[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I can agree with lots of points made by Slim and TS.
I find both fascinating in their posts because they analyse in generally a positive way.

Labour has big problems in my view at present however not beyond turning around.

I was no supporter of Corbyn myself.
I make no secret that I see someone like Andy Burnham or even Wes Streeting as people I'd vote for leader of the party.

However I loved Corbyn's policies, in 2017, on the doorsteps people really liked the vision of them.
Hence his removing May's overall majority.

I was dismayed that after over a year, Starmer hasn't made a major policy statement.
You don't need to be in a hall with your invited audience to do that.

I feel Labour would be even more foolish to dump a lot of Corbyn's policies.

However, voters need to hear something.
Starmer has as yet neither thrown out all the last manifesto and hasn't created any new one either.

Of course Labour like Britain but Britain is a very divided place all round.
To its Nations and the regions of England too.

I can't say I've been impressed with a good proportion of voters in England lately.

However, and on this thread too.
As a Labour party member, we need to hear the criticisms as well as any praise.

I know Slim's views, and many others.
I know Slim is disappointed re the loss of Corbyn.

So as a member of Labour, learning the thinking of those on here I agree with and don't, is important.

The post above from LT too, who it's no secret I usually disagree bigtime with.
As to the first letter in it.
I think has much relevance and truth there.

I am happy to say I'm confused where Labour are at present, and have no idea where we're going on policy.

I wish Labour was more like the SNP with clear direction and policies.
The SNP moving more left than right, with it's social policies, independence issue aside.
Has been in power after the last 4 elections.
Being clear and decisive with an incredible in my view leader.

Why Labour faffs about, saying loads of words that go over voters heads.
Rather than get the short sharp message slogans to get interest, I haven't a clue.

In the party, I and many others are pushing to get PR adopted as policy.
That would be a start.

It would send the Cons into absolute panic.

However, I'm looking forward on this thread and others, as being in the Labour party, I'm too close to the problem, so can't see the solutions.
So it's interesting to read others views, not just praise but the criticisms too.
Because that's where learning comes from.

I mean, that anyone, foe or friend of Labour even needing to ask does Labour like Britain.
Is worrying in itself.
However, with the thinking you can take voters for granted by some in Labour, and thinking like Starmer that publicity stunting, is how to capture support, with vague and even incomplete policy making.
I'm not even surprised at the question.

So thanks to those offering their observations, from the polar opposite view to Labour and from those who I still think would, like myself, who would like to have a party again to be proud of as still Labour supporters, and those who aren't any longer but who could be won back.
If they see a genuine effort and credibility.
Neither of which I now fear will come from under Starmer's leadership.

Hi Joey.

just to point out, Corbyn was and is a thoroughly decent man, and you will know perhaps more than anyone else on here (apart from me) exactly how his party, especially right wing labour worked against him and the left when there was a real chance of gaining power in 17, and then on to 19, which after the scare he gave them, made sure he would be destroyed by the Murdoch and tory press. He never hid in fridges when the world was lying about him and he never dodged Andrew Neil.

Give me another British politician leading a party with his record and policies and I will happily vote for them again, but labour are now in a destructive phase and will take a few years to get themselves back together imo, and reintroducing Mandelson just highlights how devoid of ideas and decency the party is.

That said, if labour enter a non-tory political coalition with PR front and centre, I would support the party through that election cycle again, but until then, I'll be a greenie for the foreseeable.