[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

But you have only been called racist on threads where you have done that. To my knowledge, you have NOT been called racist for simply posting arguments against immigration / religion etc. People have strongly disagreed with your views on those threads and questioned why you are so fearful, but no one has shouted "hey that's racist!". Except on threads where you have shown baseless racial stereotyping / made assumptions based on race.

Can you actually show any examples of times that you or anyone else has actually been accused of racism for questioning immigration? You keep saying that it happens, but I've yet to see even one example.

I know it has happened from one or two individuals at least, many times, and others too have commented. What I will not do is trawl through posts to prove it to you or anyone else making such allegations.

I don't need to - those that know - know, those that claim they don't know have conveniently short memories. Maybe such people should do the leg-work before being so quick to label - but we all know why they do that.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I know it has happened from one or two individuals at least, many times, and others too have commented. What I will not do is trawl through posts to prove it to you or anyone else making such allegations.

I don't need to - those that know - know, those that claim they don't know have conveniently short memories. Maybe such people should do the leg-work before being so quick to label - but we all know why they do that.

I know you have been called racist in the past, and I can accept that it might sometimes be a snap judgement and probably never a helpful place to go (though no more than any of the other name calling), but you specifically keep making the claim that you have been called racist for being "against mass immigration", which I just don't think is true. Several people on here are against mass immigration... I'd go so far as to say that MOST people are against the idea of limitless immigration and support sensible migration policies, and I genuinely can't imagine a time when this has ever been labelled racist. It's misrepresentative to the point that there's no point even trying to sort out this whole "name calling mess" until there can be some sort of consensus on what has actually happened in the past.

Having given it some thought; I think it would probably be a good idea for TiBB (the debates section, anyway) to have a flat out policy against people being "branded as anything" at this point because it is a waste of time all round... but that is --- if and only if --- that's a bilateral thing that everyone adheres to. Which means... no more "PC gone mad", no more "PC brigade", no more "Stupid lefties", no more "snowflakes". "Who Started It" doesn't really matter; if it's going to stop, it has to stop all round, and there has to be at least some acknowledgement of the reasons for it starting in the first place... i.e. being totally against immigration is fine, so long as you're thoughtful, level-headed and clear when outlining the reasons for it, because that's the only place anyone has a problem.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I know it has happened from one or two individuals at least, many times, and others too have commented. What I will not do is trawl through posts to prove it to you or anyone else making such allegations.

I don't need to - those that know - know, those that claim they don't know have conveniently short memories. Maybe such people should do the leg-work before being so quick to label - but we all know why they do that.

There's no denying it, Brillo. Anyone not left of centre has been sniped at by someone on the Left... and Brexit just added fuel to the flames. There's not much impartiality on here, and reacting just gets you infracted and banned. But don't think that others haven't noticed your treatment.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

There's no denying it, Brillo. Anyone not left of centre has been sniped at by someone on the Left... and Brexit just added fuel to the flames. There's not much impartiality on here, and reacting just gets you infracted and banned. But don't think that others haven't noticed your treatment.

Are you genuinely trying to suggest that those on here who are right of centre are innocent of "sniping at people"? You're literally sniping at people... in this very post... come on.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

What hatred? There you go again with the hate. What are my views exactly - that I have issues with mass immigration and the wearing of Burkhas in Britain- what a hateful person that makes me. I shoud be strung up! What exactly have I said that deserves ‘anything more’?

‘Prejudices are prejudices, but peoples’ opinions are not prejudices just because you want them to be. That you think you can rationalise your hatefulness against a group of people behind some false prejudice label is disgusting and goes against every principle you claim to uphold.

Just because you have come to a conclusion on a group of people does not make it a universal truth. Closing the windows of discussion and opening a window of blind hate is prejudice in itself. And that is exactly the type of mentality that enabled people to behave so terribly to other groups in the past, be they African Americans, gays Jews, etc’.

Not my words - but so very true. Your opinions are not fact because you say they are and do not therefore justify your actions. You love to take the moral high ground and put labels on others in an attempt to shut down opinions to your views. Prejudice exists in all shapes and sizes but you attach that label to others in your futile attempt to control their opinions, or at least the expression of said opinions. It makes you no better and no different to what you accuse them off. So carry on revelling in the illusion of moral superiority - as it is just that an illusion.

For the love of ****ing God, Brillo. Read my post, read it properly. Don't just zero in on one word and make assumptions about the rest because you've completely shown yourself up here.

People who have spoken out against racism, Homophobia, sexism and equality have faced the consequences of doing so for years. People have been killed for their views by others wanting to hold on to their hatred. Is that not enough for you?

Unless you've killed people for speaking out against inequality then does this sentence apply to you? Obviously it doesn't. You act like you are the only person to ever face 'consequences' for your views (Your quote 'it's about time that people on both sides face consequences'), I'm saying that people have been killed for speaking out about racism and homophobia and the like, people have died to try to right these wrongs and you are pretending that it didn't happen just because you can't deal with any accusations of racism whether it's aimed at you or anyone else.

Again, I'm going to link the following thread where people did accuse you of racism.

http://www.thisisbigbrother.com/foru...sh+dishes+html

You saw a name and a boy with a brown face and you instantly made disparaging assumptions about him and his mother's lives and values. If somebody is going to use that point as an argument to say you have racist tendencies then that's down to them, it's their opinion to do so.

It's down to you to try to combat those accusations, to try to prevent people from speaking their opinions, you are trying to silencing them. Something you often feel like you are victim of yet it doesn't stop you doing so to others.

I think your problem with this comes down to your old issue of not really understanding the difference between a fact or an opinion unless it's signposted for you. If someone says 'you are a racist and here's why' that's not them speaking a 'universal truth' that's them stating their opinion and qualifying it. I've noticed that, often, unless someone puts something like 'in my opinion' you'll often think that the person is trying to say their opinion is a fact when it's obvious to everyone it's just an opinion. People shouldn't have to say their opinion is an opinion because it should be obvious to you. Pretty much everything you said in this post comes from a lack of understanding of what is a fact and what is an opinion.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Are you genuinely trying to suggest that those on here who are right of centre are innocent of "sniping at people"? You're literally sniping at people... in this very post... come on.

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying... probably quite poorly because I'm quite busy... that people get sick and tired of being question aggressively by a group of people, but being laughed at complete with laughing emoticons. Usually, that group is on the left, but not exclusively. One of the people I admired most on this forum was so far left you could hardly see him... and in the end he got sick of it and left.

I just wanted to tell Brillo how I saw it, because she gets more crap thrown at her, more ridicule, more name-calling than anyone else on the forum.

[Tom4784]

How DARE people question others in a serious debate!

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Livia

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying... probably quite poorly because I'm quite busy... that people get sick and tired of being question aggressively by a group of people, but being laughed at complete with laughing emoticons. Usually, that group is on the left, but not exclusively. One of the people I admired most on this forum was so far left you could hardly see him... and in the end he got sick of it and left.

I just wanted to tell Brillo how I saw it, because she gets more crap thrown at her, more ridicule, more name-calling than anyone else on the forum.

Yes I have commented on it before I know for a fact as soon as brillo posts,I know who will be in the thread pulling her posts apart,I see it,I don't comment much as it's pointless ,infact I will go as far to say one poster is a bit of a bully,that's how they come across and yes it's been noticed by a few.It's ok to disagree with someone,but to belittle them and be hostile is not on I don't like people who try to be smartarses and fail miserably.

[Tom4784]

The accusation of bullying is just another attempt to silence people who have the right to criticse what anyone else says. If you say something that people will disagree with then it's just as much their right to voice their opposing opinion as it is for you to voice it in the first place.

Kazanne, you say it's not okay to belittle someone but what do you have to say about all of the terms Brillo uses such as snowflake? Leftie? Remoaner? ETC? The only purpose of those terms are to be hostile and belittling towards people. If you have a problem with accusations of racism then what's your stance on Brillo's uses of these terms?

[Maru]

The terms racist, homophobic, sexist, etc that this poll highlights get tossed around on this forum like it's candy on Halloween. So understandably (though this is definitely not my approach ) some people will toss PC, Leftist Bullying, misandric, etc gets tossed back...

I'm very reluctant respond to this poll for example, because it feels like another setup to be brought into character assassinations, which comes from both ends tbqf.

I don't even think the issue is the words being tossed about, as much as people are feeling baited and gaslit (welcome to 2018) and feeling like they have to respond to every character attack... and the disparate modding on this board enables a persecution complex (I've seen both sides complain about mods) of sorts, because then they think they're being hand selected for their strong views.

My solution would've been to edit posts with mod sig and leave note in posts why they were edited to keep it transparent. Except we're in weird times where everyone feels like if you try to adjust their words or if it happens when certain groups are involved, then it turns into a conspiracy theory...

My question to those who answered No in the poll, when you respond with these inflammatory words and throw labels... what are you individually getting out of it? Because it isn't changing minds, clearly. I do think there are attempts to bully at times (edited, created a bit of a broad stroke there).. maybe not silence, but to create discomfort for other people on board with your strong opinions in order to starve them of breathing room... only one side can really be accused of this because obviously there is a huge minority of right-wing-ish users... but are staff responsible for picking sides? No. In my opinion, everyone should be edited as TS suggested--all baiting behavior (incendiary language), etc.. but I personally perfectly happy to ignore it (personally)

I'm just sad that we've really lost some great users to such petty ****. Most of the time SD is a dumpster fire (), but when you're talking with the right mix of people, it can be pretty stimulating conversation than your average small talk...

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Livia

There's no denying it, Brillo. Anyone not left of centre has been sniped at by someone on the Left... and Brexit just added fuel to the flames. There's not much impartiality on here, and reacting just gets you infracted and banned. But don't think that others haven't noticed your treatment.

Right, this gets brought up again and again but its simply not true.

Of all infractions given this so far this year I actually just went back over them all and these are the results

Left wing poster 18
Right wing poster 8
Unknown/BB only poster 27

So actually, it seems that the bias is against people on the left, from the figures

I have no way of checking bans. But I am sure it would tally the same as its the infractions that lead to bans afterall

Happy for any other mod/admin to clarify I am not talking **** too. Obviously cannot screenshot to show you this as infractions aren't even meant to be spoke of on the main board and that would be pretty unfair on those who have received infractions anyway.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Maru

The terms racist, homophobic, sexist, etc that this poll highlights get tossed around on this forum like it's candy on Halloween. So understandably (though this is definitely not my approach ) some people will toss PC, Leftist Bullying, misandric, etc gets tossed back...

I'm very reluctant respond to this poll for example, because it feels like another setup to be brought into character assassinations, which comes from both ends tbqf.

I don't even think the issue is the words being tossed about, as much as people are feeling baited and gaslit (welcome to 2018) and feeling like they have to respond to every character attack... and the disparate modding on this board enables a persecution complex (I've seen both sides complain about mods) of sorts, because then they think they're being hand selected for their strong views.

My solution would've been to edit posts with mod sig and leave note in posts why they were edited to keep it transparent. Except we're in weird times where everyone feels like if you try to adjust their words or if it happens when certain groups are involved, then it turns into a conspiracy theory...

My question to those who answered No in the poll, when you respond with these inflammatory words and throw labels... what are you individually getting out of it? Because it isn't changing minds, clearly. I do think there are attempts to bully at times (edited, created a bit of a broad stroke there).. maybe not silence, but to create discomfort for other people on board with your strong opinions in order to starve them of breathing room... only one side can really be accused of this because obviously there is a huge minority of right-wing-ish users... but are staff responsible for picking sides? No. In my opinion, everyone should be edited as TS suggested--all baiting behavior (incendiary language), etc.. but I personally perfectly happy to ignore it (personally)

I'm just sad that we've really lost some great users to such petty ****. Most of the time SD is a dumpster fire (), but when you're talking with the right mix of people, it can be pretty stimulating conversation than your average small talk...

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Maru

My solution would've been to edit posts with mod sig and leave note in posts why they were edited to keep it transparent. Except we're in weird times where everyone feels like if you try to adjust their words or if it happens when certain groups are involved, then it turns into a conspiracy theory...

This already happens, if we edit stuff it shows that we edited it, and even when we do that we get people kicking off. Only way people would be happy was with if we stopped modding at all.and even that would not stop people moaning as then they would be saying 'well X is insulting me, why are they not banned' and such. People want modding, and harsh modding, when it suits them. Basically they want people who argue with them infracted, but think that their infractions are all bias and wrong

Back to the editing thing, as I said that function exists already but its too much of a pain in the arse to comb back through a large thread editing out obvious baiting, and then all of the quotes also. Only for the same thing to be started up again, generally its much easier to just delete the posts. If there is an otherwise decent post with a line of baiting in it though or a random insult, we will edit rather than remove the good post. Quite rare to see good thought out posts in this section anyway, these days its all sniping and baiting tbh. Which is a big reason I am happy you are back tbh, your posts are always decent /arselickingover

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

I just wanted to tell Brillo how I saw it, because she gets more crap thrown at her, more ridicule, more name-calling than anyone else on the forum.

I kind of agree with that but, is there a reason for it? I'm not saying it's right and I'm not saying there's an excuse for it, if Brillo is feeling marginalised and attacked then that's not a good look on anyone, I guess I'm just saying that she hasn't been picked out at random to be attacked... She has strong opinions and expresses them fairly forcefully and that invites a certain response.

I'm not even saying g it's the wrong way to be... I mean... I also have strong opinions, sometimes opinions that are a bit all over the place and I'm working through myself, and I don't exactly state them gently all of the time. And I do sometimes end up on the receiving end of some backlash for that. And I also on more than one occasion have found myself holding a very lonely line against multiple people in threads . Sometimes I enjoy it and find it stimulating, sometimes I find it frustrating and it, as much as I hate to admit it, it can affect my day overall (more due to spending hours battling and stressing in general than being upset by actual content, but still).

I guess my point is... If you choose to "go to battle" - like Brillo does, like I do, and many other TiBBers - you have to sort of accept that you're heading into potentially uncomfortable territory? There are other members who state their opinions in depth, and well, in a lower-key way and even when those opinions are very similar to those expressed by us... Battlers... They very rarely find themselves feeling the heat for it. There's a reason for that...

I guess all I'm saying is it partially is a decision. If you have strong opinions and state them bluntly, then the reply is probably going to require a thicker skin.

[thesheriff443]

On here!, its like ants rolling the same big ball of **** from one side of the room to the other and back again over and over.

He said this and she said that, on here all opinions are worth the same and that's nothing.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I guess my point is... If you choose to "go to battle" - like Brillo does, like I do, and many other TiBBers - you have to sort of accept that you're heading into potentially uncomfortable territory? There are other members who state their opinions in depth, and well, in a lower-key way and even when those opinions are very similar to those expressed by us... Battlers... They very rarely find themselves feeling the heat for it. There's a reason for that...

Definitely agree with this. I am aware that some of my opinions are very strong, and I expect to be challenged on them.

As long as no insults are flung (and no, I do not class racist, homophobe, sexist and such as insults. No more than I think snowflake is), I genuinely do not see the problem. Surely this is the whole point of a serious debates forum

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I kind of agree with that but, is there a reason for it? I'm not saying it's right and I'm not saying there's an excuse for it, if Brillo is feeling marginalised and attacked then that's not a good look on anyone, I guess I'm just saying that she hasn't been picked out at random to be attacked... She has strong opinions and expresses them fairly forcefully and that invites a certain response.

I'm not even saying g it's the wrong way to be... I mean... I also have strong opinions, sometimes opinions that are a bit all over the place and I'm working through myself, and I don't exactly state them gently all of the time. And I do sometimes end up on the receiving end of some backlash for that. And I also on more than one occasion have found myself holding a very lonely line against multiple people in threads . Sometimes I enjoy it and find it stimulating, sometimes I find it frustrating and it, as much as I hate to admit it, it can affect my day overall (more due to spending hours battling and stressing in general than being upset by actual content, but still).

I guess my point is... If you choose to "go to battle" - like Brillo does, like I do, and many other TiBBers - you have to sort of accept that you're heading into potentially uncomfortable territory? There are other members who state their opinions in depth, and well, in a lower-key way and even when those opinions are very similar to those expressed by us... Battlers... They very rarely find themselves feeling the heat for it. There's a reason for that...

I guess all I'm saying is it partially is a decision. If you have strong opinions and state them bluntly, then the reply is probably going to require a thicker skin.

.....(ok, apologies Brillo because I did say that It wasn’t fair to discuss you in this way...)...and I will say, TS that the only reason I’ve quoted your post is because I can agree with much you’ve said especially in terms of...if labels are objected to then it has to work for all.. and no labels used for others either by anyone feeling ‘labelled’, whatever that label may be..also I agree with much of what you’ve said in this post about the ‘nature of discussions’ in this section...



..anyways, all I have to say is during this last year while I haven’t been on the forum, the only reason I’ve been able to read some threads/posts from time to time is they’ve been there for me to read...in that they have been left there and not removed...and that part I’ve felt is wrong as well...those posts...(..and these aren’t isolated posts but please don’t ask me to search for them because that’s too exhausting/..not recalling which specific threads they were...)...but the posts...?...I guess what I felt were grim, as I said earlier...they weren’t questioning a post or asking for any clarification or disagreeing with an opinion...they were actually stating that the forum was a better place without the member who has been discussed, how everything was much better on the forum when she wasn’t there...but not even from that own person’s perspective but using a collective ‘we’ to say that others felt the same...and that member this was targeted it had maybe only started a thread or made one post so this wasn’t involving a discussion or debate at all...I mean that is targeting and bordering on bullying ...and yes, infractions may have been given, that’s not for any of us to comment on...but the leaving up of those posts, I mean how would that make someone feel...?...not only to have it said to them but then it just left there for her to feel, it wasn’t serious enough for removal...

...as you said TS, you go into battle some days......and then you fight your battle as does your ‘Opponent’...but there are times when Brillo is attacked, when a battle as you say was never occurring...her very first post or the OP of a thread and she can be shown hostilities in very much a targeting way...

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I kind of agree with that but, is there a reason for it? I'm not saying it's right and I'm not saying there's an excuse for it, if Brillo is feeling marginalised and attacked then that's not a good look on anyone, I guess I'm just saying that she hasn't been picked out at random to be attacked... She has strong opinions and expresses them fairly forcefully and that invites a certain response.

I'm not even saying g it's the wrong way to be... I mean... I also have strong opinions, sometimes opinions that are a bit all over the place and I'm working through myself, and I don't exactly state them gently all of the time. And I do sometimes end up on the receiving end of some backlash for that. And I also on more than one occasion have found myself holding a very lonely line against multiple people in threads . Sometimes I enjoy it and find it stimulating, sometimes I find it frustrating and it, as much as I hate to admit it, it can affect my day overall (more due to spending hours battling and stressing in general than being upset by actual content, but still).

I guess my point is... If you choose to "go to battle" - like Brillo does, like I do, and many other TiBBers - you have to sort of accept that you're heading into potentially uncomfortable territory? There are other members who state their opinions in depth, and well, in a lower-key way and even when those opinions are very similar to those expressed by us... Battlers... They very rarely find themselves feeling the heat for it. There's a reason for that...

I guess all I'm saying is it partially is a decision. If you have strong opinions and state them bluntly, then the reply is probably going to require a thicker skin.

Good post

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Maru

The terms racist, homophobic, sexist, etc that this poll highlights get tossed around on this forum like it's candy on Halloween. So understandably (though this is definitely not my approach ) some people will toss PC, Leftist Bullying, misandric, etc gets tossed back...

I'm very reluctant respond to this poll for example, because it feels like another setup to be brought into character assassinations, which comes from both ends tbqf.

I don't even think the issue is the words being tossed about, as much as people are feeling baited and gaslit (welcome to 2018) and feeling like they have to respond to every character attack... and the disparate modding on this board enables a persecution complex (I've seen both sides complain about mods) of sorts, because then they think they're being hand selected for their strong views.

My solution would've been to edit posts with mod sig and leave note in posts why they were edited to keep it transparent. Except we're in weird times where everyone feels like if you try to adjust their words or if it happens when certain groups are involved, then it turns into a conspiracy theory...

My question to those who answered No in the poll, when you respond with these inflammatory words and throw labels... what are you individually getting out of it? Because it isn't changing minds, clearly. I do think there are attempts to bully at times (edited, created a bit of a broad stroke there).. maybe not silence, but to create discomfort for other people on board with your strong opinions in order to starve them of breathing room... only one side can really be accused of this because obviously there is a huge minority of right-wing-ish users... but are staff responsible for picking sides? No. In my opinion, everyone should be edited as TS suggested--all baiting behavior (incendiary language), etc.. but I personally perfectly happy to ignore it (personally)

I'm just sad that we've really lost some great users to such petty ****. Most of the time SD is a dumpster fire (), but when you're talking with the right mix of people, it can be pretty stimulating conversation than your average small talk...

The thread wasnt supposed to be about tibb (but somehow we keep going back to brillo, so i see why you might think that!), I dont think many who answered 'no' in the poll answered with tibb in mind.

I'm pretty sure I've never called someone a racist in, or outside of tibb. If I did use it, it would be to determine whether or not the offender knew how their words/actions were being perceived. Because them knowing/not knowing would alter my feelings and responses to their words/actions. But my reaction would be kinda irrelevant to the question, the question is asking whther theyre entitled to be that way to begin with.

[Vicky.]

Ammi you need to start reporting posts like the ones you described tbh. Its not really fair to be saying that they were not removed, when there is a large chance we didn't know about them. If its accurate what you recall, and it had been reported, those would definitely have been removed. Even when mods post in threads we do not necessarily read all the posts in the thread (I tend to in this section mind, not so much in the BB bit)

[Maru]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I kind of agree with that but, is there a reason for it? I'm not saying it's right and I'm not saying there's an excuse for it, if Brillo is feeling marginalised and attacked then that's not a good look on anyone, I guess I'm just saying that she hasn't been picked out at random to be attacked... She has strong opinions and expresses them fairly forcefully and that invites a certain response.

I'm not even saying g it's the wrong way to be... I mean... I also have strong opinions, sometimes opinions that are a bit all over the place and I'm working through myself, and I don't exactly state them gently all of the time. And I do sometimes end up on the receiving end of some backlash for that. And I also on more than one occasion have found myself holding a very lonely line against multiple people in threads . Sometimes I enjoy it and find it stimulating, sometimes I find it frustrating and it, as much as I hate to admit it, it can affect my day overall (more due to spending hours battling and stressing in general than being upset by actual content, but still).

I guess my point is... If you choose to "go to battle" - like Brillo does, like I do, and many other TiBBers - you have to sort of accept that you're heading into potentially uncomfortable territory? There are other members who state their opinions in depth, and well, in a lower-key way and even when those opinions are very similar to those expressed by us... Battlers... They very rarely find themselves feeling the heat for it. There's a reason for that...

I guess all I'm saying is it partially is a decision. If you have strong opinions and state them bluntly, then the reply is probably going to require a thicker skin.

It does effect some of us more than others and I think it's fair for individuals to sometimes say they need to step out entirely and get themselves in order before they respond in a way that only leads to more frustration/stress. But there are people who actively buttress their points by frustrating people in this forum with baiting commentary, like "Oh well lookie there, so and so didn't respond or they're sooo frustrated... I guess you just don't debate very well, look at mah mad debate skillz"... very little is gained when this happens for both sides, aside from the pleasure of creating discomfort for some folk I guess? It doesn't really change anyone's mind imo.

I remember when I used to admin, I used to have abuse thrown at me on a daily basis. I didn't have a choice but to soldier on and there are a lot of times when it is actually against your best interests, much less the debate itself, to respond to any of it tbqf. So I've developed some short rules I follow and I used to give people similar rules through PM's as a mod... I think some people are just venting for whatever reason and want to feel like they are being heard by someone, and it doesn't even matter in the end what the argument was about, as much as they were not feeling listened to and are taking it out on a public forum (after all, the attraction here is the anonymity of it)..

But there are just times when your partner is not a debate partner but simply an energy vampire. Some you can allow an "in" and because they feed off of you emotionally, they happily sit behind the keyboard with you maneuvering around your words and creating pits for you to walk into just to keep going endlessly with you in circles. Those people cannot be reformed by modding. They know exactly what they're doing and they take great pleasure in doing it. And let's be honest, some people are easier than others to pick off of and are much easier to generate reactions from, and it's this tendency that makes them great prey for those who thrive through that type of bullying...

Anyway as for the rest, I do agree with you for the most part on the other counts, that anytime you debate, you are exposing some skin, no matter how much of a thick skin you have. There really is no way to prevent offense when you are trying to have a good debate about a controversial topic... it is helpful when you have good debate partners, but there's not a huge percentage of the entire population that enjoys this kind of intellectual "self-gratification" , so those partners are understandably in short supply that would go the extra mile with you...

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

How DARE people question others in a serious debate!

You clearly lack understanding on the difference between questioning and aggressive insults.

It is after all in your interests to deny and try to undermine every word I say as you are the one who throws such words around at the drop of a hat. You have certainly chucked that word my way more than any other member on here.

I won’t indulge you and your ‘opinions’ any more.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Ammi you need to start reporting posts like the ones you described tbh. Its not really fair to be saying that they were not removed, when there is a large chance we didn't know about them. If its accurate what you recall, and it had been reported, those would definitely have been removed. Even when mods post in threads we do not necessarily read all the posts in the thread (I tend to in this section mind, not so much in the BB bit)

...I would indeed have either reported or posted myself with any member who I felt was being targeted quite unnecessarily rather than being ‘responded to’ ...had obviously I been able to do either at the time, Vicky...I’m sorry that you think it’s unfair that I’ve mentioned is but I’ve only been able to mention it because the posts/attacks were there to be seen...

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...I would indeed have either reported or posted myself with any member who I felt was being targeted quite unnecessarily rather than being ‘responded to’ ...had obviously I been able to do either at the time, Vicky...I’m sorry that you think it’s unfair that I’ve mentioned is but I’ve only been able to mention it because the posts/attacks were there to be seen...

I don't think its unfair you mention it

I think its kind of unfair to not actually report it at the time but be bringing it up now with the 'they were not deleted, left to stand still' type angle, when if they were reported they most likely from what you have said, would have been deleted.

Actually rather curious about these posts now

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I don't think its unfair you mention it

I think its kind of unfair to not actually report it at the time but be bringing it up now with the 'they were not deleted, left to stand still' type angle, when if they were reported they most likely from what you have said, would have been deleted.

Actually rather curious about these posts now

...I’ve just responded to your message so I’ll leave it with that, Vicky...