[Christmas Dynasnow]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Thats why everyone believes in Jesusand the Gospels isnt it, because it cant be ripped apart. Incidentally it was your interpretation of the passages you quoted that i referred to.

Your claim was that it was not Biblical to claim that Jesus did proclaim that he was God and that it incorrect. It may be worth asking what you think Jesus was?



Basic Christian tenets are mulled over argued over and ripped apart in churches, schools and seminaries everyday and have been since shortly after Jesus ascended into heaven, so no its not arrogant and self righteous, Get over it.

Christians believe that Jesus is God. The Bible teaches that God is one in essence, three in Person: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Each is fully God. God is not three gods but three in one. This is not a mathematical contradiction. Although humans cannot completely grasp the paradox of the tri-unity of God, we trust His revelation is true. Christians do not believe in three gods. Our one God manifests Himself in three Persons. If you do not believe that then you are not a Christian

Believing the words that are put in front of you are the words of God, who had them wrote specially for you is And that your interpretation or beliefs in them is the only correct belief or interpretation is.

Sorry that does not make sense!


As for their actual date of origin, no one can say, the dates you quote are the earliest best guess, however when the author called Mark wrote his gospel he was aware of the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem at the time of writing, this happened in 70 AD/CE.

These dates are commonly held by our best Biblical historians and the Christian Church.

As for being a dictation from Peter. Peter knew the area where he had been born and lived, Mark obviously hadnt been there, this is evidenced by some of the accounts of the travels of Jesus.

Is a minority view and not commonly held by the Christian Church

Mark knew so little about the area that he described Jesus going from Tyrian territory 'by way of Sidon to the Sea of Galilee through the territory of the Ten Towns' (Mark 7:31); this is similar to saying that one goes from London to Paris by way of Glasgow and Dublin. See also Mark 11:1. Anyone approaching Jerusalem from Jericho would come first to Bethany and then Bethphage, not the reverse. this could also rule out a direct dictation, couldnt it?

as above

The earliest accurate historical reference to the Gospels as belonging to any particular writer wasn't until the 2nd century AD.

Not sure what you are driving at but i can see how far down the Wikipedia page for the Gospel of Mark you are!

As for John the apostle being the actual author of the gospel bearing his name thats is extremely unlikely, its possible a student of his started it, however studies of it has shown it being penned by at least two people. A fact born out by the Gospel itself, in chapter 21 it is stated that it derives from the testimony of the 'Disciple whom Jesus loved',

Biblical evidence and external evidence from church fathers suggest that you are wrong as does the Christian Church and 2000 yeas of Christianity

It is more than likely the three synoptic gospels were drawn from one historical source whether this was Mark itself or the Gospel of the Hebrews or even the mythical Q document, who knows.

But if you want to believe that the apostles who's names they bear wrote them, feel free, thats what Faith is about.

all of what you say seems to have been gleaned from Wikipedia. I would suggest that rather than relying on that you rely on Biblical and historical weight of evidence.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

all of what you say seems to have been gleaned from Wikipedia. I would suggest that rather than relying on that you rely on Biblical and historical weight of evidence.

So the bible is 100% factually true?

God made the first man, Adam and the first women, Eve and everyone else is descended from them?

[Christmas Dynasnow]

Originally Posted by Shasown

So the bible is 100% factually true?

God made the first man, Adam and the first women, Eve and everyone else is descended from them?

The Bible has many literary styles: poetry, allegory, historical fact, eyewitness account, love song, poetry, prophesy, psalms, proverbs and apocalyptic revelations. You read it as literature, paying close attention to form, figurative language and fantasy imagery.