[Alf]

Originally Posted by Livia

It matters to me because I love animals and I don't want to see them unnecessarily tortured. If Fox numbers must be kept down, then they should be kept down by employing a gamekeeper or similar who will shoot the foxes. They're likely to be a keen shot and the suffering is minimal. There is no benefit from hunting with dogs other than some rich people - and it's almost always rich people - get to chase something till it dies of exhaustion, or is ripped apart by hounds. And that's fun for them. Sometimes they cut off the tail of the dismembered fox and rub the blood over their child's face... blooding them. And in order to do all this, they dress up in fancy dress. And it's not like the hounds have such a great life...

I live in the countryside and there are lots of people - not just London blow-ins like me - who were born and bred in the country who abhor the thought of hunting with dogs. The Tories would be insane to reintroduce it.

But by nature, dogs love hunting. Should we take that away from them?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Alf

I've used this analogy before

If war were to break out tomorrow, you wouldn't even think like this, your only thought would be for your own survival.

We're all selfish, it's just what us humans are.

The fact it doesn't make any difference to my life, means that it's not an issue that I'd be considering, when placing my vote.

With all due respect Alf you have no idea how I or anyone other than yourself would react if War broke out tomorrow.

With regards to the BIB, that's fair enough for you but other people don't think that way

Originally Posted by parmnion

Fox hunting is disgusting but i find most peoples problem is not the cruelty to the fox but more for the hatred for those on horseback.

Nope, my problem is definitely 100% to do with the fox

[Niamh.]

Although Parmnion I did just see this pop up on FB and they do have a valid point as well. If it were a gang of lads from a council estate setting their Staffies on a stray cat or even a Fox they would be (rightly) called scumbags, I see no difference between the two scenarios

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Although Parmnion I did just see this pop up on FB and they do have a valid point as well. If it were a gang of lads from a council estate setting their Staffies on a stray cat or even a Fox they would be (rightly) called scumbags, I see no difference between the two scenarios

I hardly ever find myself agreeing with Ricky Gervais... but that's hit the nail right on the head.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Although Parmnion I did just see this pop up on FB and they do have a valid point as well. If it were a gang of lads from a council estate setting their Staffies on a stray cat or even a Fox they would be (rightly) called scumbags, I see no difference between the two scenarios

Yes that's a valid point.

So how about if they want to go fox hunting, they must pay a penalty (A huge sum) pay to play?

That's a compromise.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Alf

Yes that's a valid point.

So how about if they want to go fox hunting, they must pay a penalty (A huge sum) pay to play?

That's a compromise.

How is that a compromise? People are against it because of the cruelty to the animals, getting money for it doesn't solve that

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

How is that a compromise? People are against it because of the cruelty to the animals, getting money for it doesn't solve that

I'm just shooting ideas here Niamh. I want peace.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Alf

This is part of toff culture, shouldn't we respect it?

#Toffphobia

Bull fighting is part of the Spanish culture but not all cultures are good.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Bull fighting is part of the Spanish culture but not all cultures are good.

Agree with that, that's why I was being sarcastic.

[Kizzy]

I sometimes feel may is the huntmaster and 95% of the population are foxes.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Alf

I'm just shooting ideas here Niamh. I want peace.

As long as you're not shooting Foxes Alf

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

As long as you're not shooting Foxes Alf

I only kill fly's, dirty little things that trespass in your home.

The spiders are welcome.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Alf

I only kill fly's, dirty little things that trespass in your home.

The spiders are welcome.

[DemolitionRed]

A lot of city people aren't aware of the sister of fox hunting called 'cubbing'. Cubbing is for young or new riders, horses and hounds and will happen in the autumn if May gets her wish. It involves litters of fox cubs contained within coverts. Ever heard of canned hunting? this is what cubbing is and its so unbelievably barbaric that we can never allow this to come back.

I used to run a livery yard and the hunts were a nightmare because they didn't need permission to encroach on my land. We had to sedate the horses and keep them in because there was a high chance of them injuring themselves if a hunt got close. Farmers generally hate the hunt and see them as disruptive and damaging to both land and property.

Fox's can be a problem to new born lambs and calf's. Not so much to chickens because nowadays we have adequate deterrents . I used to keep chickens on the farm and never lost one to a fox.

I love hunting btw but what I do is drag hunt. A sport which is fast, furious, exciting and does not involve the killing of an animal. I've never been fox hunting and I'm told that compared to drag hunting, its pretty slow and boring.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

A lot of city people aren't aware of the sister of fox hunting called 'cubbing'. Cubbing is for young or new riders, horses and hounds and will happen in the autumn if May gets her wish. It involves litters of fox cubs contained within coverts. Ever heard of canned hunting? this is what cubbing is and its so unbelievably barbaric that we can never allow this to come back.

I used to run a livery yard and the hunts were a nightmare because they didn't need permission to encroach on my land. We had to sedate the horses and keep them in because there was a high chance of them injuring themselves if a hunt got close. Farmers generally hate the hunt and see them as disruptive and damaging to both land and property.

Fox's can be a problem to new born lambs and calf's. Not so much to chickens because nowadays we have adequate deterrents . I used to keep chickens on the farm and never lost one to a fox.

I love hunting btw but what I do is drag hunt. A sport which is fast, furious, exciting and does not involve the killing of an animal. I've never been fox hunting and I'm told that compared to drag hunting, its pretty slow and boring.

What does that involve DR?

[ebandit]

...it's true i dislike fox hunters 'cos they're 'upper class twits'

...land owners who think they have right to tally ho over others gardens etc

..whilst denying others access to their land

Mark L

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by ebandit

...it's true i dislike fox hunters 'cos they're 'upper class twits'

...land owners who think they have right to tally ho over others gardens etc

..whilst denying others access to their land

Mark L

made me laugh do they still say tally ho

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Alf

I've used this analogy before

If war were to break out tomorrow, you wouldn't even think like this, your only thought would be for your own survival.

We're all selfish, it's just what us humans are.

The fact it doesn't make any difference to my life, means that it's not an issue that I'd be considering, when placing my vote.

'What's the point of anything, war might break out tomorrow.' is basically what you are saying.

It's a silly argument to make especially considering that a war wouldn't change the lives of the average citizen anymore and hasn't done so for decades.

Life would carry on because the way wars are fought now are completely different to how they were fought in WW2.

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

A lot of city people aren't aware of the sister of fox hunting called 'cubbing'. Cubbing is for young or new riders, horses and hounds and will happen in the autumn if May gets her wish. It involves litters of fox cubs contained within coverts. Ever heard of canned hunting? this is what cubbing is and its so unbelievably barbaric that we can never allow this to come back.

I used to run a livery yard and the hunts were a nightmare because they didn't need permission to encroach on my land. We had to sedate the horses and keep them in because there was a high chance of them injuring themselves if a hunt got close. Farmers generally hate the hunt and see them as disruptive and damaging to both land and property.

Fox's can be a problem to new born lambs and calf's. Not so much to chickens because nowadays we have adequate deterrents . I used to keep chickens on the farm and never lost one to a fox.

I love hunting btw but what I do is drag hunt. A sport which is fast, furious, exciting and does not involve the killing of an animal. I've never been fox hunting and I'm told that compared to drag hunting, its pretty slow and boring.

Drag hunting is the way forward, the Hunt should be happy, foxes happy.
Nothing wrong in shooting the fox humanely if it becomes a pest I suppose.
Unfortunately I don't think drag hunting quenches the bloodlust in some and they still break the law.
Perhaps a vote to put it all to bed once and for all will show people it is never going to happen and they can adjust their thought patterns, if not then heavy fines or jail might do the trick.
As to the actual vote, people need to make sure their MP is fully aware that they find it unacceptable and will oust them at the next opportunity if they don't take heed.

[Alf]

Pest control often use dogs, should that be stopped?

They kill rabbits, hares and foxes.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

What does that involve DR?

The course is set out and the jumps have to pass safety measures, so horses are less likely to get hurt. A scent is put down which the hounds follow, followed by the horses. Its between 8 to 10 miles in length and because its so safe, its fast and exciting for both the horse and riders.

The thing about fox hunting is, there are many riders who live in the city and keep a horse or two on a hunting yard. They are often poor riders with very expensive warmbloods, being cared for in expensive equestrian yards (though you do get some seriously good riders too.) I used to work for a barrister who kept two hunting mares over in Suffolk. I went over to ride out with him one weekend and it was funny riding beside a man who neither had a clue about horses or how to ride them and yet this is a man who regularly hunted and jumped five bar gates! It was clearly a case of 'hang on and hope for the best'.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by smudgie

Drag hunting is the way forward, the Hunt should be happy, foxes happy.
Nothing wrong in shooting the fox humanely if it becomes a pest I suppose.
Unfortunately I don't think drag hunting quenches the bloodlust in some and they still break the law.
Perhaps a vote to put it all to bed once and for all will show people it is never going to happen and they can adjust their thought patterns, if not then heavy fines or jail might do the trick.
As to the actual vote, people need to make sure their MP is fully aware that they find it unacceptable and will oust them at the next opportunity if they don't take heed.

I agree and you are right about fox hunters being blood thirsty as well as not caring so much about their horse becoming a casualty. I haven't really kept up with things but at one time you needed to fox hunt to qualify for point-to-point... another barbaric sport which has far too many horse casualties.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Although Parmnion I did just see this pop up on FB and they do have a valid point as well. If it were a gang of lads from a council estate setting their Staffies on a stray cat or even a Fox they would be (rightly) called scumbags, I see no difference between the two scenarios

Ricky Gervais is always on FB supporting animals he is a great animal lover and this here is perfect,he is so right.

[ebandit]

Originally Posted by Alf

Pest control often use dogs, should that be stopped?

They kill rabbits, hares and foxes.

do they? that would be 'hunting with dogs' and illegal under current

legislation

MarkL

[Alf]

Originally Posted by ebandit

do they? that would be 'hunting with dogs' and illegal under current

legislation

MarkL

Pretty sure they use guns too. Or I may have been watching too much Saxondale.