the same way as the UK referendum.

And incidentally, who the **** voted to Juncker to speak for the whole of Europe? No one.

I have written LONG posts on this B.S. 'Brotherhood of Europe' crapola;from the French's LONG history of attacking legitimate British Imports, from Beef to Lamb to millions of gallons of wine, AND the poor lorry drivers hauling it, to the long entrenched, barely concealed, anti-British feelings of MOST of the EU Member States political leaders.

Your BRILLIANT post says it ALL.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

They do need to galvanise as they can no longer trust their neighbours not to align with countries with appaling human rights records (as in you can no longer trust the English)
as more and more incidents of corruption are exposed it highlights just how undemocratic we are becoming.

The 'ENGLISH'? This is THE UNITED KINGDOM or GREAT BRITAIN. AND one can CERTAINLY 'trust' the civilised, moderate, and BIG HEARTED 'English', FAR MORE, than one can trust most of the other countries in the world.

Corruption has ALWAYS been a part of ALL countries political systems - from the birth of democracy - but it is not as rife in THIS country as in most other countries of the world.

Personally, in my opinion, 'Human Rights' is a hackneyed little phrase which is all too often pulled out of too many 'Hats' like white Rabbits whenever anyone with an axe to grind against DEMOCRACY or GREAT BRITAIN needs any old reason to justify their stance.

I am sick of hearing and seeing the phrase.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

The 'ENGLISH'? This is THE UNITED KINGDOM or GREAT BRITAIN. AND one can CERTAINLY 'trust' the civilised, moderate, and BIG HEARTED 'English', FAR MORE, than one can trust most of the other countries in the world.

Corruption has ALWAYS been a part of ALL countries political systems - from the birth of democracy - but it is not as rife in THIS country as in most other countries of the world.

Personally, in my opinion, 'Human Rights' is a hackneyed little phrase which is all too often pulled out of too many 'Hats' like white Rabbits whenever anyone with an axe to grind against DEMOCRACY or GREAT BRITAIN needs any old reason to justify their stance.

I am sick of hearing and seeing the phrase.

I find the people who knock the UK the hardest are usually people who have little or no experience of anywhere else.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

The 'ENGLISH'? This is THE UNITED KINGDOM or GREAT BRITAIN. AND one can CERTAINLY 'trust' the civilised, moderate, and BIG HEARTED 'English', FAR MORE, than one can trust most of the other countries in the world.

Corruption has ALWAYS been a part of ALL countries political systems - from the birth of democracy - but it is not as rife in THIS country as in most other countries of the world.

Personally, in my opinion, 'Human Rights' is a hackneyed little phrase which is all too often pulled out of too many 'Hats' like white Rabbits whenever anyone with an axe to grind against DEMOCRACY or GREAT BRITAIN needs any old reason to justify their stance.

I am sick of hearing and seeing the phrase.

As in the English parliament, we have no idea just how overtly corrupt our govt is, however as Orgreave proved covertly there is a dark side to our 'democratic' establishment.
The Human Rights Act is legislation and as such voted and passed democratically.
It is fundamentally important.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

They do need to galvanise as they can no longer trust their neighbours not to align with countries with appaling human rights records (as in you can no longer trust the English)
as more and more incidents of corruption are exposed it highlights just how undemocratic we are becoming.

I'd be quite ashamed if I wrote that. It also sounds rather racist.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

As in the English parliament, we have no idea just how overtly corrupt our govt is, however as Orgreave proved covertly there is a dark side to our 'democratic' establishment.
The Human Rights Act is legislation and as such voted and passed democratically.
It is fundamentally important.

It's the British parliament, England is the only country in the union who has no assembly or parliament of its own.

You are very lucky to live in the UK there are much worse places in the world to live. In regard human rights try Zimbabwe, run by the Pope's special friend.

[joeysteele]

Well it is irrelevant now with the UK leaving the EU as to ourselves being part of it.

However I was never really against the idea in principle myself.
Depending that was,on the finer detail as to it, whatever that may have turned out to be.

Emotive issue it would have been,and I would understand the majority of others big reservations to it coming about but I would have likely supported the idea.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

They do need to galvanise as they can no longer trust their neighbours not to align with countries with appaling human rights records (as in you can no longer trust the English)
as more and more incidents of corruption are exposed it highlights just how undemocratic we are becoming.

More anti British rubbish.You think the EU are'nt corrupt in any way?Or that it's somehow democratic?The UK showed them what democracy was when we voted get out of their dictatorial organisation and it seems we've done it at the right time.

[anne666]

They couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery, let alone an army and what the hell will they screw up trying to run it? Proved alarmingly well by the migrant chaos and deaths they've allowed and encouraged. If they can't simply chuck excessive amounts of money at their problems they're lost.
Junket's ramblings on this began early last year. France and the UK weren't in favour. Merkel tried to extort Cameron's agreement as part of his EU renegotiations. After her migrant madness last September they were wetting their knickers about an army as some kind of external border protection. When they were in it up to their inept necks, having done sod all to protect the borders or deal properly with the crisis.
Not to worry, Germany's now got what they wanted, lot's of young fit and fertile newcomers to help their labour shortages and low birth rate.
I'm not sure what they think an army will do at the borders, Frontex is a hopeless sick joke, but I doubt if they can think quite that far outside of their box, so who knows. The first thing they did last year was pick out a colour for the army uniform, a fetching shade of blue and nothing else as far as I know. A hugely important decision which no doubt needed 678930 committee meetings and loadsamoney thrown at them as usual. No doubt it's a wonderful idea for profligate federalists and their fantasy future but bugger all else, especially if it's under EU control.

[bots]

An EU army makes more sense than it did now that the UK is leaving. The majority of EU countries don't have much protection and Germany isn't allowed to do anything. Its irrelevant to us now anyway, but Junkers opinion never has mattered.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

More anti British rubbish.You think the EU are'nt corrupt in any way?Or that it's somehow democratic?The UK showed them what democracy was when we voted get out of their dictatorial organisation and it seems we've done it at the right time.

Preach that truth brother.

[Northern Monkey]

A brilliant reply to this speech on the issue from the man who gave us our escape from this dictatorship

Youtube video

[Johnnyuk123]

Didn't the EU remain camp clearly state that there is NEVER going to be an EU Army?
I think an explanation would be nice. thanks.

[the truth]

the eu is simply frightening, far moreso than the usa

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

I'd be quite ashamed if I wrote that. It also sounds rather racist.

Can I not have an opinion on the my country of birth? I don't feel proud to be British at the moment with the current state of affairs... I am just not one for blind faith, I make no apologies for your over sensitivity ... this 'we can do no wrong' attitude is ridiculous... we have made mistakes, this infantalisation of the masses towards unwavering devotion to the supreme leaders is frankly macabre.

I'll thank you not to stare name calling please, I am not 'racist' as English is not a race.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

More anti British rubbish.You think the EU are'nt corrupt in any way?Or that it's somehow democratic?The UK showed them what democracy was when we voted get out of their dictatorial organisation and it seems we've done it at the right time.

I am entitled to my opinion we still for now have relatively free speech therefore as a citizen I'm free to express myself... We are not any other country and I'm not a citizen of another country either therefore any comparison is invalid.
Dictatorial organisation?...... Hmmmm Hinkleys back on, can anyone assist us being railroaded into that?

Democracy my arse...:/

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Can I not have an opinion on the my country of birth? I don't feel proud to be British at the moment with the current state of affairs... I am just not one for blind faith, I make no apologies for your over sensitivity ... this 'we can do no wrong' attitude is ridiculous... we have made mistakes, this infantalisation of the masses towards unwavering devotion to the supreme leaders is frankly macabre.

I'll thank you not to stare name calling please, I am not 'racist' as English is not a race.

I am a mix of all the Countries of these islands, a mix of Scots, Irish and English as I was born in Worcestershire.
All I would say is I can well understand the frustrations and annoyance you are feeling currently.
Except mine is not with Britain as a whole,I am very proud to be British but rather less so being English.
With recent events.

What I am witnessing as to some of the most vile prejudices, from admittedly a likely minority but that's not certain,crawling out the woodwork and showing itself more publicly here in England recently now.
Certainly makes me feel sad and even ashamed at times of this particular part of the UK.
Like it clearly has yourself Kizzy.

I still would say I see some merit in this EU idea, whether it ever comes to fruition is another matter.
Anyway we do not now have to be any part of it now at all or even consider same.
Then again I am a supporter of the EU and will stay so, so I would have been likely warmer to this idea than most others.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Can I not have an opinion on the my country of birth? I don't feel proud to be British at the moment with the current state of affairs... I am just not one for blind faith, I make no apologies for your over sensitivity ... this 'we can do no wrong' attitude is ridiculous... we have made mistakes, this infantalisation of the masses towards unwavering devotion to the supreme leaders is frankly macabre.

I'll thank you not to stare name calling please, I am not 'racist' as English is not a race.

English most certainly is a race. Not feeling over sensitive at all just surprised by how disloyal to your country you sound if you are English. If you are from another part of the union then you seem to have a real issue with the English. There isn't a nation on earth that can do no wrong but living in this country is pretty damn good and allows you freedoms you wouldn't get in other places. Freedom it sounds like you are taking very much for granted. The infantalisation is all in your head.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I am a mix of all the Countries of these islands, a mix of Scots, Irish and English as I was born in Worcestershire.
All I would say is I can well understand the frustrations and annoyance you are feeling currently.
Except mine is not with Britain as a whole,I am very proud to be British but rather less so being English.
With recent events.

What I am witnessing as to some of the most vile prejudices, from admittedly a likely minority but that's not certain,crawling out the woodwork and showing itself more publicly here in England recently now.
Certainly makes me feel sad and even ashamed at times of this particular part of the UK.
Like it clearly has yourself Kizzy.

I still would say I see some merit in this EU idea, whether it ever comes to fruition is another matter.
Anyway we do not now have to be any part of it now at all or even consider same.
Then again I am a supporter of the EU and will stay so, so I would have been likely warmer to this idea than most others.

Well there at least two cases on the news that might or might not be vile prejudices as they haven't actually mentioned any evidence they were race related apart from the victim being polish. Unfortunately crime happens every day and it isn't always racially motivated no matter where the people originate from or indeed anything to with the EU. Stephan Lawrence's murder was a vile prejudice for instance and deserves justice.

If you are English hating over the EU referendum, don't forget to include the Welsh, and the 39% of Scots who voted to leave plus the NIs who voted same. Or it sounds like you are just picking on one race. Which makes you guilty of the very thing that is upsetting you.