[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by tmi

Not always but perhaps sometimes, if you dress a boy in girls clothes will they become gay no , at the end of the day people are responsible for the things they do no one else . Who knows , well the looting I have had a massive blow my husband lost his job and he the main earner would I do that no. Even if I was starving , so for me it is not the way I view things. Some people think the world owes them a living , they better wake up and smell the coffee, it dont, You get out of the world what you put in, sometimes agression needs to be challeneged into postive things otherise it can eat you up.

Which is precisely my point. Its ridiculous to blame the parents for what the kids do. Especially at 18 year old.

Sorry to hear about your husband too. I have never felt so grateful to live in newcastle before. Was really expecting it to start up here too but luckily it didnt.

[tmi]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Which is precisely my point. Its ridiculous to blame the parents for what the kids do. Especially at 18 year old.

Sorry to hear about your husband too. I have never felt so grateful to live in newcastle before. Was really expecting it to start up here too but luckily it didnt.

I live in the valleys is Pyramid banned? I live not far from where Nathan Cleverley is from, or Darcy Blake
I think it was nipped in the bud. I think the human rights **** as a lot to answer for ,the criminals have more rights than the victims what a load of bollockony.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by tmi

I live in the valleys is Pyramid banned? I live not far from where Nathan Cleverley is from, or Darcy Blake
I think it was nipped in the bud. I think the human rights **** as a lot to answer for ,the criminals have more rights than the victims what a load of bollockony.

Very true.

And yeah, pyramid is banned. reason is in the ban list

[tmi]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Very true.

And yeah, pyramid is banned. reason is in the ban list

Thanks perhaps the streets of London and else where will be quiet when the Cbb starts, I do think they should have a reduction in allowance rather it being taken away for a few wks, crime dosent pay and all that, if they have they benefits revoked alltogther they may turn to crime to survive, I believe like one poster said there should be sanctions on visa if they disobey the law kick them out and they have to have proof they are working, the trouble with this country is they are yes people trying to please everyone, it shouldnt be like that in America if you have a record you aint allowed in, I think we should bring that here.

[Scarlett.]

The Lib Dems appear to be quite unhappy about it all
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...ition-response

[Scarlett.]

The Lib Dems appear to be quite unhappy about it all
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...ition-response

[joeysteele]

Well, the Lib Dems have waited to see what their activists and party members are coming back with,just as on the NHS propsals originally. I guess the initial responses to the MPs from them are not supportive.

However, I hope the Lib Dems do flex their muscles on this and prevent really extreme policy/laws being brought in that will affect people not involved in the actual riots themselves.

This policy is being led by a very extreme council (Wandsworth) who quite frankly needs the govt to come down heavy on it and slap it's proposals down,hopefully.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

It's not your problem yet you'll stick your oar in. You can't just use that to back out of an argument when you feel like it. You blame the parents? Offer up real solutions instead of stock advice that doesn't work in the real world. People who criticise yet don't offer up any real solutions are just pointless.

Kids veer off the right path regardless of good parenting at times for outside factors, It's very easy to say it's the parents' fault but prisons aren't full of people from bad homes because shockingly enough people with good parents are also capable of making stupid decisions. Simply blaming the parents is just simplifying the matter down to a moronic degree and making them and other family members suffer for one person's idiocy is just foolishness. Most of the people who have been arrested have been teenagers on the higher end of the scale who know their own mind and the difference between right and wrong, even with bad parenting you'll realise that eventually. However it was their choice to riot, no one else's so why make a lot of people suffer who wouldn't have done anything wrong? People are just playing the blame game when the only people to blame are obvious, the rioters themselves.

Firstly, let me say, I am surprised that you of all people would feel justified in suggesting that I am a pointless person and that my opinion is moronic. As for "sticking my oar in", this is a debate thread on a forum, it's all about sticking your oar in even though your opinion may differ from the majority.

No, it's not my problem, it is the problem of the parent of the child in question. My only problem is that I pay tax, which is spent on benefits, child allowance, contributes to tax credits, my council tax goes to pay for education... fair enough. However, I don't expect that money to pay the rent of some feckless parent who can't control their child. Whichever way you cut it, parents are responsible for their kids until they reach 18. I haven't made that up. That's the law.

In this case, you're talking about how good parents sometimes can't help their kids going off the rails, and I agree with you. I'm sure the decent parents were disgusted by their kids actions. I see the mother of the athlete shopped her to the cops, and good for her, making her child face the consequences. I'm not talking about people like them, I'm not talking about decent parents, I'm talking about the kind of scum who have shogged along to court this week with their kids, wearing their best tracksuit bottoms, sticking their fingers up and telling the photographers to go and ******* themselves. They couldn't give a monkey's toss about anything that doesn't affect their free money and subsidised residence. This thread is about whether to take away the homes and/or benefits off people who are probably known to the police, who may have previously been reported to the council as anti social, who will have signed a lease setting out their responsibilities, people who have been probably been given more than once chance. Enough is enough.

[Zippy]

I don't think families should be evicted as a result of a one off incident. However, if members of a council household have a record of bringing crime and destruction to an area then the council have every right to get rid of them. Its for the benefit of the decent people who live in the area.

That said, a severe warning may suffice for this occasion rather than an immediate eviction. At this point its the actual person that is convicted that should be heavily punished. But if they continue to behave that way then the council have an absolute right to evict them. Nobody has a right to drag areas down to their own scumbag level....certainly not when taxpayers are paying their bills.

[jayne_sophia]

Can someone please start a counter petition, clearly this a a very narrow minded solution, that needs to be resolved. What r the government thinking???

[Livia]

Originally Posted by jayne_sophia

Can someone please start a counter petition, clearly this a a very narrow minded solution, that needs to be resolved. What r the government thinking???

Why don't you do it, if you feel so strongly?

[Benjamin]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Yeah, shove more people out onto the streets. That should help

It may teach them to actually respect their community and make them realise that most of us work hard to keep a roof over our heads. We don't all live for free handouts.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Benjamin.

It may teach them to actually respect their community and make them realise that most of us work hard to keep a roof over our heads. We don't all live for free handouts.

Yeah. God forbid the siblings of criminals have a roof over their heads

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Benjamin.

It may teach them to actually respect their community and make them realise that most of us work hard to keep a roof over our heads. We don't all live for free handouts.

I cannot see how it could possibly be that to evict someone from their home will make them respect authority or their community more never mind at all.

If people commit crime they are dealt with by a courtand anyone cauight for these riots should get heavy sentencing but it should also be a court that decides if someone warrants losing their home, weighing up all the considerations thereof.

However, talking of respecting their communities, as well as the above scenario,take into account if not only the perpetrators of crime were evicted from the homes but then also any family they live with,be that wife/husband and children,or Parents etc.
Making all those people homeless too just for having them live in the same house not charged with any rioting offences at all, then how in any way that would make those people respect their communities and authority more is beyond me, it is far more likely to make them lash out more in the community and then not have an address to track them back to, to catch and convict them.

Also, I don't believe it's the case that 'all' tenants of council housing get their rents paid for them.
I know people whose parents live in Council housing and they are paying in excess of £80 a week. It's wrong to generalise that everyone in such housing,or that everyone involved in these riots live in housing paid in full for them by the taxpayers.

[Livia]

Joey, no one's talking about decent parents who take some responsibility. I think you know the kind of parents who are at threat of losing their homes. I doubt there will be any blanket law that would cover everyone who's kids were involved. Previous events will obviously be taken into account.

Paying only £80 a week rent for a house or flat is a privilege. That privilege can be withdrawn. If people do get eviced they will have to rent somewhere privately and pay what non-council tenants pay in rent. That means they'll have to get a job. That's what I would have to do if for some reason I lost my home. That's what lots of people who do not rely on the state for housing would have to do.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Livia

Joey, no one's talking about decent parents who take some responsibility. I think you know the kind of parents who are at threat of losing their homes. I doubt there will be any blanket law that would cover everyone who's kids were involved. Previous events will obviously be taken into account.

Paying only £80 a week rent for a house or flat is a privilege. That privilege can be withdrawn. If people do get eviced they will have to rent somewhere privately and pay what non-council tenants pay in rent. That means they'll have to get a job. That's what I would have to do if for some reason I lost my home. That's what lots of people who do not rely on the state for housing would have to do.

Others. not you, on here are generalising that this is from bad parents in the main, who live on council estates getting their rents paid for them.

I know a family who get only £260 every week, they are a couple with a daughter of 16 living at home.
Out of that they pay every week, £82 in rent and then they have council tax too.
They do nothing wrong, but when they hear the terminology of all politicians and the way the lower classes are smeared with these riots,before all the facts are known,then they are very angry indeed.

In this case, the Mother has stayed at home, and brought her daughter up,the Father has worked all his working life.
There are far more people like them but if on the off chance their daughter had been involved in the riots,people on here and some very extreme and cold politicians and media would be listing them as a target to be evicted too,not just the daughter.

Wrong to me that is, and if it's right,then the UK has a very hard future ahead of it. If the UK goes down this road, I think I would rather emigrate after Uni than support such a society.

(Before anyone pounces, my Parents are seeing me through Uni, not the taxpayer).

[lostalex]

The culture of entitlement needs to end. Everyone needs to stop expecting they have a RIGHT to living the same way people that actually work for a living live. This is not the Soviet Union. Many countries have tried this idea that the government should provide everything for you, and it failed every time.

Look at the government.. if you trust the government to take care of you then yu are an idiot. The government is incompetant and wasteful and run by idiots. If you think living off the government is the answer, ask the people who used to live under communist Russia how well that works.

[Zippy]

Council homes are highly sought after by many needy people. Living in one and paying relatively low rent(or no rent in many cases) is a huge privilige. If members of your household are making the area unsafe, unkempt and intolerable for the decent residents then they need to be kicked out.

Yes, there may well be innocent members of that household...but there are many more innocent victims in the area who have to tolerate the crimes being committed. So tough shyt. Control your household and the members in it or get the fck out.

Truth is, some people are not fit to live in civilised company.