[bitontheslide]

Originally Posted by Alf

Forced to wear a Yellow star. You forgot that example.

ive never been forced to wear a yellow star nor have i seen anyone else being forced to wear a yellow star. Have you been forced to wear one? If not, what the hell are you going on about

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

What does a covid mask "stop you from doing that you like to do"?

Not covering my mouth and nose when I'm going about my everyday business like traveling and shopping. That choice should be mine. And more importantly from the point of view from a business owner, they shouldn't be forced by government to make this mandatory, that business is theirs and that choice should be theirs.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

ive never been forced to wear a yellow star nor have i seen anyone else being forced to wear a yellow star. Have you been forced to wear one? If not, what the hell are you going on about

As weak a get out as your examples were.

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Alf

Not covering my mouth and nose when I'm going about my everyday business like traveling and shopping.

The thing you like to do that wearing a mask stops you from doing is "not wearing a mask". Circular logic that makes no sense - I asked how wearing a mask restricts any other activity.

Again it also is an extremely weak argument unless you live in a world where there are no other rules - often entirely arbitrary rules - that people have to follow day to day when living in a community or society. You have been hesitant to say that you think Flasher Bob should be able to get his meat and veg out on the #26 "if that's what he likes to do". You see that as "different" for some reason.

I have rather long legs. Know what I'd love to do? Get a table seat on th train and put my feet up on the opposite seat. That's something that I personally would very much like to do. Do you know why I don't do it? Even if there's no one else in the carriage? Even if I know my feet are sparkly clean? I don't do it because there's a little sign that says "please don't put your feet on the seats", and because that's not much to ask. Now I could yawn, stretch, pop my boots up on that seat and congratulate myself on being such a non-conformist and rebel for not complying with the fascist system of the foot-rest-police but I don't because ... it's not a big deal.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The thing you like to do that wearing a mask stops you from doing is "not wearing a mask". Circular logic that makes no sense - I asked how wearing a mask restricts any other activity.

Again it also is an extremely weak argument unless you live in a world where there are no other rules - often entirely arbitrary rules - that people have to follow day to day when living in a community or society. You have been hesitant to say that you think Flasher Bob should be able to get his meat and veg out on the #26 "if that's what he likes to do". You see that as "different" for some reason.

I have rather long legs. Know what I'd love to do? Get a table seat on th train and put my feet up on the opposite seat. That's something that I personally would very much like to do. Do you know why I don't do it? Even if there's no one else in the carriage? Even if I know my feet are sparkly clean? I don't do it because there's a little sign that says "please don't put your feet on the seats", and because that's not much to ask. Now I could yawn, stretch, pop mu boots up on that seat and congratulate myself on being such a non-conformist and rebel for not complying with the fascist system of the foot-rest-police but I don't because ... it's not a big deal.

OK, it's probably the meaning behind it, the symbolism behind these authoritarian mandates. Probably a matter of principle..learning from history of what complying with authoritarian rules brings. In a free country no government should have the power to make you muzzle yourself to do a bit of shopping, ride on public transport or go to School. The governments job is to do our administrating.

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Alf

OK, it's probably the meaning behind it, the symbolism behind these authoritarian mandates. Probably a matter of principle..learning from history of what complying with authoritarian rules brings. In a free country no government should have the power to make you muzzle yourself to do a bit of shopping, ride on public transport and go to school.

even with a face mask mandatory you remain living in a free country, with 99% of your freedoms to do whatever you want

just with a simple measure for your health and other people's health



this makes these protesters just look like a bunch of clowns, and also some rude ones who go comparing these times to WW2 times

[Toy Soldier]

Originally Posted by Alf

OK, it's probably the meaning behind it, the symbolism behind these authoritarian mandates. Probably a matter of principle..learning from history of what complying with authoritarian rules brings.

As always I don't entirely disagree but I think opposing the mask mandate must purely be because it's such a "visible" representation of the issue. I think it's a sensible and polite thing for people to do when there's airborne illness around (people in Japan have been doing it for decades for example) and ideally I'd prefer that people do it voluntarily. The part of the Covid authoritarianism that has bothered me most was the "5 miles" rule or the "stay in your county" rule. I think border closures are one thing (and have precedent) but enforcing that people aren't allowed to travel outside of their local area is way over the line for me. As is banning access to outdoor areas - like when I couldn't take the dog for a walk at the beach because they had "closed it" (by fencing off the road leading there). In fact a lot of the early lockdown stuff was ludicrous - not leaving the house at all other than for "30 minutes exercise" even in outdoor areas, closing parks, etc... utter madness.

The masks though? Who has the energy to care.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

As always I don't entirely disagree but I think opposing the mask mandate must purely be because it's such a "visible" representation of the issue. I think it's a sensible and polite thing for people to do when there's airborne illness around (people in Japan have been doing it for decades for example) and ideally I'd prefer that people do it voluntarily. The part of the Covid authoritarianism that has bothered me most was the "5 miles" rule or the "stay in your county" rule. I think border closures are one thing (and have precedent) but enforcing that people aren't allowed to travel outside of their local area is way over the line for me. As is banning access to outdoor areas - like when I couldn't take the dog for a walk at the beach because they had "closed it" (by fencing off the road leading there). In fact a lot of the early lockdown stuff was ludicrous - not leaving the house at all other than for "30 minutes exercise" even in outdoor areas, closing parks, etc... utter madness.

The masks though? Who has the energy to care.

Not having the energy to care is exactly how dictatorships take control.

I said on this forum right at the start of all this, probably last March, that this doesn't end until the people have had enough. The numbers are increasing all the time and the protests are getting larger and larger, but there are still too many complying with it all. Fear is always the weapon.

[arista]

I do not see it as fear
Alf.

Stay Healthy

[arista]

For Our Alf

[arista]

[arista]

BBC Text
["Maskless forced to pay up".
It reports that according
to Transport for London, 152 passengers were fined,
a further 125 were kicked off services
and 5,100 people were reminded
to cover their faces by TfL staff
on the first day of a crackdown on masks.
It comes after face coverings were
made mandatory on public transport in England.]

[arista]

[Alf]

Originally Posted by arista

I hope somebody there educated this ignoramus? He needs to be told that the vaccinated can also catch and spread it too.

It's important that he was put right, because he's on national television spreading disinformation, not to mention calling for apartheid.

[arista]

Sure Alf
but the UN Vaxxed
spread it faster

[bitontheslide]

it's not the point Arista, these are fundamental civil liberties issues that are the bedrock of democracy.

What i find interesting is that with no real increased threat to health people are now going bat**** crazy trying to dictate what everyone should do or say. We live in a free country, with free speech. If you don't like what someone says, use reasoned argument to put your point of view and let others decide on their own.

People only seem to want free speech and democracy when it suits them

[arista]

Originally Posted by MeghansLetterToSanta

it's not the point Arista, these are fundamental civil liberties issues that are the bedrock of democracy.

What i find interesting is that with no real increased threat to health people are now going bat**** crazy trying to dictate what everyone should do or say. We live in a free country, with free speech. If you don't like what someone says, use reasoned argument to put your point of view and let others decide on their own.

People only seem to want free speech and democracy when it suits them

Yes, but Folks like our Alf
refuse putting a mask on.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by arista

Yes, but Folks like our Alf
refuse putting a mask on.

I don't refuse. If I really needed to go somewhere and I could only go to that place by wearing a mask, then I would. But I don't just follow authoritarian orders because someone on the telly said so.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Alf

I don't refuse. If I really needed to go somewhere and I could only go to that place by wearing a mask, then I would. But I don't just follow authoritarian orders because someone on the telly said so.

Good
Nice to hear.

[Alf]

Gary Neville has plans to get into the protest game. Will you join him?

[Alf]

There's one already happening tomorrow.