[Twosugars]

Black and minority ethnic offenders are far more likely to be sent to prison for drug offences than other defendants, according to groundbreaking research commissioned by the Sentencing Council.

The stark disparity in courtroom outcomes is exposed by the official body that advises judges as it prepares to update guidelines for dealing with drug offenders in England and Wales.

The investigation reinforces concerns raised by the review conducted by the Labour MP David Lammy on behalf of the Ministry of Justice in 2017 that found that BAME individuals face bias in court.

The Sentencing Council’s research concentrated on associations between an offender’s sex and ethnicity and the type and length of sentence they received in three supply-related drug crimes. It drew on statistics from crown court records between 2012 and 2015.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...search-reveals

[Kizzy]

There are disparities between many groups men/ women, black/ white, privileged/ underprivileged, white collar/ blue collar the whole system is flawed.

Seeing examples like this exposes it, our justice system is better than some but needs improvement.

[Twosugars]

Bias in court.

[Twosugars]

Where is Oliver to argue we are all equal?

[Shaun]

Water is wet

[Oliver_W]

Is this a similar thing to the "wage gap" where different positions and hours worked different specific drug crimes result in different pay sentencing? The article didn't say the same drug crimes resulted in different sentences.

Smoking weed while walking down the street is a drug crime, as is pushing class A drugs onto kids. Both drug crimes, both deserve different responses.

[Marsh.]

And you're saying all white drug offences are guilty of smoking weed and the BAME ones are pushing A class drugs onto kids.

Yeah, definitely not racist.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

And you're saying all white drug offences are guilty of smoking weed and the BAME ones are pushing A class drugs onto kids.

Yeah, definitely not racist.

Not at all people of all races do both things, but they don't all get caught.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Not at all people of all races do both things, but they don't all get caught.

And women don't work as many hours as men.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

And women don't work as many hours as men.

They statistically don't.

https://iwpr.org/publications/gender...uture-of-work/

[Beso]

A lot of sentencing is judged upon ones personal circumstances..like jobs, home life etc..most of these kids being sentenced would have had a social visit...so perhaps that's where the blame lies...social sevices.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

They statistically don't.

https://iwpr.org/publications/gender...uture-of-work/

I didn't really ask you to justify why men and women doing the SAME job should be paid differently but I know you like to be different.

[Swan]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

I didn't really ask you to justify why men and women doing the SAME job should be paid differently but I know you like to be different.

No you didn't, you said 'and women don't work as many hours as men' (which statistically they don't). Nothing to do with the SAME job argument. Doing the same job, and the same hours is different to not working as many hours. But well played on trying to divert the argument.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Swan

No you didn't, you said 'and women don't work as many hours as men' (which statistically they don't). Nothing to do with the SAME job argument. Doing the same job, and the same hours is different to not working as many hours. But well played on trying to divert the argument.

HE brought up differing hours/jobs despite the wage gap being about men and women doing the SAME job.

Not the topic of the thread but he brought up one inequality to justify another.

Please read the thread if you're going to join a discussion.

[Swan]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

HE brought up differing hours/jobs despite the wage gap being about men and women doing the SAME job.

Not the topic of the thread but he brought up one inequality to justify another.

Please read the thread if you're going to join a discussion.

Ok Marsh.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

HE brought up differing hours/jobs despite the wage gap being about men and women doing the SAME job.

Which doesn't happen, if they work the same jobs and the same hours.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Swan

Ok Marsh.

You're very welcome, Swan.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Which doesn't happen, if they work the same jobs and the same hours.

Of course it doesn't Oliver.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Of course it doesn't Oliver.

It literally doesn't, this BBC source goes into more detail

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-37198653

The tl;dr is that the difference in pay is caused by different jobs and working hours, and that they pay disappears for women if you don't count part time workers.

[Oliver_W]

As for the apparent disparity in sentencing, I think juries should be better allocated. I don't necessarily mean black defendents should have an all black jury, but they certainly shouldn't have an all white one.

[Marsh.]

"It's not just about discrimination"

Oliver: Discrimination doesn't exist, guys!

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

"It's not just about discrimination"

Oliver: Discrimination doesn't exist, guys!

I've never said discrimination doesn't exist but unless there's some evidence out there, we can safely assume equal work=equal pay

[Elliot]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

I've never said discrimination doesn't exist but unless there's some evidence out there, we can safely assume equal work=equal pay

Idts, people usually refer to the ‘raw’ gender pay gap that just takes a median of all the salary of men and women in the workplace, when you take out the factors that people usually bring up when ‘debunking it’ there’s still a gap. I’ve seen most people attribute it to women in general being given less raises and promotions.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

I've never said discrimination doesn't exist but unless there's some evidence out there, we can safely assume equal work=equal pay

Yes, you did. You just said there is no discrimination contributing to the pay gap.

So, no you can't safely assume it's equal because it's not.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Elliot

Idts, people usually refer to the ‘raw’ gender pay gap that just takes a median of all the salary of men and women in the workplace, when you take out the factors that people usually bring up when ‘debunking it’ there’s still a gap. I’ve seen most people attribute it to women in general being given less raises and promotions.

True, there's probably more of a "promotions gap" than "pay gap"