[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Livia

I am white. I've known racism. I've known racism on here. Recently.

I wonder what would happen if Jewish people walked down the road in Berlin dressed up in paramilitary garb carrying banners that say "you're lucky we want reparations and not revenge".

i know Livia, racism against jewish people is also wrong, and something what shouldn't be here anymore these modern times, i would also love for jewish people to be respected more and no longer be targets of discrimination either

they shouldn't do that in Berlin, given far right extremists are taken care of by german government and law enforcement more recent times

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

i know Livia, racism against jewish people is also wrong, and something what shouldn't be here anymore these modern times, i would also love for jewish people to be respected more and no longer be targets of discrimination either

they shouldn't do that in Berlin, given far right extremists are taken care of by german government and law enforcement more recent times

No, I wouldn't want them to do that either, Nicky. Because the Germans responsible for murdering all those people are dead now and those alive are not responsible for the sins of their fathers.

[Liam-]

Originally Posted by Livia

I am white. I've known racism. I've known racism on here. Recently.

I wonder what would happen if Jewish people walked down the road in Berlin dressed up in paramilitary garb carrying banners that say "you're lucky we want reparations and not revenge".

People would understand that it’s a culmination of frustration over a history of hatred, racism and bigotry and be supportive of the cause

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Liam-

People would understand that it’s a culmination of frustration over a history of hatred, racism and bigotry and be supportive of the cause

LOL... Okay.

[Liam-]

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Liam-

People would understand that it’s a culmination of frustration over a history of hatred, racism and bigotry and be supportive of the cause

In an ideal world which I think, surely by now, we know doesn't exist. People should understand, people should be supportive, of course that's what you would like to happen, of course morally speaking that's what should happen. But that doesn't mean it's what would actually happen.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Livia

I am white. I've known racism. I've known racism on here. Recently.

I wonder what would happen if Jewish people walked down the road in Berlin dressed up in paramilitary garb carrying banners that say "you're lucky we want reparations and not revenge".

The Germans went above and beyond to own their history with the jews and paid reparations. You should know this. You still can't point out examples of racism against you on here.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

The Germans went above and beyond to own their history with the jews and paid reparations. You should know this. You still can't point out examples of racism against you on here.

and the UK government bought the freedom of every slave when slavery was abolished. It cost so much that it was only paid off recently. Meaning that recent retirees would have spend their entire life's of taxes paying for it, when their parents or even grandparents wouldn't have lived knowing slavery.

The time for whining about past wrongs has long since passed. Some people really need to get off their crosses.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

and the UK government bought the freedom of every slave when slavery was abolished. It cost so much that it was only paid off recently. Meaning that recent retirees would have spend their entire life's of taxes paying for it, when their parents or even grandparents wouldn't have lived knowing slavery.

The time for whining about past wrongs has long since passed. Some people really need to get off their crosses.

They paid reparations to the slave owners, do you understand the difference? The actual slaves got nothing.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

The Germans went above and beyond to own their history with the jews and paid reparations. You should know this. You still can't point out examples of racism against you on here.

I've pointed out the anti-Semitism but you refuse to accept that it is anti-Semitism. I'm used to that, don't you understand? Because you don't feel what you said was hurtful, doesn't make it so.

[Liam-]

Black people aren’t slaves anymore, why can’t they just be grateful? God!

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Livia

I've pointed out the anti-Semitism but you refuse to accept it's anti-Semitism. I'm used to that, don't you understand? Because you don't feel what you said was hurtful, doesn't make it so.

Let me ask you this, if I was anti semitic and genuinely bigging up Corbyn's anti semitism, why would I have argued with evidence that he isn't anti semitic? Does that make any sense to you? Also, why would I throw Rangers into the mix if it was about hating Jews more than it was about the constant lies spread about Corbyn? You have to do a lot of mental gymnastics to try and get this to work out how you want it to.

I've also seen you laugh and indulge others on here when they've made anti semitic jokes, so again, it just shows that you're using everything you can to lie about me.

Finally, you went to such lengths to get that post removed when pregnant and banned, but since then, you haven't shut up about it, so is that really genuine or just you trying to point score like the other fantasies you've tried to spread?

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

They paid reparations to the slave owners, do you understand the difference? The actual slaves got nothing.

Yeah that does suck. But no-one alive is owed anything, descendants of slaves have no disadvantages compared to descendants of non-slaves. No-one alive owes anything either; as Livia said, we don't inherit the sins of our fathers.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Yeah that does suck. But no-one alive is owed anything, descendants of slaves have no disadvantages compared to descendants of non-slaves. No-one alive owes anything either; as Livia said, we don't inherit the sins of our fathers.

So you've gone from reparations were paid, to suck it up and keep it moving? The Germans owned what they did, and did what they could to make it right, whereas we don't even really teach about slavery or true black history in this country, it's just basically slaves then wilberforce.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Yeah that does suck. But no-one alive is owed anything, descendants of slaves have no disadvantages compared to descendants of non-slaves.

This simply isn't true though. It has been proven time and time again that BAME people and - especially - people with "foreign sounding names" are at a measurable disadvantage in all sorts of areas, from employment, to likelihood of loan approval, and so on. Some of that bias is conscious, a LOT of it is subconscious, but it's there and has been statistically observed and verified.

There's plenty of debate to be had about what the solutions to these disadvantages are, but trying to argue that it doesn't exist is an untenable position.

Whether or not it's directly about being "descended from slaves" is another issue, of course many BAME people don't have slavery in their family tree, but they're subject to the same discriminations that are rooted in the same things.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46927417

https://www.theguardian.com/money/20...ent-undercover

Quoting this with examples of foreign names not doing as well at getting job interviews.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

This simply isn't true though. It has been proven time and time again that BAME people and - especially - people with "foreign sounding names" are at a measurable disadvantage in all sorts of areas, from employment, to likelihood of loan approval, and so on. Some of that bias is conscious, a LOT of it is subconscious, but it's there and has been statistically observed and verified.

Again it's probably more of a class thing. A "white trash" name like ... Krystal Tiffany Candice would get less call-backs than a "black posh" sounding name like Solomon Anthony Gabriel.

If name-response studies mainly used names like Precious and Shoniqua, of course the results are gonna be skewed.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Again it's probably more of a class thing. A "white trash" name like ... Krystal Tiffany Candice would get less call-backs than a "black posh" sounding name like Solomon Anthony Gabriel.



If name-response studies mainly used names like Precious and Shoniqua, of course the results are gonna be skewed.

There are huge and unavoidable overlaps between race and class, though... Yes you can point out that class discrimination exists, and that a lot of BAME discrimination is in fact class discrimination, but then you're left with the question of why such a large number of people in the classes discriminated against are BAME. It's all part of the same cycle.

Its obviously the same somewhere like Los Angeles. Yes, a lot of gang activity, crime and violence is centred around poor communities that are comprised mainly of ethnic minorities. You still have to ask the question... WHY are these poor communities full of ethnic minorities. You'll always end up at the same answer. History, slavery, colonialism, empire.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

This simply isn't true though. It has been proven time and time again that BAME people and - especially - people with "foreign sounding names" are at a measurable disadvantage in all sorts of areas, from employment, to likelihood of loan approval, and so on. Some of that bias is conscious, a LOT of it is subconscious, but it's there and has been statistically observed and verified.

There's plenty of debate to be had about what the solutions to these disadvantages are, but trying to argue that it doesn't exist is an untenable position.

Whether or not it's directly about being "descended from slaves" is another issue, of course many BAME people don't have slavery in their family tree, but they're subject to the same discriminations that are rooted in the same things.

I had the piss ripped out of me at school. They used to sieg heil at me, amongst other things, and try to rhyme insulting stuff with my surname. Same as a girl who's surname was Steptoe. Her life was a misery.... Kids are cruel.

I've worked with a huge number of highly qualified people from all kinds of ethnic backgrounds. So clearly not all black and brown people are being discriminated against.

Also, the slave trade was a 'trade'. White people didn't go into Africa and gather people, they traded stuff with other black people and Arabs. It was ****ed up.... but it was long before any of us were born.

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Livia

I had the piss ripped out of me at school. They used to sieg heil at me, amongst other things, and try to rhyme insulting stuff with my surname. Same as a girl who's surname was Steptoe. Her life was a misery.... Kids are cruel.

I've worked with a huge number of highly qualified people from all kinds of ethnic backgrounds. So clearly not all black and brown people are being discriminated against.

Also, the slave trade was a 'trade'. White people didn't go into Africa and gather people, they traded stuff with other black people and Arabs. It was ****ed up.... but it was long before any of us were born.

Well the Roman Catholic church divided the world up in the 15th century and gave Portugal West Africa and all it's trade as they conquered it. There was even a papal decree about reducing populations and keeping the people in perpetual slavery, so it's not true to say white people didn't go in. Africans themselves obviously played their part, but that last bit is definitely misleading.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

Let me ask you this, if I was anti semitic and genuinely bigging up Corbyn's anti semitism, why would I have argued with evidence that he isn't anti semitic? Does that make any sense to you? Also, why would I throw Rangers into the mix if it was about hating Jews more than it was about the constant lies spread about Corbyn? You have to do a lot of mental gymnastics to try and get this to work out how you want it to.

I've also seen you laugh and indulge others on here when they've made anti semitic jokes, so again, it just shows that you're using everything you can to lie about me.

Finally, you went to such lengths to get that post removed when pregnant and banned, but since then, you haven't shut up about it, so is that really genuine or just you trying to point score like the other fantasies you've tried to spread?

Are you going to mention my pregnancy in every post now?

I can laugh when my friends make anti-Semitic jokes that I know are meant as jokes. You are not my friend.

You said what you said.

You've also told me that Jewish people would get an easier time around the world if they spoke out against Israel. That is the epitome of anti-Semitism. Or didn't you mean that either? Maybe that was a joke too.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

Well the Roman Catholic church divided the world up in the 15th century and gave Portugal West Africa and all it's trade as they conquered it. There was even a papal decree about reducing populations and keeping the people in perpetual slavery, so it's not true to say white people didn't go in. Africans themselves obviously played their part, but that last bit is definitely misleading.

I don't see the Portuguese continually beating themselves up about it.

Africans and Arabs played a big part.

Before we start to go round in circles, I'm done talking to you on this thread.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

but never encountered racial discrimination

all white people are privileged in that way, never experienced that


yes i am white too, and i admit i know nothing about what coloured people go through (if i'm allowed to say it like that)

just because you haven't doesn't mean it doesn't happen, and we haven't used 'coloured' as a descriptor for some time.. person of colour yes.

[Nicky91]

Racism, discrimination in any form whatsoever should have no place in these modern times

i strive for more equality in the world, where everyone respects each other regardless of colour, religion, class, disability

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by Livia

Are you going to mention my pregnancy in every post now?

I can laugh when my friends make anti-Semitic jokes that I know are meant as jokes. You are not my friend.

You said what you said.

You've also told me that Jewish people would get an easier time around the world if they spoke out against Israel. That is the epitome of anti-Semitism. Or didn't you mean that either? Maybe that was a joke too.

No, it was just relevant to set the scene here. You were suffering pregnancy related health issues whilst trawling the forum and reporting my posts to your friends to report, because you were banned and couldn't. I think that sequence of events is important because that's what you're asking people to believe.

And there we have it, friends aren't anti semitic but people you don't like are? That's an interesting approach.

I haven't told you Jewish people would get an easier time if they criticised Israel.