[Livia]

Originally Posted by Abhorsen

Why all the ******* about Steve being a war hero? There are plenty of people who have been blown up by bombs, that does not make them a hero, it makes them a victim.

Steve joined the army of his own free will, he got paid for it, they gave him a good life and a good living. That is NOT a hero. Even if he hadn't been bombed he would have been thrown out of the army for his fat arse, that weight would not be fit for the army.

Steve is milking it.

Sigh.

[stoney]

yep war is politics and our soldiers are just the pawns of their govt.

Just Bliar's govt sent our troops to war using a lie that he should be hung for imo but instead he makes millions out of the oil companies that have benefitted from the war

[johnx]

The war hero thing is over the top.Steves favourite song "The British Soldier" is about young working class lads joining the army to escape the dole cue to be sent to a conflict they knew and cared little about.British Govt. didnt consider it a war and we know the army used excessive force on ocassion.Some of their actions were far from heroic.The media want the people of the UK to worship the armed forces as it takes the heat off the Govt. for gettin involved in millitary adventures that are'nt popular with most of the public.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by johnx

The war hero thing is over the top.Steves favourite song "The British Soldier" is about young working class lads joining the army to escape the dole cue to be sent to a conflict they knew and cared little about.British Govt. didnt consider it a war and we know the army used excessive force on ocassion.Some of their actions were far from heroic.The media want the people of the UK to worship the armed forces as it takes the heat off them for gettin involved in millitary adventures that are'nt popular with most of the public.

Whereas, the IRA's actions were heroic?

These threads go too far. The people who sit, secure in their anonimity, and spout inflamatory things on subjects about which they obviously know nothing, do so because people fought and sometimes died for your freedom to do that.

Mods... is this, or is this not a Big Brother forum?

[Hero1]

Originally Posted by Livia

Whereas, the IRA's actions were heroic?

These threads go too far. The people who sit, secure in their anonimity, and spout inflamatory things on subjects about which they obviously know nothing, do so because people fought and sometimes died for your freedom to do that.

Mods... is this, or is this not a Big Brother forum?

That is a bit offensive, aren't our soilders meant to be fighting for freddom of speech? Why then do you want to take it away from us.

[Hero1]

Originally Posted by johnx

The war hero thing is over the top.Steves favourite song "The British Soldier" is about young working class lads joining the army to escape the dole cue to be sent to a conflict they knew and cared little about.British Govt. didnt consider it a war and we know the army used excessive force on ocassion.Some of their actions were far from heroic.The media want the people of the UK to worship the armed forces as it takes the heat off them for gettin involved in millitary adventures that are'nt popular with most of the public.

Eh?

Anyway I look at the police, nurses, doctors and firebrigade as more intelligent heroes out there.

People like Andre Agassi are true heroes, people who go out of their ways and do something to IMPROVES people's lives, start up academies and educated the poor and make a real difference to people lives.

How a parade of cluster bombs launched on residential area's are might to improve lives beggars belief.

[Abhorsen]

Originally Posted by johnx

The war hero thing is over the top.Steves favourite song "The British Soldier" is about young working class lads joining the army to escape the dole cue to be sent to a conflict they knew and cared little about.British Govt. didnt consider it a war and we know the army used excessive force on ocassion.Some of their actions were far from heroic.The media want the people of the UK to worship the armed forces as it takes the heat off the Govt. for gettin involved in millitary adventures that are'nt popular with most of the public.

Well said.

And it's a good point about the poor being sent off like fodder in wars. The reason why the media/government push the 'hero' image is to keep young dumb lads queuing up to die etc. It has always been the same, and if you think that kind of propaganda is recent you should check out the vast amount of information there is about WW1 propaganda specifically designed to get young poor men to join up with the reality being most would die.

To perpetrate the myth/lie of the image of 'hero solder' is actually a disservice to those who serve in the forces, as well as to the young poor males and females who end up joining up as a last resort.

I don't see ministers offspring out there! But, if you have a private education and great choice of options in life you wouldn't need to put your life and limb on the line for a measly few thousand pounds a year.

[walter]

people only make out hes a hero because he got blown up and has no legs and eye. had he come out of it fine and entered the house no one would be saying this and would be put up for nomination by now

[stoney]

Originally Posted by walter

people only make out hes a hero because he got blown up and has no legs and eye. had he come out of it fine and entered the house no one would be saying this and would be put up for nomination by now

but the difference with that scenario is , unforunately,the producers would never have put him in the house as we all know

[monx]

Soldiers sign up to put their life on the line in order to protect and preserve the freedoms we enjoy. It doesnt matter what reason they had for joining, once they are signed up they are expected to go where ever the army sends them. They do not question their sacrifice they just do it ... for that reason alone they are heros in my opinion.

Steve is a hero because he willingly put himself in the line of fire. That said, I cant say that i like him and found his behaviour with Keely rather uncomfortable to watch and I am sure his wife and children will have been disgusted. I dont think him being a war hero means that he automatically wins Big Brother. To be honest as it is nothing but a big popularity test he will probably come out the first time he is up for eviction.

[Alpertinator]

OP... you didn't stop to think that the reason he's chubby is cos' he's 41 and he has had no legs since he was 19! Being a double amputee makes it very hard to stay in good shape. I'm sure if his legs weren't blown off he would have remained in good shape into his 30's at least and so there would have been no reason to kick him out of the army before he would have decided to retire.

[Hero1]

He is still strong though isnt he.

[CaudleHalbard]

People often drift into the armed forces because they can't get a job anywhere else!

Not saying this is necessarily the case for Steve. But I certainly agree that being blown up by a bomb doesn't make you a hero. During the troubles in N. Ireland plenty of people were blown up by bombs..... including many in England (London, Birminhgam etc). Mostly civilians.

They aren't held out as heroes.

[stoney]

Originally Posted by CaudleHalbard

People often drift into the armed forces because they can't get a job anywhere else!

Not saying this is necessarily the case for Steve. But I certainly agree that being blown up by a bomb doesn't make you a hero. During the troubles in N. Ireland plenty of people were blown up by bombs..... including many in England (London, Birminhgam etc). Mostly civilians.

They aren't held out as heroes.

but did those civilians walk about in uniform as targets for those cowards

[Julie10]

Originally Posted by Abhorsen

Why all the ******* about Steve being a war hero? There are plenty of people who have been blown up by bombs, that does not make them a hero, it makes them a victim.

Steve joined the army of his own free will, he got paid for it, they gave him a good life and a good living. That is NOT a hero. Even if he hadn't been bombed he would have been thrown out of the army for his fat arse, that weight would not be fit for the army.

Steve is milking it.

Do you know if he was fat before his horrific injuries? He probably gained weight while recovering when he was unable to exercise.

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Abhorsen

Why all the ******* about Steve being a war hero? There are plenty of people who have been blown up by bombs, that does not make them a hero, it makes them a victim.

Steve joined the army of his own free will, he got paid for it, they gave him a good life and a good living. That is NOT a hero. Even if he hadn't been bombed he would have been thrown out of the army for his fat arse, that weight would not be fit for the army.

Steve is milking it.

He was injured whilst doing his job, a dangerous job! If brave men like him didn't join the army - blokes like you would be made to do it through National Service - so he is a hero in my book and the that of many others! Thank God for men like him rather than those like you - that's all I can say!

[Alpertinator]

Originally Posted by Abhorsen

It is silly to suggest that people in the army don't enjoy what they do. I have friends in the forces and they love their job. You really have no idea. You would be shocked if you really heard what solders discuss among themselves. LOL.

You're the fella' who has no idea. You think nobody who gets blown up like that is a hero? I guess you and me each have a very different perception of the word hero.

Originally Posted by Abhorsen

You all think of serving solders as something you have seen in a movie or TV, the *nice* comfortable acceptable face of the forces. You would not be calling them 'our boys' if you really knew what they get up to and actually enjoy doing in their line of work.

Grow up.

Harsh generalisation. I don't conform to the stereo-typical soldier. I take soldiers as they are presented to me I'll say. For example, the men of Easy company portrayed in Band of Brothers, I accept that they were very heroic men, but that they did have flaws. Like when they were brutally beating a man from Item company, a man of their very same regiment.

I'm aware that soldiers aren't out and out heroes. Some of the soldiers serving in the middle east in this generation... apparently... do some horrific things, to enemy prisoners and such. But let's be honest, they're just a few bad apples. Most of the people serving out there are very brave and honourable.

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Alpertinator

You're the fella' who has no idea. You think nobody who gets blown up like that is a hero? I guess you and me each have a very different perception of the word hero.



Harsh generalisation. I don't conform to the stereo-typical soldier. I take soldiers as they are presented to me I'll say. For example, the men of Easy company portrayed in Band of Brothers, I accept that they were very heroic men, but that they did have flaws. Like when they were brutally beating a man from Item company, a man of their very same regiment.

I'm aware that soldiers aren't out and out heroes. Some of the soldiers serving in the middle east in this generation... apparently... do some horrific things, to enemy prisoners and such. But let's be honest, they're just a few bad apples. Most of the people serving out there are very brave and honourable.

This!

[MTVN]

The word "hero" is overused so much these days. Why are soldiers heros? Sure they're brave and they risk their lives, but then so do the Taleban, so do the IRA, are they heroes as well?

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by MTVN

The word "hero" is overused so much these days. Why are soldiers heros? Sure they're brave and they risk their lives, but then so do the Taleban, so do the IRA, are they heroes as well?

The Taliban are dictators who kill their own if they don't fall into line - if that is your idea of heros - god help us!

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

The Taliban are dictators who kill their own if they don't fall into line - if that is your idea of heros - god help us!

No, thats not my idea of heroes, but I dont consider the Army heroes either.

The Taleban risk their lives, like the Army, they are technically brave, like the Army. So why is it that people say "soldiers are such heroes, risking their lives for their country", when surely, by that definition, the Taleban are heroes also

[Alpertinator]

Originally Posted by Abhorsen

And it's a good point about the poor being sent off like fodder in wars. The reason why the media/government push the 'hero' image is to keep young dumb lads queuing up to die etc. It has always been the same, and if you think that kind of propaganda is recent you should check out the vast amount of information there is about WW1 propaganda specifically designed to get young poor men to join up with the reality being most would die.

Oh my god, you are still overlooking the simple point that just because the conflict is unneccesary and a sign of the corruption of our government, it doesn't mean the servicemen and women are not heroes. They are heroes, even though the conflict is wrong. The government is responsible for that. The armed forces don't choose where they go and fight, they just do their job, and their job is a heroic one - same as for firefighters... and policemen... I guess (police forces in the UK are basically neutered the way I see it but that's a different issue).

How many times have people gone over this subject now? Seems to be a new thread about it everyday. Its pretty boring really.

[Bonbons81]

"hero (male) and heroine (female) came to refer to characters who, in the face of danger and adversity or from a position of weakness, display courage and the will for self sacrifice" - wikipedia gotta love it!!

The word hero means different things to different people, if people think Steve is a hero then he is in their eyes and vice versa there is no right or wrong answer on this one!

I think he is inspirational for what he has dealt with and overcome, to many, especially those who can relate to him on that level I can imagine he is a hero...

All that said I don't actually like him as a person and defo don't want him to win!!

[johnx]

My advice to anyone interested in this is to read a few books.Read about the British Army,Taliban,IRA,UVF,Irish/British history,WW1/WW2,Vietnam etc.etc.Dont just rely on a tabloid newspaper or few minutes in a news bulletin to get your opinions.Watch some documentaries.Believe it or not youl be better able to form a balanced opinion.