[MachoPoodle]

Originally Posted by Jesus.

Excellent point, and really well made. When are those Muslims going to learn that we only bomb the ****** out of their homelands, and murder hundreds of thousand of civilians, in order to save them and their families?

They are such an ungrateful bunch, aren't they?

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Jesus.

Excellent point, and really well made. When are those Muslims going to learn that we only bomb the ****** out of their homelands, and murder hundreds of thousand of civilians, in order to save them and their families?

hundreds of thousands...

Originally Posted by parmnion

hundreds of thousands...

Estimates put the civilian death toll in Iraq and Afghanistan alone, at somewhere between 120,000, and 250,000. I'd say hundreds of thousands represents that figure pretty accurately.

How would you like it to have been worded?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Jesus.

Excellent point, and really well made. When are those Muslims going to learn that we only bomb the ****** out of their homelands, and murder hundreds of thousand of civilians, in order to save them and their families?

I know... and there never was a reason for it, them being such a peace-loving people. I mean, it's not like the people we've been at war with carry out any acts of terrorism, or indoctrinate and abuse their own people, or train terrorists from all over the world.

Hundreds of thousands of civilians? A figure plucked out of the air, I think.

And back on topic... Ron is a fool. In one scene there he is telling us that he still works as a football pundit "with the Middle East lads..." and minutes later he's making a completely inappropriate comment regarding headscarves and suicide bombers. I imagine the "Middle East lads" will be examining Ron's contract even as I type. There's no fool like and old fool. He's learned absolutely nothing from his past mistakes and the words continue to pour freely from his lips without the clutch of tact.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Livia

I know... and there never was a reason for it, them being such a peace-loving people. I mean, it's not like the people we've been at war with carry out any acts of terrorism, or indoctrinate and abuse their own people, or train terrorists from all over the world.

Hundreds of thousands of civilians? A figure plucked out of the air, I think.

And back on topic... Ron is a fool. In one scene there he is telling us that he still works as a football pundit "with the Middle East lads..." and minutes later he's making a completely inappropriate comment regarding headscarves and suicide bombers. I imagine the "Middle East lads" will be examining Ron's contract even as I type. There's no fool like and old fool. He's learned absolutely nothing from his past mistakes and the words continue to pour freely from his lips without the clutch of tact.

Are you including Israeli abuses here? How is that figure plucked out of the air? those figures have been given for many years? How tactless are your words?

Originally Posted by Livia

I know... and there never was a reason for it, them being such a peace-loving people. I mean, it's not like the people we've been at war with carry out any acts of terrorism, or indoctrinate and abuse their own people, or train terrorists from all over the world.

Hundreds of thousands of civilians? A figure plucked out of the air, I think.

And back on topic... Ron is a fool. In one scene there he is telling us that he still works as a football pundit "with the Middle East lads..." and minutes later he's making a completely inappropriate comment regarding headscarves and suicide bombers. I imagine the "Middle East lads" will be examining Ron's contract even as I type. There's no fool like and old fool. He's learned absolutely nothing from his past mistakes and the words continue to pour freely from his lips without the clutch of tact.

So what was the reason then?

Regardless of how countries treat their own people, it is up to those people to deal with it. Anyone would think the only system of government we know is democracy. The monarchy didn't give up power for the sake of it, they had it taken away from them by the people.

We did that without America swooping in and saving us.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by the truth

Are you including Israeli abuses here? How is that figure plucked out of the air? those figures have been given for many years? How tactless are your words?

Now why would you think I would be referring to Israel?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Jesus.

So what was the reason then?

Regardless of how countries treat their own people, it is up to those people to deal with it. Anyone would think the only system of government we know is democracy. The monarchy didn't give up power for the sake of it, they had it taken away from them by the people.

We did that without America swooping in and saving us.

This isn't the place for a debate like this. And I'm probably not the right person if you're looking for someone to say how awful the British Army are, and how misunderstood the Taliban are.

Originally Posted by Livia

This isn't the place for a debate like this. And I'm probably not the right person if you're looking for someone to say how awful the British Army are, and how misunderstood the Taliban are.

That's a complete misrepresentation, and you know it.

[Kyle]

Originally Posted by Jesus.

So what was the reason then?

Regardless of how countries treat their own people, it is up to those people to deal with it. Anyone would think the only system of government we know is democracy. The monarchy didn't give up power for the sake of it, they had it taken away from them by the people.

We did that without America swooping in and saving us.

I don't agree with that. Egypt isn't doing a very good job of dealing with itself right now and neither is Syria. I didn't agree with the invasion of Afghanistan and i probably never will but sometimes outside intervention is necessary.

[DanaC]

People keep talking about 'the muslims' versus 'our soldiers'.

There are muslims serving in the British Army.

Originally Posted by Simple Minds

I don't agree with that. Egypt isn't doing a very good job of dealing with itself right now and neither is Syria. I didn't agree with the invasion of Afghanistan and i probably never will but sometimes outside intervention is necessary.

I don't disagree with the principle here, but I don't agree with the selective choosing of which people deserve our help, and which people don't.

We're happy to let African genocide take place on a massive scale, and what about those poor North Koreans, who probably have it worse than any other people on earth?

We should help everyone, or help no one.

[DanaC]

Countries don't go to war because they want to help other countries. They go to war because they think it will be beneficial to them (by whatever criteria they're measuring that).

And Livia, those figures were spot on. The death toll during the Shock and Awe attack alone was staggering.

[Kyle]

Originally Posted by Jesus.

I don't disagree with the principle here, but I don't agree with the selective choosing of which people deserve our help, and which people don't.

We're happy to let African genocide take place on a massive scale, and what about those poor North Koreans, who probably have it worse than any other people on earth?

We should help everyone, or help no one.

We don't have the resources or manpower to help everyone, we are small Island with a small professional army. The States already have their fingers in too many pies and the United Nations are a joke of an entitity.

I agree we have been pretty selective in our targets up to now, mainly around the gulf region but a war against North Korea would be a nightmare.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Livia

Now why would you think I would be referring to Israel?

well done avoiding all my questions

also wondering if you applied the same standards to the israeli abuses?

[DanaC]

Yep. And we're so tiny in fact, that we can't even accommodate the handful of Iraqis who acted as our interpreters over there and who now face persecution and reprisals for that assistance.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by the truth

well done avoiding all my questions

also wondering if you applied the same standards to the israeli abuses?

I don't have to answer your questions.

We're not talking about Israel here, just because I'm a Jew you drag Israel into it? The opinions I have are nothing to do with my religion and everything to do with my being the widow of a British soldier.

[Kyle]

I hate seeing atrocities committed against people by other people but An ever growing part of me is starting to think we should just leave them to it and it saddens me to even say that.


You Just can't trust anyone these days, everyone's out for themselves and politicians are the last people on the planet to believe when they start rabbiting on about regimes doing this and dictators committing that.


It's like everybody is like; in the words of Jim Morisson

"I just wanna get my kicks before the whole s h i t house goes up in flames."

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Jesus.

Estimates put the civilian death toll in Iraq and Afghanistan alone, at somewhere between 120,000, and 250,000. I'd say hundreds of thousands represents that figure pretty accurately.

by our troops?

[Beso]

jesus, you said our troops have murdered hundred and thousands of innocent people in irag and afgahnistan, can you post some sort of official documentation to confirm this please...or are you rambling exagarations again?

[DanaC]

Yeah, about that....I mean....sure, we had some around here at some point...can't seem to lay my hands on them right now.

[Niamh.]

Yes alright back ontopic please

[Vanessa]

I like Ron. He seems nice enough. I had no idea who he was before he entered the House.

[Josy]

Eurgh the quotes in here have all been broken so there's no way of knowing who's said what

Originally Posted by Josy

Eurgh the quotes in here have all been broken so there's no way of knowing who's said what

If you think the post is awesome - just assume I said it, if you don't, it was definitely someone else.