[Nedusa]

I pray they win as many as possible and are asked to help form a coalition Govt.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

I pray they win as many as possible and are asked to help form a coalition Govt.

A Conservative / UKIP coailition would be an absolute nightmare. Even the Tories wouldn't want to go for it, because realistically, the Tories don't want to leave the EU. They just shy away from outright stating that it should never happen. The reason for this, is that the Conservatives do actually understand that leaving the EU - whilst a popular idea with naive xenophobes - is actually economically ****ing retarded.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

A Conservative / UKIP coailition would be an absolute nightmare. Even the Tories wouldn't want to go for it, because realistically, the Tories don't want to leave the EU. They just shy away from outright stating that it should never happen. The reason for this, is that the Conservatives do actually understand that leaving the EU - whilst a popular idea with naive xenophobes - is actually economically ****ing retarded.

Whilst I agree with everything you say, a Conservative/UKIP coalition would be a sure way of killing UKIP off for good.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Whilst I agree with everything you say, a Conservative/UKIP coalition would be a sure way of killing UKIP off for good.

Well, it worked for the Lib Dems!

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

A Conservative / UKIP coailition would be an absolute nightmare. Even the Tories wouldn't want to go for it, because realistically, the Tories don't want to leave the EU. They just shy away from outright stating that it should never happen. The reason for this, is that the Conservatives do actually understand that leaving the EU - whilst a popular idea with naive xenophobes - is actually economically ****ing retarded.

In your extremely poorly informed opinion. My opinion is the exact opposite.

I would be willing to wager that none of you pro EU stalwarts are even conversant with the real facts about the EU - from its Nazi origins to its current day corrupt and sinister covert agenda.

I posted a photo 8 posts back hoping that someone would comment or query it, but to no avail.

Do you know its relevancy here?

[user104658]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

In your extremely poorly informed opinion. My opinion is the exact opposite.

I would be willing to wager that none of you pro EU stalwarts are even conversant with the real facts about the EU - from its Nazi origins to its current day corrupt and sinister covert agenda.

I posted a photo 8 posts back hoping that someone would comment or query it, but to no avail.

Do you know its relevancy here?

And any of this is relevant to the economic impact of leaving the EU? It doesn't matter if it was founded by and is still operated by goat slaughtering Satan worshippers... Leaving it would cause untold economic damage, and the only reason the Tories even entertain the idea of an in/out referendum is to appease people who have no comprehension of that.

The reason UKIP wants out of Europe is because it's full of idiots and racists who would blame stubbing their toe on the shoddy workmanship of a Polish joiner if they could find a link.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

And any of this is relevant to the economic impact of leaving the EU? It doesn't matter if it was founded by and is still operated by goat slaughtering Satan worshippers... Leaving it would cause untold economic damage, and the only reason the Tories even entertain the idea of an in/out referendum is to appease people who have no comprehension of that.

The reason UKIP wants out of Europe is because it's full of idiots and racists who would blame stubbing their toe on the shoddy workmanship of a Polish joiner if they could find a link.

Well it is relevant, but let's leave that aside then for now (even though other posts have veered outside the strict parameters of the topic) and let's continue this as a civil and structured debate.

Can you post corroborating reasons for your statement that: "Leaving it (the EU)would cause untold economic damage"?

[MTVN]

On the economic point: instability is one of the biggest curses of economies and businesses everywhere, a lot of major companies have expressed worries about even having a referendum on Europe never mind us leaving altogether. It won't be so simple as continuing to trade while being politically separate, there would be incredibly laborious negotiations as we try and unravel our EU membership and then once that's done we would then need to start the equally long task of negotiating on what terms exactly our relationship will be with the rest of Europe. People talk about Switzerland but as I understand it their relationship with the EU is the product of years of complex agreements and treaties which is not particularly stable. If you separate yourself from the EU and reject it then we completely lose the ability to affect change from within and be a part of reforming the EU for the benefit of all that does need to happen.

[billy123]

UKIP are nothing more than the monday club 2.0 they hope to grab enough seats to form a coalition with the tories.
If they dont manage to do it then Farage and the whole carnival will be toast.
The Kippers are nothing more than Elm tree guest house buddys scum of the political world.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by bobnot

UKIP are nothing more than the monday club 2.0 they hope to grab enough seats to form a coalition with the tories.
If they dont manage to do it then Farage and the whole carnival will be toast.
The Kippers are nothing more than Elm tree guest house buddys scum of the political world.

what rot

[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

what rot

Why is it rot? If UKIP fail to gain any sort of influence at this election, they will be an irrelevance (once more) by the time the next one rolls round. They're enjoying their 15 minutes of fame but it won't come to much unless it's capitalised upon this year.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Why is it rot? If UKIP fail to gain any sort of influence at this election, they will be an irrelevance (once more) by the time the next one rolls round. They're enjoying their 15 minutes of fame but it won't come to much unless it's capitalised upon this year.

another sooth sayer who has the ability to see into the future





who will win the national then?

[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

another sooth sayer who has the ability to see into the future





who will win the national then?

Pointless tactic LT. We all make predictions or we wouldn't believe anything at all. I'm no more claiming to know the future than you are when you state that we would be better off out of Europe .

[user104658]

Methinks some people have heard it stated that the US is our biggest trading partner as an individual country and somehow taken that to mean that they are worth more than the entire European Union .

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Methinks some people have heard it stated that the US is our biggest trading partner as an individual country and somehow taken that to mean that they are worth more than the entire European Union .

Put me down in a medieval stylie...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

Put me down in a medieval stylie...

It's because of Kirk, he's having an effect on the whole forum and making it more old fashioned. (He was born in medieval times, legend has it).

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

It's because of Kirk, he's having an effect on the whole forum and making it more old fashioned. (He was born in medieval times, legend has it).

Forsooth, methinks you could be right.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

It's because of Kirk, he's having an effect on the whole forum and making it more old fashioned. (He was born in medieval times, legend has it).

Biblical, the word you were searching for was Biblical

[user104658]

Most of those things have absolutely nothing to do with EU membership. You can't just blame all of the UK's **** ups on Europe and pretend that everything would be perfect if we had stayed out... We've managed to create all of these inefficiencies and mismanagements all by ourselves.

[Nedusa]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Most of those things have absolutely nothing to do with EU membership. You can't just blame all of the UK's **** ups on Europe and pretend that everything would be perfect if we had stayed out... We've managed to create all of these inefficiencies and mismanagements all by ourselves.

Maybe ...maybe not, but to hear people go on and on about the benefits of being in Europe bearing in mind the state of the Country, I for one struggle to see how this so called benefit has translated itself into helping or increasing the quality of life of the man on the street.

I have listed in this post and others the negative effects of being in Europe and how this has had a detrimental effect on most peoples lives.

So where are the benefits....???? can someone list them .... Anyone....

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

Maybe ...maybe not, but to hear people go on and on about the benefits of being in Europe bearing in mind the state of the Country, I for one struggle to see how this so called benefit has translated itself into helping or increasing the quality of life of the man on the street.

I have listed in this post and others the negative effects of being in Europe and how this has had a detrimental effect on most peoples lives.

So where are the benefits....???? can someone list them .... Anyone....

Nope...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

Nope...

I'm not sure we can trust your assessment of Europe anymore Livia, you stated that the US is a bigger trading partner than the EU as part of your reasoning and have yet to even acknowledge that you were indisputably incorrect .

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'm not sure we can trust your assessment of Europe anymore Livia, you stated that the US is a bigger trading partner than the EU as part of your reasoning and have yet to even acknowledge that you were indisputably incorrect .

I'm not sure you're "discussing" anything are you TS? Looks like a long monologue of where everyone else is going wrong to me. :-)

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Livia

Nope...

Wow,I am surprised at that answer, there are rarely ever situations where there are only negatives and no positives at all.
That is something you have always said before too which I have always respected you for saying too.

There must be strong reasons why big businesses want us in the EU, just from the business angle of things.
Some aren't bothered about the EU admittedly but I feel sure you know fine well the bulk of business want the easiest access to EU markets and the UK in the EU.

You really don't believe in this world as things are,that nations are better united and connected than being separatist.
You say there are no positives at all to the EU,that is a shocker really.

For me,being part of something is far better than watching it but never having any say in it at all, and that is why with such a strong and massive place like the EU in place, I see only danger in a nation like the UK not being in it.

I also am sure you know too, that to leave but to trade with the EU, the UK would still have to accept strict EU conditions to do so but being outside we would have no control over such conditions, or how they would be applied in the future either.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

So where are the benefits....???? can someone list them .... Anyone....

I can't see you agreeing with this but allowing free movement of people within the EU has proven to be very fruitful for our economy. And lets not forget that hundreds of thousands of Brits work or retire to other EU countries. There are as many Brits living in other EU countries as there are EU citizens living in Britain.

The Fiscal effects of immigration is an interesting read http://www.cream-migration.org/publ_.../CDP_22_13.pdf

There are many benefits of remaining in the EU and they are their for you to peruse if only you are interested enough to read them.