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Tom4784 · 27-10-2009, 01:45 PM

When it comes to creationism and evolution can't we have it both ways? I often take a lot of what happens in the bibles as metaphors rather how it's written. Is it impossible that a divine force could have begun all life as cells and we evolved from that?

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

See, that to me is just another reason not to follow the Bible. I don't like the sound of a God who thinks a murderer is ok as long as he believes in him and asks for forgivness (quite vain actually) rather than a decent good person who doesn't believe in him or follow a book that his buddies wrote about him but other than that has always been good and treats others with respect

That is because you have not studied it and do not know about judgement. Present actions have eternal consequences

2 Corinthians 5:10

For we must all appear before the judgement seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

Niamh. · 27-10-2009, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

That is because you have not studied it and do not know about judgement. Present actions have eternal consequences

2 Corinthians 5:10

For we must all appear before the judgement seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

How do you know what I have or have not studied? I was born a Catholic, went to a catholic school where we did religion class everyday, I was baptised, made my communion and confirmation but decided that I didn't buy it!

Prole · 27-10-2009, 01:54 PM

It always amazes me that people can quote a book that's thousands of years old, and one that is, in any case, not complete. The church CHOSE which books were going in and which weren't. They chose them so that only those that worked with their own ideas were included.

The Christian church has killed more women over the years than childbirth - from murdering "witches" (who were always women, incidentally, any man accused of witchcraft was thought to be under the influence of a women) to refusing women contraception, even in areas of Africa and Asia that are rife with AIDS.

Women are nothing in the eyes of patriarchal religions. Are we still sucking up their Boys' Club bullshit after alllllllllllll this time?

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

How do you know what I have or have not studied? I was born a Catholic, went to a catholic school where we did religion class everyday, I was baptised, made my communion and confirmation but decided that I didn't buy it!

because you would have known about judgement?

The God that most people don't believe in does not exist!

Niamh. · 27-10-2009, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

because you would have known about judgement?

The God that most people don't believe in does not exist!

But you would not answer my question, I asked you Do you think I will go to hell because I don't believe in God and you quoted me a line from the Bible. I'm asking you, what do you think?

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

But you would not answer my question, I asked you Do you think I will go to hell because I don't believe in God and you quoted me a line from the Bible. I'm asking you, what do you think?

That would naturally depend on what you mean by Hell, you may be thinking of Waterstones for all I know.

You say "I don't read or follow the Bible" so it is difficult to try and explain Biblical matters and opinions I hold about them. Ultimately your scepticism will be irrational to me as your opinions will come from unusual places.

Niamh. · 27-10-2009, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

That would naturally depend on what you mean by Hell, you may be thinking of Waterstones for all I know.

You say "I don't read or follow the Bible" so it is difficult to try and explain Biblical matters and opinions I hold about them. Ultimately your scepticism will be irrational to me as your opinions will come from unusual places.

Again avoiding the question! Hell as in the opposite to Heavan is what I mean.

And why start a debate about Jesus If you expect only people who follow the Bible to debate with you about it?

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

Again avoiding the question! Hell as in the opposite to Heavan is what I mean.

And why start a debate about Jesus If you expect only people who follow the Bible to debate with you about it?

It is not so much avoiding the question as seeing where the question is being deliberately led.

The answer to your question is that those who do not recognise Jesus as their saviour will die a spiritual death (eternal separation from God). God has warned us in the Bible that it is appointed for men to die once, then judgement (Heb. 9:27). After death, you will be judged.

Eternity is a long time to be wrong, especially about Jesus.

Niamh. · 27-10-2009, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

It is not so much avoiding the question as seeing where the question is being deliberately led.

The answer to your question is that those who do not recognise Jesus as their saviour will die a spiritual death (eternal separation from God). God has warned us in the Bible that it is appointed for men to die once, then judgement (Heb. 9:27). After death, you will be judged.

Eternity is a long time to be wrong, especially about Jesus.

I wasn't trying to lead you anywhere with the question Leather Trumpet, I was just curious as to what you thought about it. I like debates with people because I consider myself to be open minded and like to hear other peoples points of view, sometimes if I think the other person has valid points, I may even change what I originally thought.

But this seems pointless to do on this subject with you because you've just told me that that my thoughts on this subject are irrational and come from "unusual" places. (they come from my head BTW!!!)

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

I wasn't trying to lead you anywhere with the question Leather Trumpet, I was just curious as to what you thought about it. I like debates with people because I consider myself to be open minded and like to hear other peoples points of view, sometimes if I think the other person has valid points, I may even change what I originally thought.

But this seems pointless to do on this subject with you because you've just told me that that my thoughts on this subject are irrational and come from "unusual" places. (they come from my head BTW!!!)

perhaps you are right and I apologise. I am still getting over the cat trauma of yesterday and the wrong teabag last night just before Flashforward, that lead to a sleepless start to bedtime.

Niamh. · 27-10-2009, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

perhaps you are right and I apologise. I am still getting over the cat trauma of yesterday and the wrong teabag last night just before Flashforward, that lead to a sleepless start to bedtime.

The wrong Teabag??? I'm intrigued lol

Too bad about your cat though, it's horrible loosing a pet

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

The wrong Teabag??? I'm intrigued lol

Too bad about your cat though, it's horrible loosing a pet

It should have been decaf and it was not! - i am such a caffeine woos

Niamh. · 27-10-2009, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

It should have been decaf and it was not! - i am such a caffeine woos

lol, I thought you were going to tell me it was a magic mushroom Tea bag or something

Sticks · 27-10-2009, 03:27 PM

LeatherTrumpet, as someone from the same side, I would advise you to "Quit while you are behind"

No progress is being made here, and you are lapsing into mild Ad Hominems which is never correct.

I have probably been where you are, and you are making some of the the same errors I did when I was younger.

Niamh. · 27-10-2009, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sticks

LeatherTrumpet, as someone from the same side, I would advise you to "Quit while you are behind"

No progress is being made here, and you are lapsing into mild Ad Hominems which is never correct.

I have probably been where you are, and you are making some of the the same errors I did when I was younger.

What does that mean Sticks - Ad Hominems?

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sticks

LeatherTrumpet, as someone from the same side, I would advise you to "Quit while you are behind"

No progress is being made here, and you are lapsing into mild Ad Hominems which is never correct.

I have probably been where you are, and you are making some of the the same errors I did when I was younger.

are you referring to the teabag. dont worry, I shall be more careful tonight.

but again, I fear you are perhaps taking this forum a touch too seriously. When getting replies like "If I pray hard enough, will God turn my colleague into bread? " or "What a load of ****" or "Blind faith. No getting through to you. I pity the fool."

that may suggest a certain tone! - i am not here to save sinners I am here for mild diversion.

Sticks · 27-10-2009, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

i am not here to save sinners I am here for mild diversion.

And in the process you run the risk of reinforcing negative stereotypes

Dr.Gonzo · 27-10-2009, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sticks

And in the process you run the risk of reinforcing negative stereotypes

Absolutely brilliant. I seriously have a case of manlove for you saying that.

Crimson Dynamo · 27-10-2009, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sticks

And in the process you run the risk of reinforcing negative stereotypes

and what are those?

(or are you having a "the only Christian in the village" moment?)

Stu · 27-10-2009, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dezzy

When it comes to creationism and evolution can't we have it both ways? I often take a lot of what happens in the bibles as metaphors rather how it's written. Is it impossible that a divine force could have begun all life as cells and we evolved from that?

No, because Jesus spoke of numerous old testament events, AND Genesis. He was a Jew, remember, he studied and believed in the God of the Torah. He was that God's son. Or at least he claimed to be.

You cant have it both ways. You cant believe in both Jesus and evolution. There is only one trinity. Why would he suddenly change his story in the New Testament?

Stu · 27-10-2009, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Anyone who believes in Jesus Christ for salvation is forgiven, no matter what sins he has committed (Romans 6:23; John 3:16).

You basically just destroyed the entire Christian moral system. Congratulations.

Do what you want folks. As long as you believe in Jesus, you will be forgiven! Understand God's infinite love through the means of a bastardized, ancient, dog eared, irrelevant group of manuscripts or burn in hell for eternity!

Dawkins was right. Some of you people are mentally ill.

Right now, Dr. Gonzo is totally pissing on this thread.