[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

‘Why listen to facts they don’t want to hear’ - you really should follow your own advice - as your words apply just as equally to those on the left/PC brigade as to those on the right - but you wouldn’t think so listening to your constant one-sided diatribe.

The left are not the experts on truth, morality and right and wrong and do not have the moral right to enforce their opinions onto everyone else living in the country to fit with their own views and neither are you on who is or isn’t gullible and hearing what they want to hear - those in glass houses! Dictatorships come in many shapes and sizes!

This isn't an issue of the right or left. Why must you always try to simplify every thread into your own diatribe against the left and the 'PC brigade' (the latter of which is quite funny considering how PC you can be).

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

This isn't an issue of the right or left. Why must you always try to simplify every thread into your own diatribe against the left and the 'PC brigade' (the latter of which is quite funny considering how PC you can be).

Objecting to people trying to stick the ‘racist’ label on others in an attempt to undermine their opinions is not PC and your constant attempts to imply so is laughable. Deflection at its worst.

Many of your posts, including the one I responded to, have that same tone to them and your comments that people only hear what they want to hear was clearly aimed at anyone who supports America’s right to protect its borders with an underlying tone that such people only support it because they are racist and right wing. There are many other reasons why people support it.

You set the tone so don’t complain about the response. As I said ‘hearing what they want to hear’ applies to many people and has nothing to do with political stance. You were the one suggesting it was - you don’t have to actually say the words to make your meaning perfectly clear, sadly.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Objecting to people trying to stick the ‘racist’ label on others in an attempt to undermine their opinions is not PC and your constant attempts to imply so is laughable. Deflection at its worst.

Many of your posts, including the one I responded to, have that same tone to them and your comments that people only hear what they want to hear was clearly aimed at anyone who supports America’s right to protect its borders with an underlying tone that such people only support it because they are racist and right wing. There are many other reasons why people support it.

You set the tone so don’t complain about the response. As I said ‘hearing what they want to hear’ applies to many people and has nothing to do with political stance. You were the one suggesting it was - you don’t have to actually say the words to make your meaning perfectly clear, sadly.

So basically you want to throw the whole thread offtopic, cool.

As I said to Parm and as Lime has said. This is not a left or right issue. This is an issue of whether or not you agree with state sanctioned child abuse because that is what this is. You seem to agree with it under the guise of 'protecting the borders' (what harm do children present, i wonder?).

This post has little to do with the topic at hand and more to do with your own insecurities.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

So basically you want to throw the whole thread offtopic, cool.

As I said to Parm and as Lime has said. This is not a left or right issue. This is an issue of whether or not you agree with state sanctioned child abuse because that is what this is. You seem to agree with it under the guise of 'protecting the borders' (what harm do children present, i wonder?).

This post has little to do with the topic at hand and more to do with your own insecurities.

It does as it challenges your ridiculous ascertions that only the racist and right wing support it. You are the one constantly making political digs either directly or indirectly.

At no time did I say I support ‘locking up children’ (you love using emotive language to try to politicise your point) I just pointed out that ultimately the parents should be thinking about the effects on THEIR children of trying to enter America illegally. I wonder how many have actually tried to gain entry legally before going straight for the illegal route.

What do you suggest - America just opens its borders to all regardless of the consequences on its citizens. Btw - they have rights too!

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It does as it challenges your ridiculous ascertions that only the racist and right wing support it. You are the one constantly making political digs either directly or indirectly.

At no time did I say I support ‘locking up children’ (you love using emotive language to try to politicise your point) I just pointed out that ultimately the parents should be thinking about the effects on THEIR children of trying to enter America illegally. I wonder how many have actually tried to gain entry legally before going straight for the illegal route.

What do you suggest - America just opens its borders to all regardless of the consequences on its citizens. Btw - they have rights too!

If you're gonna make assumptions can you at least make sure are on the same hemisphere of being right? I'm sick of dealing with your insecurities about racism that causes you to read something out of nothing in every post you oppose. Stick to what people are actually saying, not the garbled version of what you want to hear.

How is it the parents' fault that their children are being taken away from them when it's never happened before unless smuggling or child abuse was involved? Before Trump, immigrants were never separated from their children like this. WHY are children being taken from their parents like this when it never happened before? What is the purpose of doing so aside from cruelty?

As for my 'emotive' language, it's accurate. Go look up any psychologist or expert on abuse's opinions on this matter and they pretty much all say the same thing. This is child abuse.

As I've said before, you cannot deny that this is happening, you cannot deny it's not child abuse or morally reprehensible. This is not an issue or left or right or PC as you are so desperate to make it, this is an issue of whether or not you agree with this practice.

Do you agree with seperating children from their parents in their thousands? Yes or no. There's nothing else to it.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

If you're gonna make assumptions can you at least make sure are on the same hemisphere of being right? I'm sick of dealing with your insecurities about racism that causes you to read something out of nothing in every post you oppose. Stick to what people are actually saying, not the garbled version of what you want to hear.

How is it the parents' fault that their children are being taken away from them when it's never happened before unless smuggling or child abuse was involved? Before Trump, immigrants were never separated from their children like this. WHY are children being taken from their parents like this when it never happened before? What is the purpose of doing so aside from cruelty?

As for my 'emotive' language, it's accurate. Go look up any psychologist or expert on abuse's opinions on this matter and they pretty much all say the same thing. This is child abuse.

As I've said before, you cannot deny that this is happening, you cannot deny it's not child abuse or morally reprehensible. This is not an issue or left or right or PC as you are so desperate to make it, this is an issue of whether or not you agree with this practice.

Do you agree with seperating children from their parents in their thousands? Yes or no. There's nothing else to it.

They can hardly fail not to know now can they - news of it is everywhere - but still they try! I’m sick of people who try to exonerate parents of their parental responsibilities when it suits. What do you suggest then - they are locked up with their parents instead. Neither way is ideal but they can’t just let them in until a decision is made as they will ‘disappear’ into the country just as have millions here due to lax laws.

If people have genuine concerns for their safety they should be able to enter as genuine refugees. Economical refugees are a different case and should be judged on the attributes/skills they can offer to the country - the same as for the rest of us.

Many criminals in America are illegalls and the American people have a right to protection from criminals - they have children too!

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

They can hardly fail not to know now can they - news of it is everywhere - but still they try! I’m sick of people who try to exonerate parents of their parental responsibilities when it suits. What do you suggest then - they are locked up with their parents instead. Neither way is ideal but they can’t just let them in until a decision is made as they will ‘disappear’ into the country just as have millions here due to lax laws.

If people have genuine concerns for their safety they should be able to enter as genuine refugees. Economical refugees are a different case and should be judged on the attributes/skills they can offer to the country - the same as for the rest of us.

Many criminals in America are illegalls and the American people have a right to protection from criminals - they have children too!

Wow, you really don't understand or have any empathy for immigrants, do you?

Do you think people are just like 'hmm, I fancy going to the US ilegally today, Honey, get the kids and we'll make a day trip out of it!' You've simplified the issue to fit the narrative you want to push. People don't take risks like that unless they have no other choice.

Keeping families together is less barbaric then separating babies and toddlers from their parents and it's what was done for decades before Trump decided to inject his own brand of cruelty into proceedings. I don't get the 'same as the rest of us' line either. Do British or american citizens get ejected from their countries if they aren't deemed worthy? When did they implement that, I wonder?

Your last sentence is a good example of dehumanisation and it's an assumption based on nothing but your own bias but thank you for basically confirming that you support the seperation of children from their parents, that's all I really needed to know.