[Benjamin]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Looking at the big numbers, 2 parents are much better than one.

Not always. What if the 2 parents were alcoholics who beat their kids compared to a single parent who does everything for their children?

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by ukturtle

Not always. What if the 2 parents were alcoholics who beat their kids compared to a single parent who does everything for their children?

I am not talking individual cases I am talking about looking at the nation as a whole. Looking at large sample sizes. In general 2 parents are best and the big numbers will agree, hence policy is made with such an assertion.

[Zippy]

Originally Posted by BB_Eye

Most of the single parents I know had to leave the child's father, because he was either a deadbeat or an abusive arsehole. In both cases, the child is, by far, better off with the one parent.

well they should have chosen better in the first place. Why choose a loser to father your children? Just stupid.

If more women actually put some thought into choosing a guy who would actually stick around and be a good father to have children with there wouldnt be so many fatherless children. Seems they just have children with whoever they fancy at that time, not who would be good for the child as a role model.

I know sh!t happens and relationships end but these days its gotten out of hand and its just become the norm for children to have no father. Which means they do not get a balanced influence when growing up. They also do not get the benefit of seeing a strong relationship as a role model. No wonder they often go on to repeat the pattern of failed relationships and single parenthood.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zippy

well they should have chosen better in the first place. Why choose a loser to father your children? Just stupid.

If more women actually put some thought into choosing a guy who would actually stick around and be a good father to have children with there wouldnt be so many fatherless children. Seems they just have children with whoever they fancy at that time, not who would be good for the child as a role model.

I know sh!t happens and relationships end but these days its gotten out of hand and its just become the norm for children to have no father. Which means they do not get a balanced influence when growing up. They also do not get the benefit of seeing a strong relationship as a role model. No wonder they often go on to repeat the pattern of failed relationships and single parenthood.

While I do agree with you that women need to choose better partners and realise that having a child is a huge thing and not choosing a good father could be damaging to the child, you can't lay all the blame on just the mothers and let the dead beat dads off scott free. I think both sexes need to take responsibility here.

[Lee.]

My sister and I were brought up in a single parent family (although I did have a "2nd parent" in my Grandma) and have definitely never felt we missed out by not having a father figure in our lives; My mum did a great job!

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

Afraid this will be another 'on the fence' kind of answer but it really depends on circumstances

On the whole, yes, I think children do benefit more from both parents in their lives. Of course they do. But equally a two parent family where there are nothing but arguments will soul destroy a child

This. At the end of the day when you have a child. Whether your the mother and father.. both the parents should ALWAYS put their child first. More families are splitting up more than ever now. For many reasons. As long as the child sees both the mother and father a lot then things should work out okay! Of course a nice little neutal family setting would be the best thing but that just doesn't happen as much now.

My friend's mum and dad have split up. The dad does not talk to her or see her now. This is why she is a bit messed up! She needs to see her dad as well.

But yeah.. there is nothing worse than a child seeing their mum and dad arguing. The mum and dad should do their arguing when the child is not around at least. Than being selfish and point scoring against each other and trying to work out who is right!

It's hard in this day and age. I mean when a mum and dad have a kid.. they both might start to realise they may want to "raise" their child differently which could be awkward or bloody complicated!!

Don't just get pregnant by any random nonse! Amen.

However.. women are more independant now. Many both a man and woman who have not found someone to have a family with feel like they want a child. Then that way.. they can still raise a child on their own if they want to and if they have not found the right love partner yet.

Bottom line is.. like I said.. both the mother and father should put the sprog first. Nowadays kids are lucky to know that they have one of their parents putting them first!

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by angus58

Well I never set out to be a single parent; I got married, had two kids, and endured several years of domestic abuse till I finally left when my kids were aged 5 and 8. It was a hard slog as I had no financial support from my ex, and no moral support from family, my parents being dead and my siblings married and living far away, but it was also the most rewarding and challenging thing I ever did bringing up my boys and being both mum and dad to them. They are now aged 22 and 25 respectively and are both in full time work, with their own homes, own lives and own responsbilities. I think I did the best job I could, and they both tell me they had happy childhoods - we three are still very close as we were such a tight family unit for so long.

Not all single parents are feckless, sponging, teenagers: A lot of us are self supporting, responsible people who find ourselves single parents because of divorce, bereavement or whatever, and do the very best we can in difficult circumstances. It's not the quantity of parents that counts, it's the quality of the parenting.

This. I mean there was a lot of neutral family units back in the day. Well the majority of this is like it now. However back in the day things were a lot more stricter. There was more routine back in the day! Like the men go to work while the mother stays at home and looks after the kids. Now that women have more their independance which they bloody well should.. the "normal" family unit has kind of changed.

[Angus]

Originally Posted by Zippy

well they should have chosen better in the first place. Why choose a loser to father your children? Just stupid.

If more women actually put some thought into choosing a guy who would actually stick around and be a good father to have children with there wouldnt be so many fatherless children. Seems they just have children with whoever they fancy at that time, not who would be good for the child as a role model.

I know sh!t happens and relationships end but these days its gotten out of hand and its just become the norm for children to have no father. Which means they do not get a balanced influence when growing up. They also do not get the benefit of seeing a strong relationship as a role model. No wonder they often go on to repeat the pattern of failed relationships and single parenthood.

Trouble is that wife beaters, child abusers, psychopaths etc in general don't walk around with those warnings tattooed on their foreheads. They are extremely adept at presenting a normal demeanour to get what they want. In my case, he was charm personified, couldn't do enough for me and my family, put me on a pedestal and was the perfect boyfriend until I got the wedding ring on my finger and I became a possession to be guarded from everything and everyone, including my nearest and dearest. Unless you have experienced it, you cannot possibly imagine how such men operate, isolating their partners, and dominating and controlling their every move. I couldn't even talk to my 79 year old next door neighbour without accusations of having an affair!

It's a bit rich to blame the victim. Such utter judgmental nonsense is not only offensive and insensitive, it just shows a complete lack of any understanding of human nature and its aberrations, and a total absence of empathy.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by angus58

Trouble is that wife beaters, child abusers, psychopaths etc in general don't walk around with those warnings tattooed on their foreheads. They are extremely adept at presenting a normal demeanour to get what they want. In my case, he was charm personified, couldn't do enough for me and my family, put me on a pedestal and was the perfect boyfriend until I got the wedding ring on my finger and I became a possession to be guarded from everything and everyone, including my nearest and dearest. Unless you have experienced it, you cannot possibly imagine how such men operate, isolating their partners, and dominating and controlling their every move. I couldn't even talk to my 79 year old next door neighbour without accusations of having an affair!

It's a bit rich to blame the victim. Such utter judgmental nonsense is not only offensive and insensitive, it just shows a complete lack of any understanding of human nature and its aberrations, and a total absence of empathy.

Very true Angus, but its not just men who abuse, women do too, and its sad to say the numbers of such cases are increasing. One aspect of life where equality may not be such a good thing.

[Grimnir]

Ideal family is a mum and dad who are excellent parents and love and care for their children
A Single parent can also be excellent and love and care their children but can never be as good as having mum and dad together
But they can be a lot better than many mum and dad who are crap parents and don't care at all

[Angus]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Very true Angus, but its not just men who abuse, women do too, and its sad to say the numbers of such cases are increasing. One aspect of life where equality may not be such a good thing.

I absolutely agree - there are plenty of abusive, exploitative women around too. I can only speak from my own experience however, and find it incredibly offensive and totally lacking in any empathy that anyone can castigate and blame the victim of an abuser for the abuse they suffer.

[Angus]

Originally Posted by Grimnir

Ideal family is a mum and dad who are excellent parents and love and care for their children
A Single parent can also be excellent and love and care their children but can never be as good as having mum and dad together
But they can be a lot better than many mum and dad who are crap parents and don't care at all

I totally agree - I married for life and stuck it out way past the marriage's sell by date, until it became apparent to me that the violence was escalating and when it started to extend to my children I decided enough was enough. My children were, quite frankly, terrified of their father, as was I.

In an ideal world all children deserve to have two loving, caring parents and that scenario is ALWAYS going to best. But if the worst happens, so long as there is at least one parent ready and willing to nurture, love and cherish thier children, that's surely got to be better than staying in a poisonous and abusive relationship. Believe me, I have always felt guilty that my boys grew up with just one parent, but staying with my ex was never an option, he would have destroyed them emotionally, psychologically and physically - I doubt I'd even be here now if I had not got out when I did. My last memory of my ex is having a knife to my throat!

It took me a fair few years to regain my self confidence and self esteem and I have never remarried and never will. Once bitten, twice shy.