[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Livia

Sergey Lavrov is a clown and a liar.

A song contest? Jesus...

yes Intervision

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intervision_Song_Contest


last edition was held in 2008 (in which Ukraine also competed in btw, well the pro-russian language/culture artists that is)



Lavrov, like Putin is also a very solid diplomat honestly, and this war can end peacefully, as long as the west also listens to the terms what russia want, like an end to corruption in the ukrainian government in Kyiv, an end to xenophobia towards russian language, culture, more freedom of speech for the Donetsk, Lugansk regions



also this ''Invasion'' was more called that by the news media's across the world, immediately the finger pointing tactic like russia is evil propaganda by the west, this was more a strategic operation to come to Donetsk, Lugansk their aide, those regional government had requested such help against the regime in Kyiv

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

yes Intervision

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intervision_Song_Contest


last edition was held in 2008 (in which Ukraine also competed in btw, well the pro-russian language/culture artists that is)



Lavrov, like Putin is also a very solid diplomat honestly, and this war can end peacefully, as long as the west also listens to the terms what russia want, like an end to corruption in the ukrainian government in Kyiv, an end to xenophobia towards russian language, culture, more freedom of speech for the Donetsk, Lugansk regions



also this ''Invasion'' was more called that by the news media's across the world, immediately the finger pointing tactic like russia is evil propaganda by the west, this was more a strategic operation to come to Donetsk, Lugansk their aide, those regional government had requested such help against the regime in Kyiv

You're back to supporting the illegal invader again.

Lavrov lied and lied for weeks about the build up of troops on the border of Ukraine saying Russia had no intention of crossing into Ukraine.

Still, i hope you get to see your song contest, regardless of how many Ukrainians have died in this illegal war at the hands of the Russian invaders. They're just two borders from your own border. But hey... Songs.

[arista]

US envoy Kellogg arrives in Ukraine for talks with Zelenskiy


Keith Kellog is aged 80
so at least he can be honest with Zelenskiy.


[KYIV, Feb 19 (Reuters) - Keith Kellogg,
U.S. President Donald Trump's Ukraine envoy,
arrived in Kyiv on Wednesday to meet
with President Volodymyr Zelenskiy
and "listen," as the war against Russia
approaches its three-year mark.
Kellogg's visit comes a day after
the United States and Russia met in Riyadh
for talks on ending the war, without Ukraine.
"It will give us a chance to have
good substantial talks,"
Kellogg said, adding that the talks will
build on weekend conversations at
the Munich Security Conference.]


https://www.reuters.com/world/us-env...iy-2025-02-19/

[arista]

[Zelensky condemns Trump:
Ukraine leader says US President
'is in a disinformation bubble',
demanding $500bn minerals
'is not a serious conversation… I won't sell my country',
and says Donald has 'helped Putin']


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ped-Putin.html


Yes President Trump did not
even bother to go to Saudi Arabia
sending Little Rubio
and 2 others.

[Livia]

Trump has no interest in Ukraine specifically and Europe generally. How can you have peace talks that exclude the invaded country and representatives of the continent on which it stands. Putin and Trump... What a team.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Livia

Trump has no interest in Ukraine specifically and Europe generally. How can you have peace talks that exclude the invaded country and representatives of the continent on which it stands. Putin and Trump... What a team.

Yes, he is in his,
Amerca First World

[Sticks]

Trump is right about Zelsky

Zelesky is the problem with his big ego - If he had allowed a surrender and for Ukraine to be, as it is a province of Russia and not an independent country, all these death could have been avoided.

Zelensky needs to be arrested and put on trial in Moscow for high treason.

[arista]

"needs to be arrested"


No he is the Legit
Leader of Ukraine.

[Alf]

[Vanessa]

I have to agree, it's a war they can't win. Why not settle and stop all this?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

I have to agree, it's a war they can't win. Why not settle and stop all this?

Russia invaded Ukraine. How do they settle that? Do they say, here Putin, take half our country....

[Livia]

People have such short memories....

[Oliver_W]

I wouldn't go so far as to say that Ukraine are "irrelevant" in discussions, because that's OBVIOUSLY ridiculous. But their position entirely depends on support from outside, and the continued willingness to provide.

I've long thought that the current help given is doing almost nothing but maintaining the status quo. When what SHOULD be happening is either Ukraine gaining the ability to end the conflict, or aid in negotiations.

[arista]

President Trump has now
badmouths Zelensky.


[Ukraine latest: Trump calls Zelenskyy
a 'dictator ' and says he 'better move fast'
or he won't have a country left

Donald Trump has hit out at Volodymyr Zelenskyy
once again, calling him a
"dictator without elections".
Earlier, Zelenskyy said Trump is
"trapped in a disinformation bubble" after
he appeared to blame Ukraine for
starting the war. ]

https://news.sky.com/story/trump-put...atest-12541713

[MTVN]

It's an interesting take. There's pretty clear problems with having elections when a big chunk of the country is occupied, there's frequent missiles flying, and so much of the population has fled. I'm not sure Ukraine can be blamed for starting the war either or how they were supposed to respond to a full scale invasion.

However some of his points are valid and there has to be an end to the war somehow. Ukraine can not achieve any more than they have done already unless we truly want this to be a world war with NATO direct involvement. They've maintained control over the vast majority of their country, they've kept most of their major cities. Much as we we might hate Russia's actions, a lot of the territory they now control is genuinely Russian-leaning anyway. There's a world of difference between Donetsk and Kyiv or Lviv

[Vanessa]

I'm totally on Ukraine side. But I get the feeling they can't win this war. Negotiations may be the only way to stop it.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by MTVN

I'm not sure Ukraine can be blamed for starting the war either

I'd like to know Trump's rationale behind this. It didn't come from nowhere, there must be some "breadcrumbs" one could follow to get to what he said, even if some did get eaten or carried away by the wind.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

I'd like to know Trump's rationale behind this. It didn't come from nowhere, there must be some "breadcrumbs" one could follow to get to what he said, even if some did get eaten or carried away by the wind.

It's probably the same rationale as Putin gives that if Ukraine had just accepted the loss of Crimea and the occupied Donetsk and Luhansk regions then there would have been no invasion (if they also gave up any NATO ambitions). Probably questionable if that would have changed anything given Russia's obvious intentions at the start were to take over Kyiv too

[bots]

i think Trump wants some big pay back from europe. I also think that this frees up Russia to continue its assault across eastern europe. There is no way this is the end of Russian ambitions

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by bots

i think Trump wants some big pay back from europe. I also think that this frees up Russia to continue its assault across eastern europe. There is no way this is the end of Russian ambitions

I agree.
Even moreso if there's in the end only a result that pleases Putin and Russia more.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Livia

Russia invaded Ukraine. How do they settle that? Do they say, here Putin, take half our country....

I honestly cannot comprehend how anyone could even see that as 'settling' it.
I agree with you and also your other post saying people have short memories.

Any appeasement AT ALL of dictators will only empower them further in the future.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

I'm totally on Ukraine side. But I get the feeling they can't win this war. Negotiations may be the only way to stop it.

How are they supposed to do that when they were not invited to the first meeting, it was held in Saudi with just Russia and America....that tells you all you need to know about how they want this settled, carving up Ukraine to suit themselves

[arista]

[arista]

[arista]