[user104658]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I don't feel the need to take myself so seriously. This is a forum, somewhere to express our opinions on, amongst other things, politics. I'm not trying to kid myself i am writing a piece for The Times.

You didn't "write" anything , you linked to a crappy tabloid confirmation bias piece. However, I likewise was kidding myself when I imagined that you might actually have read anything other than a crappy tabloid confirmation bias piece

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

You didn't "write" anything , you linked to a crappy tabloid confirmation bias piece. However, I likewise was kidding myself when I imagined that you might actually have read anything other than a crappy tabloid confirmation bias piece

You were as that is not what I come on here for. If you do, good luck to you.

I find you quite a contradiction - strongly 'left' in most of your opinions on here but quite 'right' when it comes to judging others on what you perceive their intellectual capacity to be. You seem to consider yourself a cut above in that area. Are 'thick' people not allowed an opinion in your opinion?

[Shaun]

He has some fine points but they're points that're routinely made. And seem to be falling on deaf ears because there's cuts to pretty much everything that's left the police, counter-terrorism units, border patrols all vastly understaffed and underfunded. He says that more needs to be done by Muslims in Britain and yet this instance - the MEN bombing - appears to be a prime example of a failure to take citizens' concerns seriously.

Whilst, yes, there are certainly pockets of communities in the UK that have become isolated from British values, both sides are guilty of propagating "us and them" rhetoric. One side because it defies certain interpretations of Islam, another because they're "brown and funny-smelling" or whatever.

I'm not sure if anything can be done with city areas that wouldn't draw allusions to ethnic cleansing and I'm not sure forcibly changing who gets to be Imam and who doesn't would have any better or worse effects. Education seems the easiest answer and yet the least immediately gratifying.

[longstar]

my view is that the military and Intelligence organisations have been wasting there time and resources in Afghanistan, when the enemy is on are streets, and there is a hell more that just 3.000 terrorists in this country, the government will never tell you the real number because it will cause a huge panic in the country, and the ordinary man and woman will take the law into there own hands, and you will end up with blood on the streets, and remember that politician's have said that we have to get used to it because its part of are life now, and that means, let it go on, we will do nothing about it, so you can expect a future in every day of every week where you will get suicide bombings, car bombings, isis fighters killing people in shopping malls, markets, sports stadiums, music arena's, and even villages are not safe, even more children will be killed so the warning signs where already there.

[the truth]

Not all muslims are terrorists, but nearly all terrorists are muslim

[JTM45]

Originally Posted by the truth

Not all muslims are terrorists, but nearly all terrorists are muslim

Highly original.

There's nothing like constructive discussion and that's nothing like constructive discussion!

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I Agree NM. If the Muslim community want to be a real and valued part of British society they need to be involved in rooting out the extremists. They need to demonstrate their disdain for the Jihadist mindset by words and actions. One without the other doesn't count for much.

If we are all in this together than we all need to be in this together. Platitudes will not suffice.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...-a7757726.html

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...-a7757726.html

I have seen that Kizzy and, like many I'm sure, am glad to see this, and am disgusted it doesn't appear to have been acted upon - but I hope some lessons are learned from this.

However it is the only case that we are aware of I believe. Many more Muslims need to be doing the same thing.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...-a7757726.html

The problem we face is, many newspapers don't want to print this stuff. When Muslims speak out, the only people who hear them are the people who read papers like the Independent or the Guardian.

Its a sad world when we find our nation turning on an entire people because what they read encourages them to believe Muslims are doing nothing and Muslims are potentially evil. Its a very deliberate push on mass hysteria and hate.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I have seen that Kizzy and, like many I'm sure, am glad to see this, and am disgusted it doesn't appear to have been acted upon - but I hope some lessons are learned from this.

However it is the only case that we are aware of I believe. Many more Muslims need to be doing the same thing.

Yes this is the only case that has so far come to light, how are we to believe this is an isolated incident? It has been stated by those in our public services how cuts have stretched counter terrorism measures and community policing.

'Austerity' ( bombing campaigns) have taken the funds desperately needed to fight home grown terrorism since 2010, it is our govt that have failed to protect us even though they have been well aware of the dangers of radicalisation since 2005.

Your view that 'more Muslims need to be doing the same thing' what thing?... Do you think that every Muslim family in the UK is complacent about the terror threat that they have jihadists living next door but just keep shtum?

https://www.thecanary.co/2017/05/27/...atching-video/

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Chewy

This latest terrorist, Twatface McGee, was reported by his mosque a number of times to MI5. His friends and some youth workers also reported him.

There you go, I don't know what else they're supposed to do if that's the case

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by the truth

Not all muslims are terrorists, but nearly all terrorists are muslim

Not all men are are serial killers, but nearly all serial killers are men .........

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Yes this is the only case that has so far come to light, how are we to believe this is an isolated incident? It has been stated by those in our public services how cuts have stretched counter terrorism measures and community policing.

'Austerity' ( bombing campaigns) have taken the funds desperately needed to fight home grown terrorism since 2010, it is our govt that have failed to protect us even though they have been well aware of the dangers of radicalisation since 2005.

Your view that 'more Muslims need to be doing the same thing' what thing?... Do you think that every Muslim family in the UK is complacent about the terror threat that they have jihadists living next door but just keep shtum?

https://www.thecanary.co/2017/05/27/...atching-video/

We don't know though do we. You think they don't, I have my doubts and don't really believe the majority do.

What we do know is that many Muslim communities are very close-knit and keep to themselves. They don't integrate well. That makes people question them. The emphasis is not on just us - it is on Muslims as well.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Not all men are are serial killers, but nearly all serial killers are men .........

When I think of terrorism I am as likely to think of right wing extremists as Muslim, Anders Breivik, Thomas Muir and Jeremy Joseph Christian ( what an unfortunate name)

[Kizzy]

More food for thought...

https://www.indy100.com/article/whit...-years-7761101

[DemolitionRed]

The thing is, Muslims integrate well in the community. Unlike some religions who keep themselves very much to themselves, none British Muslims embrace a lot of Britishness and most British Muslims are proud of being British.

By constantly sowing that seed of fear, we are quickly growing into a nation of hate and animosity. Imagine being born in a country where you know you're not wanted. We need to imagine what it must be like walking in their shoes. If I were living in a country where 50% of its citizens saw me as a threat, I'd be concerned. I would probably try and lay low and I'd eventually become bitter.

Sadly, this unfair and unjust reaction towards Muslims will close integration down and push Muslims into closed communities. We have to ask ourselves- Are Muslims more likely to radicalise if they have been shown a lot of hatred, not just by the right wing brigade but by granny at the corner shop? Because if the answer is 'yes', we need to stop and start taking more responsibility before all hell brakes loose.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

More food for thought...

https://www.indy100.com/article/whit...-years-7761101

Thanks for pointing that out.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

The thing is, Muslims integrate well in the community. Unlike some religions who keep themselves very much to themselves, none British Muslims embrace a lot of Britishness and most British Muslims are proud of being British.

By constantly sowing that seed of fear, we are quickly growing into a nation of hate and animosity. Imagine being born in a country where you know you're not wanted. We need to imagine what it must be like walking in their shoes. If I were living in a country where 50% of its citizens saw me as a threat, I'd be concerned. I would probably try and lay low and I'd eventually become bitter.

Sadly, this unfair and unjust reaction towards Muslims will close integration down and push Muslims into closed communities. We have to ask ourselves- Are Muslims more likely to radicalise if they have been shown a lot of racial hatred, not just by the right wing brigade but by granny at the corner shop? Because if the answer is 'yes', we need to stop and start taking more responsibility before all hell brakes loose.

For the majority It isn't about race so constantly trying to imply it is, is in itself inflammatory and smacks of an agenda in my opinion.

It is about a prehistoric religion that is known for its many dubious practices and very poor treatment of women in an otherwise modern world. It is about its blatant advertisement of that prehistoric and inhuman belief system on the streets of the West with no regard or respect for the indiginous population, as you well know.

Lack of respect begets lack of respect. It is as simple as that.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

For the majority It isn't about race so constantly trying to imply it is, is in itself inflammatory and smacks of an agenda in my opinion.

It is about a prehistoric religion that is known for its many dubious practices and very poor treatment of women in an otherwise modern world. It is about its blatant advertisement of that prehistoric and inhuman belief system on the streets of the West with no regard or respect for the indiginous population, as you well know.

Lack of respect begets lack of respect. It is as simple as that.

So your issue is with Muslims in general then not extremists?... Ok, I can't be bothered with this debate again.

[DemolitionRed]

I should of known! I mean, the thread title is "We are creating a vacuum which allows radicals to fill the gap" Instead of "are we creating a vacuum which allows radicals to fill the gap?". It was an absolute before it even got discussed... waste of time!

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

For the majority It isn't about race so constantly trying to imply it is, is in itself inflammatory and smacks of an agenda in my opinion.

It is about a prehistoric religion that is known for its many dubious practices and very poor treatment of women in an otherwise modern world. It is about its blatant advertisement of that prehistoric and inhuman belief system on the streets of the West with no regard or respect for the indiginous population, as you well know.

Lack of respect begets lack of respect. It is as simple as that.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

So your issue is with Muslims in general then not extremists?... Ok, I can't be bothered with this debate again.

It was clearly in response to a post that was being intentionally inflammatory, in my opinion, and implying any distrust of Muslims is about racism - it isn't. I don't trust white poligimous religious cults in America for example where fifty year old men marry under-age girls so what does that make me then in your opinion then.

This lack of acknowledgement of why people feel this way and constantly trying to state it is racism is a diversion tactic and a big part of the problem. As long as people continue do this things won't change.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It was clearly in response to a post that was being intentionally inflammatory, in my opinion, and implying any distrust of Muslims is about racism - it isn't. I don't trust white poligimous religious cults in America for example where fifty year old men marry under-age girls so what does that make me then in your opinion then.

This lack of acknowledgement of why people feel this way and constantly trying to state it is racism is a diversion tactic and a big part of the problem. As long as people continue do this things won't change.

Would you have worded your post any different to anyone else, Why?

If they are your views and that's how you feel then surely that applies across the board?...

Can you now see though why occasionally people can consider what you say prejudiced? Anyhow I don't want to be drawn into any cyclical debates about religion so I'll bow out.

The thread title suggests this is an issue regarding radicals, if you had a different agenda you should maybe have made that clearer.