[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Livia

It will do you good, then, to experience life outside the UK. See how ashamed you feel when you see how other countries operate. Until then it might be good to remember that this country is full of wonderful, caring, committed people from all parties and backgrounds. Imagining one group of people is evil incarnate makes me think you've never experienced real evil in any form.

Charming I'm sure.
I've seen a fair amount elsewhere in the World and much I detest there as much as I detest the robbing from and creation of rotten stressful testing against the sick and disabled by this govt.elected by some voters in the UK.
I have been across to Ireland many times this year and all I've seen thus far I like.

Furthermore you yourself do a fair bit of attacking whole groups of people such as the far left for example.

Finally to importantly clarify.
I said '' it almost makes me ashamed to be British'', I never actually stated I was.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by the truth

Labour treated the sick the elderly and disabled far far worse.....1000 people starved to death in stafford hospital alone....we had the filthiest hospitals in europe with endless mrsa....trebled the wages of the bosses, the trust management boards and bankrupted the public purses as they always do....then send thousands of soldiers under equipped to an illegal war and did nothing for injured soldiers, nothing about military hospitals....the endless cover ups of endless abuses in care homes and nursing homes and hospitals.....how can labour pretend to care more about public servives, when it is them that frivollously waste all the public money? bunch of hypocrites

The Labour Party also made the decision to invade Iraq and lied about why, but those that have shouted the loudest on here about the British government invading Iraq and lying about it plan to vote for Labour.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

I know

Oh I'm off to London actually for the weekend in June

Don't be bringing your Irish problems over with you

[Livia]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Charming I'm sure.
I've seen a fair amount elsewhere in the World and much I detest there as much as I detest the robbing from and creation of rotten stressful testing against the sick and disabled by this govt.elected by some voters in the UK.*
I have been across to Ireland many times this year and all I've seen thus far I like.

Furthermore you yourself do a fair bit of attacking whole groups of people such as the far left for example.

Finally to importantly clarify.
I said '' it almost makes me ashamed to be British'', I never actually stated I was.

*Elected by the majority of voters, and if you think they're all wealthy and healthy you're mistaken.

I actually said recently on this forum that I don't hate Corbyn, I think he has honourable intentions. I have never seen anyone on the left do anything but attack anyone who is not in agreement with them.

Yes, this government hasn't been fair with a lot of its policies, I'm not sure that's a reason to leave the country and hang your head with shame over your born nationality. But hey, that's your call.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Don't be bringing your Irish problems over with you

Listen to English Cherie

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Livia

*Elected by the majority of voters, and if you think they're all wealthy and healthy you're mistaken.

I actually said recently on this forum that I don't hate Corbyn, I think he has honourable intentions. I have never seen anyone on the left do anything but attack anyone who is not in agreement with them.

Yes, this government hasn't been fair with a lot of its policies, I'm not sure that's a reason to leave the country and hang your head with shame over your born nationality. But hey, that's your call.

elected with only 37% of all who voted is not a majority,it is the most votes for one Party but not the majority.
It is even more far away from being elected with a majority of votes from all eligible to vote.

Cut out the nastiness too,I am leaving the UK with my Mother who is full Irish and her ancestry is Irish, following the unexpected death of my Father last year.
No need for your thoroughly wrongly assumed jibes as to my reasons for carrying on my life elsewhere.

[smudgie]

I am oldish. ( not a pensioner)
I am disabled.
We are now a none working family.
I claimed PIP and was treat wonderfully, from my daughter making the first phone call to the lovely lady who came to visit me, absolutely no complaints.

Now I don't doubt that some people have it rough, and some appear to go through the mill from what has been said on here, but I have yet to meet anybody who has in my area ( that I know, obviously)
It must be down to the luck of the draw I guess.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

elected with only 37% of all who voted is not a majority,it is the most votes for one Party but not the majority.
It is even more far away from being elected with a majority of votes from all eligible to vote.

Cut out the nastiness too,I am leaving the UK with my Mother who is full Irish and her ancestry is Irish, following the unexpected death of my Father last year.
No need for your thoroughly wrongly assumed jibes as to my reasons for carrying on my life elsewhere.

It is considerably more than everyone else, therefore they are running the country. Thats democracy.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Cherie

I tend to agree, no where is perfect and there are a lot of things the UK gets right.

That's more or less what I've been trying to say with all my personal ramblings. There are opportunities and we are lucky. If you start on a violent council estate and your parents have problems you don't have to stay there. You can work to move on in the world.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

The Labour Party also made the decision to invade Iraq and lied about why, but those that have shouted the loudest on here about the British government invading Iraq and lying about it plan to vote for Labour.

The Labour introduced university fees. This is something I can never forgive. I believe everyone should be entitled to a free education.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by the truth

It is considerably more than everyone else, therefore they are running the country. Thats democracy.

Only around 7% more,hardly an actual votes cast ringing endorsement,even in a well passed its use by date electoral system.
Under PR 38% would not have any one Party governing alone.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by jaxie

That's more or less what I've been trying to say with all my personal ramblings. There are opportunities and we are lucky. If you start on a violent council estate and your parents have problems you don't have to stay there. You can work to move on in the world.

of course but if you're raised thinking that's the way to live then most people will grow up to be the same. Children 9 out of 10 times are lead by example and i guess are in a sense "brain washed" into believing and thinking the same way to those who bring them up and who they are influenced by

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Only around 7% more,hardly an actual votes cast ringing endorsement,even in a well passed its use by date electoral system.
Under PR 38% would not have any one Party governing alone.

Sorry but get fed-up with sore losers keep quoting percentages on vote results. They would be singing a different tune if they had won by the same majority. It makes no odds - leavers won.

If the stupid couldn't be bothered to vote or people cast a protest vote that was not a true vote, they only have themselves to blame and have to live with it. Consequences! They can't then cry like a baby when their own stupidity blows up in their faces.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

elected with only 37% of all who voted is not a majority,it is the most votes for one Party but not the majority.
It is even more far away from being elected with a majority of votes from all eligible to vote.

Cut out the nastiness too,I am leaving the UK with my Mother who is full Irish and her ancestry is Irish, following the unexpected death of my Father last year.
No need for your thoroughly wrongly assumed jibes as to my reasons for carrying on my life elsewhere.

It was more votes than any other one party. Wasn't it.

I am not being nasty. You'd know if I was... and my post would have been removed. I am very sorry that your family has suffered a loss... but I wasn't to know that.

I hope you find the Utopia you're looking for in Ireland.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Only around 7% more,hardly an actual votes cast ringing endorsement,even in a well passed its use by date electoral system.
Under PR 38% would not have any one Party governing alone.

If Labour had that result you'd think it a victory.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

of course but if you're raised thinking that's the way to live then most people will grow up to be the same. Children 9 out of 10 times are lead by example and i guess are in a sense "brain washed" into believing and thinking the same way to those who bring them up and who they are influenced by

It's weird though, while you are right for the most part, I can think of several others who moved on like me and my accountant friend did from our estate. So maybe more do move on than we think.

[the truth]

let me think what a labour uk would look like hmm.....mountains of debts, over paid unsackable public sector bosses, endless waste on the roads , more filthy mismanaged hospitals, endless abuse cover ups, another collapsed housing bubble, dismantling of our nuclear subs, open borders, sell out to europe, abandonment of the industries, breeding for benefits culture, loss of civil liberties and free speech, mindless political correctness, spin doctors in the cabinet and of course illegal wars..all this and dianne abbott calling everyone who doesnt agree with her a racist ...bliss

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by jaxie

It's weird though, while you are right for the most part, I can think of several others who moved on like me and my accountant friend did from our estate. So maybe more do move on than we think.

Well yeah it's not always the case but I think it is mostly. I think as well alot has to do with who you end being friends with and what way they think

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by the truth

let me think what a labour uk would look like hmm.....mountains of debts, over paid unsackable public sector bosses, endless waste on the roads , more filthy mismanaged hospitals, endless abuse cover ups, another collapsed housing bubble, dismantling of our nuclear subs, open borders, sell out to europe, abandonment of the industries, breeding for benefits culture, loss of civil liberties and free speech, mindless political correctness, spin doctors in the cabinet and of course illegal wars..all this and dianne abbott calling everyone who doesnt agree with her a racist ...bliss

Like a horror movie.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Livia

If Labour had that result you'd think it a victory.

Totally wrong again and if you read my posts over the years on here,I have endlessly moaned that it should not have been possible that Labour was able to take power alone,after only getting around 35% of the vote in 2005.

Nice try again from you but way off the mark as to justified assumptions as to myself again.

[DemolitionRed]

New Labour started tuition fees.
New Labour went to war in Iraq
New Labour scammed this country like the good neo-liberals they were and in doing so, set a fantastic precedence for a newly ellected Tory government.

Fortunately we no longer have a 'New Labour'... nothing like.

As for poverty. Modern day poverty looks somewhat different to the poverty our parents or grandparents had to endure. Its almost impossible to compare, especially in many boroughs of London where the average house price is Łhalf a million and the average rent of a one bed flat is probably more than you earn in a month unless your a professional.

If you bought your council house/flat in London back in the 70s-90s you will of paid a pittance for it. If you sold that same house/flat now and moved up north, you could afford a grand house standing in its own acres. Anyone who purchased property during the 70s 80s is laughing now but anyone who doesn't yet own property, will never (unless they inherit) have the same luck you had.

If salaries had risen along with house prices, a green collar worker would be earning Ł88k a year now instead of the pathetic Ł14k. Older people will try and tell you its all subjective... its not!

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Sorry but get fed-up with sore losers keep quoting percentages on vote results. They would be singing a different tune if they had won by the same majority. It makes no odds - leavers won.

If the stupid couldn't be bothered to vote or people cast a protest vote that was not a true vote, they only have themselves to blame and have to live with it. Consequences! They can't then cry like a baby when their own stupidity blows up in their faces.

It's the last GE in discussion not brexit.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

It's the last GE in discussion not brexit.

It's all linked if you hadn't got that yet.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Livia

It will do you good, then, to experience life outside the UK. See how ashamed you feel when you see how other countries operate. Until then it might be good to remember that this country is full of wonderful, caring, committed people from all parties and backgrounds. Imagining one group of people is evil incarnate makes me think you've never experienced real evil in any form.

Everything good has or is being cut and anything else of any value so your 'never had it so good' spiel is pointless.

I will remind you of the words of Anurin Bevan NEVER have they been more apt.

'No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin.'

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It's all linked if you hadn't got that yet.

No, you are just so preoccupied with brexit you relate it to every topic.