[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

I never wanted to be a nurse. Why don't you?

My Dad was a paramedic, you don't go into these jobs for the money and I'm proud to say he never joined a picket line.

It's nonsense to think that healthcare worker should be uncomplaining martyrs and continue in the job year after year for below-inflation (or just zero) pay rise. It's not sustainable. No one should want to be a nurse right now, and not enough people do. That's the whole point. It's not "about the money" but no one wants to be in a career where they're undervalued and disrespected and so the health service is losing staff, fast. There's no two ways about it. You either have staff striking now and the government finally give fair pay and conditions, or you have gaping holes in staffing in 10 years time that there is NO ONE to fill.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

It's nonsense to think that healthcare worker should be uncomplaining martyrs and continue in the job year after year for below-inflation (or just zero) pay rise. It's not sustainable. No one should want to be a nurse right now, and not enough people do. That's the whole point. It's not "about the money" but no one wants to be in a career where they're undervalued and disrespected and so the health service is losing staff, fast. There's no two ways about it. You either have staff striking now and the government finally give fair pay and conditions, or you have gaping holes in staffing in 10 years time that there is NO ONE to fill.

The answer is, of course, to tell all those against the strike - like me -to give up their careers to be a nurse.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

The answer is, of course, to tell all those against the strike - like me -to give up their careers to be a nurse.

Yes - if the profession isn't fairly paid then all of the martyrs and selfless angels who are willing to do a high stress, high responsibility job for next to minimum wage will have to sign up to do it and do it happily.

They'll be inundated with applications!

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

Yes - if the profession isn't fairly paid then all of the martyrs and selfless angels who are willing to do a high stress, high responsibility job for next to minimum wage will have to sign up to do it and do it happily.

They'll be inundated with applications!

It's cute you think £30k starting salary for a new graduate is "next to minimum wage".

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

It's cute you think £30k starting salary for a new graduate is "next to minimum wage".

Right but pay progression without band progression is minimal/practically non-existent. It can go the other way as well - my wife has done well from the NHS pay banding system, by leapfrogging through the bands quickly and doubling her salary in under 4 years. Meanwhile a Band 5 staff nurse with 15+ years experience is on barely more than when they started. To progress with pay, the only route is out of clinical nursing into management/non-clinical or specialist roles. Should everyone doing that? Leaving no experienced staff in medical wards?

And ... it is next to minimum wage. In England starting salary is £27k. A new start at McDonald's is currently on around £23k (full time). A job that requires zero training, zero experience, and has zero responsibility beyond not burning the chips. You genuinely believe that £27 - £30k is fair pay for people who literally have lives in their hands? It's utter madness.

The pay doesn't just need to be better, it needs completely turned on its head and restructured to reward and encourage experienced staff.