[Redway]

This thread’s more directly related to the blokes but anyone’s welcome to answer.

And what I mean by the thread title is whether you’re truly 100% innocent when it comes to women’s threatened safety or if you’ve contributed subtly in the past even short of actual crime.

[user104658]

Less and less. Anyone who claims zero is frankly lying (or unaware of it).

If you laughed at a mate's dodgy joke when you were 16 - even if you "only did it to fit in" - you played a part.

Personally I would say that's what I'm most guilty of - laughing along (even with an eye-roll) to "locker room banter" even when I didnt find it funny, out of fear that other males would take the piss if I didn't.

Did that right up until my late 20's, being honest.

[bots]

not guilty of any subtle misogyny at all

[Beso]

Period jokes for me.

But I dont find any jokes inappropriate so I couldnt click that one.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by parmnion

Period jokes for me.

But I dont find any jokes inappropriate so I couldnt click that one.

Sorry didn't notice it was a poll. I voted "inappropriate jokes" as described above - and honestly call BS on any man who claims they haven't let those jokes slide or even pretended to chuckle along when they came from their friends or groups of blokes. The poll doesn't just say "have you made them yourself". People should speak up and I hope things are changing, I do now, but I can say for a fact that during my entire time at school and university, I can't think of ONE example of ANY guy sticking his neck out when other guys were making "edgy jokes" about women.

Also clicked dismissing feminism as being totally honest, it's only fairly recent that I was able to see many of the more insidious issues. I've always been pro-equality but I was on board the "... But we already pretty much have that?" train of thought.




... I did not click on dismissing opinions/mansplaining, although I know there are members who probably think I should . My reasoning for this is that I'm dismissive of male opinions too and would say misanthropy fits better there than misogyny.

I am however guilty of in the past not properly listening to the female perspective on issues that affect women more than men (*cough* transrightssorryniamhandvicky) - and trying hard not to do that on a lot of subject areas is a relatively new area of self-reflection for me. You can't logic your way through every issue that doesn't affect you the same way it affects others, doesn't matter if you got super-big-brain

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I am however guilty of in the past not properly listening to the female perspective on issues that affect women more than men (*cough* transrightssorryniamhandvicky) - and trying hard not to do that on a lot of subject areas is a relatively new area of self-reflection for me. You can't logic your way through every issue that doesn't affect you the same way it affects others, doesn't matter if you got super-big-brain

This

[Niamh.]

That's very honest of you TS

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

That's very honest of you TS

I actually talked myself into thinking I should have clicked "guilty of being dismissive" when writing the post but I had already voted . I don't know if I like the term "mansplaining" and I think it's too often misused so has become a bit meaningless (like a lot of words) but yeah I've been guilty of thinking that taking a "detached view" on something is always the best approach, and thus dismissing the female perspective on issues that primarily affect women, when it seems so very obvious that you just can't do that. I'd apply that to all sorts of areas of course; race, social status, mental health, disability etc.

[Niamh.]

Mansplaining is definitely a thing but I agree that it's so overused now it's pretty meaningless

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Mansplaining is definitely a thing but I agree that it's so overused now it's pretty meaningless

Oh I agree.

I saw a woman on Twitter the once say that a guy was mansplaining to her just because he disagreed with her.

The original meaning of the word is getting lost.

Oh and I've just re-read the inappropriate jokes option, I've definitely let jokes of that nature slide in the past.

[Redway]

For those who’ve disagreed with the concept of women and men getting paid the same for the same job, why is that something you’d object to? (This one’s for the honest ones.)

[Elliot]

Trans voices are just as important if not more on an issue that directly pertains to the healthcare trans people should receive <3

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Elliot

Trans voices are just as important if not more on an issue that directly pertains to the healthcare trans people should receive &lt;3

Yes (to equal, not "more") but at the time, what I was guilty of was listening to ONLY transpeople and assuming that they were the only group affected and thus the only group who needed to be considered, which has proven to be incorrect. I thought the concerns women had were "silly" and unfounded but over time have been proven to be woefully wrong, thug leading to an awareness that I should have taken more time to actually hear what people were saying at the time instead of dismissing it thinking I knew better (which is why I chose that answer).

I would briefly add that the conversations I'm thinking of had little to do with denying anyone access to appropriate healthcare, which should of course be a universal human right.

This thread could easily derail though so maybe best not to plough though this discussion here.

[Jessica.]

Ladies, while they're answering the poll we should say how many of the options we have been affected by. 8 for me.

[Kate!]

Originally Posted by Jessica.

Ladies, while they're answering the poll we should say how many of the options we have been affected by. 8 for me.

8 for me also including being touched inappropriately. More than once. Some men seem unable to keep their hands off a pair of breasts.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Jessica.

Ladies, while they're answering the poll we should say how many of the options we have been affected by. 8 for me.

12 for me

[Ammi]

...I had 9 very definite’s that I didn’t post the number yesterday but it was very valid for Jess to suggest that as well, that the ones felt should be noted also...

[Ammi]

...to be honest, though...I’m not always entirely quite clear between misogyny and sexism...I mean some are more obvious but for instance, which would ‘inappropriate jokes’ be...?...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...to be honest, though...I’m not always entirely quite clear between misogyny and sexism...I mean some are more obvious but for instance, which would ‘inappropriate jokes’ be...?...

I don't actually think the distinction is all that important; it would only be to "lessen" one definition vs the other for the sake of the perpetrator and stop them launching into the defensive whining... which those that way inclined would probably do anyway whether you called it misogyny or sexism. I can't personally think of many examples of sexism that don't come from some level of unconscious misogyny.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...to be honest, though...I’m not always entirely quite clear between misogyny and sexism...I mean some are more obvious but for instance, which would ‘inappropriate jokes’ be...?...

I would say the two are a lot of times entwined but misogyny is more of an actual hatred for women. Like you could be sexist but not a misogynist but all misogynists are sexists (that sounds like one of those Maths/IQ test questions ) These are the definitions

sexism
noun
prejudice, stereotyping, or discrimination, typically against women, on the basis of sex.

misogyny
noun
dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women.

[Kate!]

Its a true story though LT.

[Alf]

Adam came first, didn't he?

Then he took one of his ribs and made Eve, he probably only made Eve to do a bit of cooking, cleaning and washing up. I bet he regrets it now.

[Kate!]

Then Eve took away their innocence by eating from the apple and inviting Adam to do the same.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Kate!

Then Eve took away their innocence by eating from the apple and inviting Adam to do the same.

I thought that was Snow White?

[Kate!]

Originally Posted by Alf

I thought that was Snow White?

No. Snow White ate a poisoned apple and went into a coma