[Niall]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah, see that's the problem I have with organised religions in general, they're out dated and also man made. Religions have had a huge amount of power over people and I think they abused that power to make people do what they want and keep them in line. Personally I don't believe in a God but if there is one I don't see why you need a religion to believe in him properly. Anyway, I guess I'm going a bit off topic with this!

Oh I certainly agree with that. Organised religion has brought copious amounts of what it professes to stop: pain, corruption, greed etc. I think that religion just becomes evil and (ironically) sinful when its an institutionalised thing.

I also hate the self promoting nature of it. The people that irk me the most arre the ones that will try and mention their religion in every conversation. I just can't stand it.

I don't know I just think it should be a private and personal thing kinda.

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Niall,I have to say what brilliant post, it is one of the most thought provoking posts I have read in the 2+years I have been on here.

One of my thoughts as to organised religion is that particularly Christianity,so called because Christians claim to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.
Taking the New Testament which is presented as devoted to his life and teachings, also removing from the New Testament the rather volatile opinions of Paul,who one day tells us to love one another and another is ranting against all sorts of things, I am sure his writings depended on what mood he got up in a morning.What we then find is one simple fact.

In all of the Gospels which are supposedly attributed solely to the life, words and teachings of Jesus, he himself in all those Gospels speaks about many things both new and from the Old Testament too but nowhere,anywhere, does he mention or condemn homosexuality.Not a single word.
It always amazes me that something he himself seems to have not deemed to give any instruction on or condemn whatsoever should be a basis for so much controversy in Christianity by the hierarchy of Christianity too.

Your post Niall is excellent, really well laid out and said.

Thanks Joey. Thats so sweet of you to say.

But yeah, I totally agree with you. The latter half of your post in particular. I find it incredible that the Christian churches try and hold up that archaic rule, especially when you consider that all other rules from that region of the Bible were discarded for being backward and outdated long, long ago. Its insane.

Like Livia said though, things have changed an awful lot in the past century with regards to homosexuality (and sexuality in general), and the number of new denominations of the faith seing it as a natural and moral thing is encouraging. Change doesn't happen overnight I guess (no matter how much I'd like it to ).

[Shaun]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

Okay, if you approach this as something that helps populations then Africa needs a lot more gays (lots of people there) and Europe needs less gays because their populations are not reproducing. Like for every 2 people in Europe they produce something like 1.4 kids (something like that) and this is killing the population.

I can't see how this is relevant. What's your solution? Make them straight? You appear to be playing devil's advocate for the sake of it. If there're so many more important issues (which I agree with, obviously) then that's cool, but they're not exactly relevant to this discussion. Especially when the solution to this problem is so simple ¬_¬

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Redway

Exactly. You see, this is why I don't do religion, particularly not Christianity. A load of cack with rules and regulations that basically stops me from having a life.

I just find it funny that the Church is supposed to be a welcoming place, yet it said that homosexuality is a criminal offense and the person found in a relationship should be stoned to death, which totally contradicts one of its ten commandments, 'do not murder'.

That's why im not religious to the point of what you've just mentioned here, I just believe in a God and that's it, I do think religion has gone way to out of control as the leaders are very prejudicial towards anyone that's different to them, even though God says to love all living things (although I disagree with that as there's some right nutjobs out there) but that is another reason why I could never fanatically follow Christianity and any religion tbh.

Im sorry if the post is to long but I had alot to get off my chest.

[Redway]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

I voted no as a protest against frivolous issues like gay marriage. I long for a world where this is the most important issue but there are so many more important things. I could think of 20 issues in the world that are more important than this off the top of my head.

If you still have the freedom to have a relationship with the person you love, how is your happiness being impaired by society? It's as if gay people think they have a right to be thought of as normal. You don't have the right to be thought of as normal. No one does. And by the way, you are not normal. If your type of relationship was normal, we'd die as a species.

I wish that we'd just outlaw marriage and go back to when marriage was just a product of religion and not of government.

I wondered how long it would be before you people turned up.

Whilst what you're saying is correct, what can you do about it? Make them straight at the wave of a magic hand? I thought not.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Redway

I wondered how long it would be before you people turned up.

Whilst what you're saying is correct, what can you do about it? Make them straight at the wave of a magic hand? I thought not.

Actually the Americans have those straight camps where they try and turn gay people straight.

It's quite ridiculous but it's true as I remember a Family Guy episode doing a social commentary on it.

[Redway]

It is usually never successful, though. Besides, if someone likes being gay then I fail to see why they should change their ways because of a vocal minority of people.

The people who keep banging on about homosexuality being evil and all that nonsense need to realise they are in the minority - not the majority.

Just going by Liberty4eva's argument, following logic, (s)he wants all gays to turn straight at the click of a finger so that they can engage in sexual acts with the result being reproduction should they choose to do so.

Whichever way you look at it, gays aren't going to reproduce with or without sex, so if some gays don't want a sexual relationship (which they don't have to have), if they were made straight they wouldn't reproduce anyway because they wouldn't want to, not because they are able to.

[Mystic Mock]

I agree Redway but it still doesn't stop them from trying this sick and crazy idea.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by iRyan

It's something that stops populations from being over-populated.

Originally Posted by Ninastar

I'm all for it but I think there are far more important things in the world, especially as marriage rates are declining rapidly and divorce rates are higher than ever.

Agree 100%.

[iRyan]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

Okay, if you approach this as something that helps populations then Africa needs a lot more gays (lots of people there) and Europe needs less gays because their populations are not reproducing. Like for every 2 people in Europe they produce something like 1.4 kids (something like that) and this is killing the population.

There are probably thousands to millions of gays in Africa, but it's illegal in basically every country there. And, um, Europe is definitely not underpopulated. Maybe in some areas, but that's because of climate. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.

Homosexuality does help limit overpopulation on some levels, that's a fact. Because it's a significant portion of the population not reproducing, which IS a good thing.

[iRyan]

Originally Posted by 08marsh

What is so funny about it?

[Redway]

Anyway, yeah, there are far more important things in the world than the wording of a title - it's not that bleeding special.