[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by InOne

Love the way they always have to put extremist in there somewhere. What these idiots don't seems to realize is that Muslims kill eachother more than anyone else kills them. They should have rounded them up, checked their passports and any of those who were not born here should have been kicked out. Or maybe the ones born here should be too...

ALL organised religions are as bad as each other with the exception of probably Budhism, you never get any extremist Budhists .

You can't really judge an entire group of people by the actions of a few, cut out the problem and don''t tar the rest. Those protesters are obviously idiots and most Muslims would not stand with them, like most Catholics wouldn't support the peadophile priests. You can't define someone by the actions of a few idiots. Is England full of intolerant violent thugs because of the actions of a few idiotic football fans? Is Ireland full of terrorists? Answer to both is obviously no. Not all muslims are extremists wanting to change our way of life either.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

ALL organised religions are as bad as each other with the exception of probably Budhism, you never get any extremist Budhists .

You can't really judge an entire group of people by the actions of a few, cut out the problem and don''t tar the rest. Those protesters are obviously idiots and most Muslims would not stand with them, like most Catholics wouldn't support the peadophile priests. You can't define someone by the actions of a few idiots. Is England full of intolerant violent thugs because of the actions of a few idiotic football fans? Is Ireland full of terrorists? Answer to both is obviously no. Not all muslims are extremists wanting to change our way of life either.

I was talking about in the Middle East. The fact is they do kill eachother more than anyone kills them out there. They get the Taliban out and then they complain. They are the ones that have probably never visited those countaries and don't even understand what is going on. Obviously all Religions are all bad, but in our time, just seems that Islam is being that little bit more vocal.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by InOne

I was talking about in the Middle East. The fact is they do kill eachother more than anyone kills them out there. They get the Taliban out and then they complain. They are the ones that have probably never visited those countaries and don't even understand what is going on. Obviously all Religions are all bad, but in our time, just seems that Islam is being that little bit more vocal.

Obviously? Islam is the majority religion there so most of the crimes will most likely be commited by muslims there. Most crimes in the UK are comitted by UK citizens because there's more UK civilians then residents from other countries in the uk so I'm not quite sure what you meant there?

As for the rest, Ignorance exists everywhere so you can't say it's only coming from the Muslim community. Again you're tarring an entire religion of people with different views and beliefs on their own faith because of the actions of a few. that's the part I don't like. You've got die hards and more casual believers in every religion and Islam is no different.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

ALL organised religions are as bad as each other with the exception of probably Budhism, you never get any extremist Budhists .

Dont you? The Rape of Nanking and other atrocities committed by Japanese (Buddhist) soldiers during WW2.

The Sinhalese-Tamil (Buddhist - Hindu) civil war in Sri Lanka saw atrocities committed by both sides. The genocide of the Urghurs, the massacres of Muslims in Thailand. Laos, Burma and South Vietnam(prior to and during the Vietnam War) all saw terrorist atrocities committed by Buddhists.

Tibetan Monks rioted and looted banks within the last 5 years, chinese soldiers were killed during the riots

All Buddhist countries have seen atrocities committed by Buddhists in the last 80 years. Christians and Muslims dont have a monopoly in terrorist murders attrocities and genocide in the name of religion.

It is not religion, but politics, injustice, colonialism, greed for land and resources and occupation that create violence

[BB_Eye]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Dont you? The Rape of Nanking and other atrocities committed by Japanese (Buddhist) soldiers during WW2.

The Sinhalese-Tamil (Buddhist - Hindu) civil war in Sri Lanka saw atrocities committed by both sides. The genocide of the Urghurs, the massacres of Muslims in Thailand. Laos, Burma and South Vietnam(prior to and during the Vietnam War) all saw terrorist atrocities committed by Buddhists.

Tibetan Monks rioted and looted banks within the last 5 years, chinese soldiers were killed during the riots

All Buddhist countries have seen atrocities committed by Buddhists in the last 80 years. Christians and Muslims dont have a monopoly in terrorist murders attrocities and genocide in the name of religion.

It is not religion, but politics, injustice, colonialism, greed for land and resources and occupation that create violence

Well said

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Dont you? The Rape of Nanking and other atrocities committed by Japanese (Buddhist) soldiers during WW2.

The Sinhalese-Tamil (Buddhist - Hindu) civil war in Sri Lanka saw atrocities committed by both sides. The genocide of the Urghurs, the massacres of Muslims in Thailand. Laos, Burma and South Vietnam(prior to and during the Vietnam War) all saw terrorist atrocities committed by Buddhists.

Tibetan Monks rioted and looted banks within the last 5 years, chinese soldiers were killed during the riots

All Buddhist countries have seen atrocities committed by Buddhists in the last 80 years. Christians and Muslims dont have a monopoly in terrorist murders attrocities and genocide in the name of religion.

It is not religion, but politics, injustice, colonialism, greed for land and resources and occupation that create violence

Firstly the buddhism thing was a joke and secondly anyone who commits violence in the name of Buddhism isn't a buddhist since it's core concepts are all about bettering yourself, promoting peace and doing good in the world. It's more of a case of Buddhism being used as a tool by others to commit violence rather then condoning the violence itself. Which you could say for Islam and Christianity except both of their pasts are completely blood soaked due to their own doing (Christianity in particular).

Also in the examples you gave there's only really one which could be seen as extremist behavior (the religious war) the rest seem to me just to be terrible crimes commited by Buddhists rather then religious extremist actions.

Organised Religion is bad because of what most of it promotes and how it can by used to turn people against each other but in fairness Buddhism doesn't preach hate or violence so on the Totem pole of the most violent religion it has to be pretty low in comparision to others.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Organised Religion is bad because of what most of it promotes and how it can by used to turn people against each other but in fairness Buddhism doesn't preach hate or violence so on the Totem pole of the most violent religion it has to be pretty low in comparision to others.

Neither does Christianity nor most other organised religions. The basic tenets of most religions are peace and love. Surely the assessment of how violent the adherents of any particular religion should be how many acts of violence have been committed in its name as opposed to what they preach.

Its the people doing the organising that promote the violence and hate. Using religion for their own agenda.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Neither does Christianity nor most other organised religions. The basic tenets of most religions are peace and love. Surely the assessment of how violent the adherents of any particular religion should be how many acts of violence have been committed in its name as opposed to what they preach.

Its the people doing the organising that promote the violence and hate. Using religion for their own agenda.

I kinda disagree with the second sentence because there's a big distinction between Buddhism and other religions, With Christianity and Islam there's violence at it's core (stoning none believers, Adulterers, Gay people ETC) and a history of violence commited in it's name. Buddhism doesn't speak a word about hate, it even says to respect other religions and their holidays and values as long as they promote good will.

I agree with the last sentence though, it's the main reason I hate organised religion. Islam and Christianity are violent religions yes but most of it's followers are inteligent enough not to share their more violent beliefs. It's just the few that use the easily led for their own goals. Buddhism isn't innocent either but I think at it's core it's not as bad as others.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I kinda disagree with the second sentence because there's a big distinction between Buddhism and other religions, With Christianity and Islam there's violence at it's core (stoning none believers, Adulterers, Gay people ETC) and a history of violence commited in it's name. Buddhism doesn't speak a word about hate, it even says to respect other religions and their holidays and values as long as they promote good will.

I agree with the last sentence though, it's the main reason I hate organised religion. Islam and Christianity are violent religions yes but most of it's followers are inteligent enough not to share their more violent beliefs. It's just the few that use the easily led for their own goals. Buddhism isn't innocent either but I think at it's core it's not as bad as others.

Then that shows what little you know of the basis of Christianity.

What violence is actually at the core of Christianity? The death of Jesus? Stoning non believers, adulterers etc is a Jewish/Muslim punishment.

Nowhere in his ministry or teachings does Jesus advocate stoning of anyone, nor any sort of violence, in fact he stops a stoning doesnt he? I think he advocated something along the lines of peace on Earth and goodwill to others. Forgiveness, turning the other cheek, brotherly love etc.

It isnt so much the religion as the motivations of the people using the religion to achieve their aims.

You could I suppose argue about the Crusades, subjugation of indigenous populations etc done in the name of Christianity, but that wasnt done at the request of Jesus was it? It was done by ambitious people using the religion to gain wealth, the mistaken belief it would gain them admission to heaven, fame, etc.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Then that shows what little you know of the basis of Christianity.

What violence is actually at the core of Christianity? The death of Jesus? Stoning non believers, adulterers etc is a Jewish/Muslim punishment.

Nowhere in his ministry or teachings does Jesus advocate stoning of anyone, nor any sort of violence, in fact he stops a stoning doesnt he? I think he advocated something along the lines of peace on Earth and goodwill to others. Forgiveness, turning the other cheek, brotherly love etc.

It isnt so much the religion as the motivations of the people using the religion to achieve their aims.

You could I suppose argue about the Crusades, subjugation of indigenous populations etc done in the name of Christianity, but that wasnt done at the request of Jesus was it? It was done by ambitious people using the religion to gain wealth, the mistaken belief it would gain them admission to heaven, fame, etc.

Fair points, although I might have been thinking of the old Testament. I'm pretty sure there was some death sentences and such in there.

[BB_Eye]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I kinda disagree with the second sentence because there's a big distinction between Buddhism and other religions, With Christianity and Islam there's violence at it's core (stoning none believers, Adulterers, Gay people ETC) and a history of violence commited in it's name. Buddhism doesn't speak a word about hate, it even says to respect other religions and their holidays and values as long as they promote good will.

I agree with the last sentence though, it's the main reason I hate organised religion. Islam and Christianity are violent religions yes but most of it's followers are inteligent enough not to share their more violent beliefs. It's just the few that use the easily led for their own goals. Buddhism isn't innocent either but I think at it's core it's not as bad as others.

Feudal Asia isn't exactly the first thing that springs to mind when I think of peace and harmony.

If there is a fundamental difference between Christianity and Buddhism, it is in its philosophy towards life. Christianity offers the answers to "why"... all the big questions. Why are we here? Why do good people get punished in life evil people rewarded? What happens after we die? And it promises something far better in the afterlife and reassures the believer that this life is simply a temporary stage.

Buddhism proposes that we stop asking these questions and offers a way of dealing with life's ugly realities and, in turn, accepting them.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by BB_Eye

Feudal Asia isn't exactly the first thing that springs to mind when I think of peace and harmony.

If there is a fundamental difference between Christianity and Buddhism, it is in its philosophy towards life. Christianity offers the answers to "why"... all the big questions. Why are we here? Why do good people get punished in life evil people rewarded? What happens after we die? And it promises something far better in the afterlife and reassures the believer that this life is simply a temporary stage.

Buddhism proposes that we stop asking these questions and offers a way of dealing with life's ugly realities and, in turn, accepting them.

Then again was the feudal period down to Buddhism? I always throught it was just a power struggle between different Warlords and factions instead of anything religion based.

A very good distinction as well, I should have thought about that instead of staying at a more basic level.

[bananarama]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

ALL organised religions are as bad as each other with the exception of probably Budhism, you never get any extremist Budhists .

You can't really judge an entire group of people by the actions of a few, cut out the problem and don''t tar the rest. Those protesters are obviously idiots and most Muslims would not stand with them, like most Catholics wouldn't support the peadophile priests. You can't define someone by the actions of a few idiots. Is England full of intolerant violent thugs because of the actions of a few idiotic football fans? Is Ireland full of terrorists? Answer to both is obviously no. Not all muslims are extremists wanting to change our way of life either.

You are making a fundamental mistake in thinking religous followers who don't throw bombs or kill are some how not extremists........that is not true.......Any religion that is brainwashed into children from birth is extremist be it islam or other..........The world is awash with religious extremism........Parents who raise there children with their chosen religion before the child is old enough to understand the concepts and consent is EXTREMISM.

The so called moderate religious are the nests from which the extremists emerge............Any one with half a brain cell would realise that you will not control the killer wasps until you first neutralise the nests from which they emerge.

Until the west recognises the real enemy within then world wide terrorism will spread and spread until one day they are fortunate enough to get hold of a mass desrtuction capability..........Then you can say goodby to the world as we know it...........It's not if its when.......... The world leaders are blind to the dangers of all religious addictions......