[setanta]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

They've been saying for years that with Gerrard and Lampard one should sit and the other go forward and work it out amongst themselves as to who does what and when. They're supposed to be world class players so why cant they organise themselves better on the pitch. Its baffling TBH. I compared them to Iniesta and Xavi. OK they both play for the same club team so can work on it for hours on the training ground and Xavi is slightly more defensive minded than Iniesta but still Gerrard and Lampard are still a massive problem. I think they both want to be the top man in midfield and neither wants to change the way they play at club level.

You can't play them together, especially in a 4-4-2 system. Leaves your midfield totally open. God knows what Argentina would have done to it, you know that way?

[Wildcat!]

Girth, USA basketball at the olympics, since pros were allowed:

1992 : 1st
1996 : 1st
2000: 1st
2004: 3rd
2008: 1st

Yeah, they consistently underperformed alright!

[setanta]

The funniest is when the American baseball team is beaten in the Olympics.

[Nemo123]

Lampard and Gerard - too many goals in them, there has to be a price to pay. They don't defend well enough. One has to make way. If England had a McGrath or a Lawrenson to plug the mf...

(or a Piqué)

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

They've been saying for years that with Gerrard and Lampard one should sit and the other go forward and work it out amongst themselves as to who does what and when. They're supposed to be world class players so why cant they organise themselves better on the pitch. Its baffling TBH. I compared them to Iniesta and Xavi. OK they both play for the same club team so can work on it for hours on the training ground and Xavi is slightly more defensive minded than Iniesta but still Gerrard and Lampard are still a massive problem. I think they both want to be the top man in midfield and neither wants to change the way they play at club level.

This is what I am saying, and thats were you England fans are deluded. You cant compare Iniesta and Xavi, To Lampard and Gerrard. The spanish pair, they make things happen, they play freeluyy, and with some flair. The 2 english players, are solid, but they are not great. Gerrard maybe can make things happen at times, but not always. To me, its not even close the talent level. ANd you guys always fail to see that!

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by setanta

The funniest is when the American baseball team is beaten in the Olympics.

Thats not that big of a stretch, but they dont have baseball in the olympics. BUt what most people dont know, a lot of the great MLB players, are from the dominican republic, Cuba, Japan etc. Americans have a lot of good players, but there are teams that beat them in the world cup!

[Locke.]

Most the players play better for their club teams because they prefer playing for the club side to the international side. And I can't blame them, because I'd probably be the same.

[Nemo123]

ein zwei drei vier thumped!

that's a good one.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Thats not that big of a stretch, but they dont have baseball in the olympics. BUt what most people dont know, a lot of the great MLB players, are from the dominican republic, Cuba, Japan etc. Americans have a lot of good players, but there are teams that beat them in the world cup!

They do have baseball in the Olympics and the States have won it just the once. Cuba win it most of the time.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by Locke.

Most the players play better for their club teams because they prefer playing for the club side to the international side. And I can't blame them, because I'd probably be the same.

Why the hell is that? I would definitely prefer to play for my national team. Look at the germas. Klose has scored more goals in this WC than he did for his club the whole season. The ghanaen players, same. A lot of them come off the bench in their clubs, but they over perform for their country. A guy like Appiah, who hasnt even played for his club, oplays great for Ghana. Some are even broughgt from retirement, like Roger Milla, but they get inspired by playing for their country!
If you are serious, and thats the attitude of English players, then that explains everything!

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

This is what I am saying, and thats were you England fans are deluded. You cant compare Iniesta and Xavi, To Lampard and Gerrard. The spanish pair, they make things happen, they play freeluyy, and with some flair. The 2 english players, are solid, but they are not great. Gerrard maybe can make things happen at times, but not always. To me, its not even close the talent level. ANd you guys always fail to see that!

Actually I'm a Holland fan even though I'm English.

Gerrard and Lampard make things happen at club level and both are great players. Lampard has scored 20 goals for five straight seasons from midfield. He certainly makes things happen but when he plays at international level he cant hit a barn door with a banjo.

Gerrard is one of the most influential midfielders in Europe and if he became available for transfer most of the big Euro clubs would break the bank to get him.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by setanta

They do have baseball in the Olympics and the States have won it just the once. Cuba win it most of the time.

Really? I thought they had stop it! BUt anyways, thats the thing, the US doesnt have the best basebvall players in the world. They are usually Latin players, or asians. SO its not really a big surprise. CUba got great players.

[Nemo123]

Looking at the coin toss on the pitch made me think of the Scottish for some reason.

[Locke.]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Why the hell is that? I would definitely prefer to play for my national team. Look at the germas. Klose has scored more goals in this WC than he did for his club the whole season. The ghanaen players, same. A lot of them come off the bench in their clubs, but they over perform for their country. A guy like Appiah, who hasnt even played for his club, oplays great for Ghana. Some are even broughgt from retirement, like Roger Milla, but they get inspired by playing for their country!
If you are serious, and thats the attitude of English players, then that explains everything!

I know that Carragher said in his autobiography that it hurts him more when Liverpool lose than when England do, and I agree with that. I think that's why he retired from International football first time around.

And i'm not sure why it is really, when it comes down to international football I don't really care that much, this is the first world cup where I've really got behind England.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

Actually I'm a Holland fan even though I'm English.

Gerrard and Lampard make things happen at club level and both are great players. Lampard has scored 20 goals for five straight seasons from midfield. He certainly makes things happen but when he plays at international level he cant hit a barn door with a banjo.

Gerrard is one of the most influential midfielders in Europe and if he became available for transfer most of the big Euro clubs would break the bank to get him.

Because he plays alongside Drogba, Essien, Anelka, etc, etc, etc.....

Thats why he gets to roam around and get free shots. The others get a lopt of attention from the defense. Same goes for Rooney, Gerrard, etc.... But on the international level, it shows, how average they are. Better than average, but they are not great"!

I said Gerrard is pretty good, but if he goes to other european clubs he will suffer. Why do you think most English players dont do well outside of the premier leaugue. Actually, aside from David Beckham, there is not one English player, in the top european teams, outside of England. That should tell you something. David Beckham wasnt as goods as he was after he left man U! Same thing would happen to gerrard, or any of those english stars!

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by Locke.

I know that Carragher said in his autobiography that it hurts him more when Liverpool lose than when England do, and I agree with that. I think that's why he retired from International football first time around.

And i'm not sure why it is really, when it comes down to international football I don't really care that much, this is the first world cup where I've really got behind England.

Well there you go! Thats the root of your problem!

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Because he plays alongside Drogba, Essien, Anelka, etc, etc, etc.....

Thats why he gets to roam around and get free shots. The others get a lopt of attention from the defense. Same goes for Rooney, Gerrard, etc.... But on the international level, it shows, how average they are. Better than average, but they are not great"!

Yep, you're right there Wildcat. I rate the two of them very highly, but they can't dominate a game like other midfielders, plus I don't really class them as midfielders in the strictest sense.

[Nemo123]

Originally Posted by setanta

Yep, you're right there Wildcat. I rate the two of them very highly, but they can't dominate a game like other midfielders, plus I don't really class them as midfielders in the strictest sense.

Nah, they're not are they. Certainly no David Battys.

[Locke.]

If Gerrard was played in the same role he plays at Liverpool, just behind the striker(s), then we would have seen a different side to him. Playing him on the left was a pathetic decision.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by Locke.

If Gerrard was played in the same role he plays at Liverpool, just behind the striker(s), then we would have seen a different side to him. Playing him on the left was a pathetic decision.

Have you seen where David Villa plays? COmletely out of position, on the left I think. Does it matter? NO. He gets on with it. Not everyone can play their club roles.
Thats the reason why I say the english players are like robots. They only know how to play one way, that they learned all their lives. They dont yhave the ability to adapt. Thats the creativity thing I was talking about. The creATIVE, FREE ROAMING PLAYERS, arent selected ever by your managers!

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Locke.

If Gerrard was played in the same role he plays at Liverpool, just behind the striker(s), then we would have seen a different side to him. Playing him on the left was a pathetic decision.

He has to play there. It's fairly obvious to us all, right? But apparently it hasn't always worked when England have tried it before.

[Locke.]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Have you seen where David Villa plays? COmletely out of position, on the left I think. Does it matter? NO. He gets on with it. Not everyone can play their club roles.
Thats the reason why I say the english players are like robots. They only know how to play one way, that they learned all their lives. They dont yhave the ability to adapt. Thats the creativity thing I was talking about. The creATIVE, FREE ROAMING PLAYERS, arent selected ever by your managers!

I thought Villa played up front with Torres?

[Wildcat!]

Just hear the argentina mEXICO GAME, THE COMMENTATOr say, only 5 players from each side, played last WC. Meaning each team got 6 new players. Thats the problem with England, they always bring back the same ol boring players!

[Nemo123]

The FA will have to limit the number of foreigners to 2 or 3 like they use to.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Because he plays alongside Drogba, Essien, Anelka, etc, etc, etc.....
Thats why he gets to roam around and get free shots. The others get a lopt of attention from the defense. Same goes for Rooney, Gerrard, etc.... But on the international level, it shows, how average they are. Better than average, but they are not great"!

I said Gerrard is pretty good, but if he goes to other european clubs he will suffer. Why do you think most English players dont do well outside of the premier leaugue. David Becckham wasnt as goos as he was after he left man U! Same thing would happen to gerrard, or any of those english stars!

If Lampard didn't have the ability to strike the ball so well from 20 yards then he wouldn't score the goals. I dont see you argument. Its like saying that a striker only scores so often because he gets lots of chance. Yes, but he still has to hit the target and score the goal. Lampard is one of the most clinical players from around 20 yards and just about any team in the world would love to have a player was capable of doing what he does as often as he does.

You can only speculate on how well Gerrard would do but the truth is most of the top managers would trade just about any player they have and swap him with Gerrard.