[JerseyWins]

The drama now and it all started with Ross picking Jared

Now the suspense... will we see the first trade go through in this game or will Raph keep his picks and potentially pick a recruit by accident?

[Raph]

Originally Posted by Mokka

it was general face palm to the whole conversation I read...

I really hope you don't pick Sharry now... you don't deserve her

Sure, equally rude. Hey, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say it Ever heard of that saying?

And I don't deserve her? Have no idea what you're on about. I'm proud that I never retaliate or provoke, i'm here to discuss my views and have productive discourse. No time for negativity I remember a time when you were much the same!

[Mokka]

Originally Posted by Raph

Nah not so much. I just think he's a straight white male and those are the best statistically speaking because of social constructs and all that. Really I want to stan Sharry but she won't win as a WOC.

Alright then... let's discuss.

In this statement you are basically saying you are judging these people based on their gender and colour... or am I miss reading something...

straight white males are better then WOC is what I am seeing.

and yes, quite frankly I see a lot of problems with that philosophy in life and yes in watching and commenting on these shows. It's a perpetration of hundreds of years of stereotyping that I can not abide by.

the whole recruit vs superfan thing ... I honestly could care less about.

[Raph]

Originally Posted by Mokka

Alright then... let's discuss.

In this statement you are basically saying you are judging these people based on their gender and colour... or am I miss reading something...

straight white males are better then WOC is what I am seeing.

and yes, quite frankly I see a lot of problems with that philosophy in life and yes in watching and commenting on these shows. It's a perpetration of hundreds of years of stereotyping that I can not abide by.

the whole recruit vs superfan thing ... I honestly could care less about.

POC have a harder time on Big Brother. Statistics regarding who makes the end say it all. So of course strategically you're at a disadvantage if you pick a POC, especially a WOC (Only one has won in over 20 seasons of the US format). Surely you're on here enough to know that I am an active feminist as well as an activist for POC, so I have no idea where you could've gotten confused with my posts.

Well clearly you do care about the recruit v superfan thing because it perpetuated you to instigate with that rude emoticon, don't you think?

[LukeB]

Originally Posted by Raph

Sure, equally rude. Hey, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say it Ever heard of that saying?

And I don't deserve her? Have no idea what you're on about. I'm proud that I never retaliate or provoke, i'm here to discuss my views and have productive discourse. No time for negativity I remember a time when you were much the same!

and another note, this whole superfan criticising or moaning/face palming is a bit silly and unnecessary.. who cares about who stans who.. the people who stan super fans on here(not many)don't moan about people liking recruits etc. I don't know why it bothers people... it's a forum full of different opinions. let people live.

[Raph]

Originally Posted by LukeB

and another that note, this whole superfan criticising or moaning/face palming is a bit silly and unnecessary.. who cares about who stans who.. the people who stan super fans on here(not many)don't moan about people liking recruits etc. I don't know why it bothers people... it's a forum full of different opinions. let people live.

Thank you Luke It's a shame people can't respect others opinions, it's really not a difficult thing to do.

[Ross.]

Originally Posted by JerseyWins

The drama now and it all started with Ross picking Jared

Controversy is my middle name

[Mokka]

Originally Posted by Raph

Nah not so much. I just think he's a straight white male and those are the best statistically speaking because of social constructs and all that. Really I want to stan Sharry but she won't win as a WOC.

Originally Posted by Raph

POC have a harder time on Big Brother. Statistics regarding who makes the end say it all. So of course strategically you're at a disadvantage if you pick a POC, especially a WOC (Only one has won in over 20 seasons of the US format). Surely you're on here enough to know that I am an active feminist as well as an activist for POC, so I have no idea where you could've gotten confused with my posts.

Well clearly you do care about the recruit v superfan thing because it perpetuated you to instigate with that rude emoticon, don't you think?

i already said... the facepalm was for the whole conversation...

Last years BB had two POC in the final 4 and 0 straight white males
Season 2, a straight white female carried the winner to the end
Season 1, the final two were non-straight male of colour and straight white female....

So, since it is BB Can.... I don't get why you need to stereotype and marginalize people at all based on their colour, gender, or sexual preferences... I don't see how you can use stats to justify it. It is quiet frankly an offensive opinion that I can't respect at all... I mean you are entitled to it sure.... but I doesn't make it right, and it does not mean I need to respect it

[Raph]

Originally Posted by Mokka

i already said... the facepalm was for the whole conversation...

Last years BB had two POC in the final 4 and 0 straight white males
Season 2, a straight white female carried the winner to the end
Season 1, the final two were non-straight male of colour and straight white female....

So, since it is BB Can.... I don't get why you need to stereotype and marginalize people at all based on their colour, gender, or sexual preferences... I don't see how you can use stats to justify it. It is quiet frankly an offensive opinion that I can't respect at all... I mean you are entitled to it sure.... but I doesn't make it right, and it does not mean I need to respect it

Omg at you thinking I'm stereotyping and marginalizing you clearly have no idea what I'm talking about

[Raph]

Maybe pete or hayden can help explain where im coming from? Pete has a whole thread on it, it's a really interesting read.

[LukeB]

Season 2, a straight white female carried the winner to the end

Pretty sure Neda isn't white

[Mokka]

Originally Posted by LukeB

Pretty sure Neda isn't white

correction noted... even further proving my point though

[LukeB]

not really

[Raph]

In the context of this game and points tho a straight white male has never been one of the first three evictees? And Kyle is bisexual.

[Raph]

And further adding to my point a straight white male superfan has never not made jury

[Calderyon]

Could we resume to picking? This is getting to the point which might end up in a lock. And that would be a shame.

[LukeB]

Originally Posted by Raph

And further adding to my point a straight white male superfan has never not made jury

Oh yes you're right, Jordan could have been the 1st but they had 10 jury members last year

[Pete.]

Originally Posted by Raph

Maybe pete or hayden can help explain where im coming from? Pete has a whole thread on it, it's a really interesting read.

I've only really considered this argument on BBUK where POC are noticably disadvantaged. All I will say re the BBUSA argument is that producers tend to favour white males and the occasional white female. See: mostly white returnees

[Ross.]

I'm not gonna trade because I'm not really sure what I actually gain from it and I'd be so annoyed if I gave away Jared and he went on to do extremely well

Sorry Raph/Adam

[JerseyWins]

Tbh I think the only reason POC are 'statistically' worse is because they are casted much less. I don't think it's because they are inferior in ability in any way nor are they perceived differently (generally)... they have fewer opportunities to win or go far on any given season (because they are cast less), that's what those statistics boil down to IMO.

And I don't think that holds true when it comes to BBCAN anyway. POC and non-straight males/females have done pretty well despite there still being fewer of them than there are straight white males/females.

[Mokka]

Originally Posted by Pete.

I've only really considered this argument on BBUK where POC are noticably disadvantaged. All I will say re the BBUSA argument is that producers tend to favour white males and the occasional white female. See: mostly white returnees

Exactly what I was thinking... And BBUK is public vote and isn't a strategy/ physical competitions game. Further, BBCan, while it hasn't been perfect, hasn't exactly perpetrated these same stereotypes...at least not in the same degree.

Outside of all that... I refuse to look at the human race in breakdowns of statistics of male vs female, white vs black... When I like or root for someone in these games, it's because of who they are and how they represent themselves, and in the N.A format, how they play the game. They aren't cattle at action being picked for thier flank... My favs over the years vary in gender and in ethnicity...because I don't care about those attributes. They aren't the bottom line in what defines a person

[JerseyWins]

But what Calderyon said.. Can we get back to the draft? This is a good discussion though, should maybe be made into its own thread to discuss it.

[JerseyWins]

Originally Posted by Mokka

Exactly what I was thinking... And BBUK is public vote and isn't a strategy/ physical competitions game. Further, BBCan, while it hasn't been perfect, hasn't exactly perpetrated these same stereotypes...at least not in the same degree.

Outside of all that... I refuse to look at the human race in breakdowns of statistics of male vs female, white vs black... When I like or root for someone in these games, it's because of who they are and how they represent themselves, and in the N.A format, how they play the game. They aren't cattle at action being picked for there flank... My favs over the years vary in gender and in ethnicity...because I don't care about those attributes. They aren't the bottom line in what defines a person

[Calderyon]

Originally Posted by JerseyWins

But what Calderyon said.. Can we get back to the draft? This is a good discussion though, should maybe be made into its own thread to discuss it.

I agree that this subject might deserve it´s own thread.

[Raph]

Okay jersey I pick Mitch!