[InOne]

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[Iceman]

Originally Posted by Novo

I am always wary of giving to charity as i don't believe most of the money is actually used for Africa i'd rather do something where i can witness something being done which is pretty hard unless you volunteer to work or help out there i still give quite a big amount of money each month to Moni Malawi though

My Dad helps out with sending clothes and stuff over to Gambia, which is what I do, all my old Jerseys go over there an once a year he'll send a cheque over too but he visits the place so he knows the money is actually helping.

[Vicky.]

It would do much more good IMO if people were to send clothes/food/bottled water etc rather than giving money to these charities. That way it WILL help the people who need it.

I know its a bit more of a fanny on to do that though. The only thing I do really to help countries like this is send a shoebox every year to gambia I think it is, at xmas, with a toy and a few other things in it. And put my old glasses in the box at the opticians...apparently they go to third world countries

[bbfan1991]

Yes, it's a shame for them and wish there was more help than there is at the moment for the people that are suffering.

[Novo]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

It would do much more good IMO if people were to send clothes/food/bottled water etc rather than giving money to these charities. That way it WILL help the people who need it.

I know its a bit more of a fanny on to do that though. The only thing I do really to help countries like this is send a shoebox every year to gambia I think it is, at xmas, with a toy and a few other things in it. And put my old glasses in the box at the opticians...apparently they go to third world countries

Yeah i use to do the shoebox thing when i was younger totally forgot about it until you just mentioned it now

[rk3388]

people probably wont agree with what i have to say but ill say it. i feel extremely bad for people in that country but not at all for the people in united states or canada who are homeless/ living off welfare( unless they have a child or something) because in some countries, so many people have no chances to go to school, get a proper job, but in usa and canada i cant stand the people who are given so many oppurtunities like schooling and drop out of school early and use our tax money for drugs and booze. zero sympathy from me. so yes i think we should use more of our tax money to help other countries and less on welfare and helping people with no work ethic.

That being said, we should defiantly not give the money directly to the governments of corrupt countries. Its like when people fundraised to help the people in haiti after the earthquake and the government used next to none of the money on helping their people, its pathetic.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Novo

Yeah i use to do the shoebox thing when i was younger totally forgot about it until you just mentioned it now

Some woman comes round out house in november to collect them. Been doing it for about 6 years now. Only costs me about a fiver and its a present for some kid who has nothing and will be so grateful

[Scarlett.]

Originally Posted by lostalex

I don't feel sorry for Africa, or any of the political institutions in Africa.

I feel sorry for Africans.

Amen to that

[keithafc]

Originally Posted by Eoin

You do realise companies arent trying to use them they're trying to help them. Opinions like this sicken me, i'd just pray the tables are never turned on you some day and someone out there spoke like that of you. Its not like they asked to be born into a life of poverty an starvation. And do you realise how much money it would actually cost to help these people out? its nothing compared to whats been donated so far, they keep asking because they need the money its nothing to do with exploitation.

Why? Patrick was spot *****ing on!.

My little brother turns any of those adverts over the moment he sees them. Not because he doesn't feel sorry for them, but because he is sick and tired of seeing such depressing scenes when the governments around the world could end it quickly if they choose too.

And he is right, every *****ing year the same adverts are on, same things like Comic relief. I like charity but really, we see no improvements at all, we still see large starvation going on.

So you can't blame people if they hold that view.

[Grimnir]

I don't care anymore because I have realised that human beings are disgusting creatures.
All over the world since the dawn of man, they fight and kill each other like rabid dogs.
Still today the so called western civilized world is killing thousands a year and they don't give a ****. They enjoy it.
Throughout Africa they are killing each other in petty wars.
Every country in the world is a ****hole filled with disgusting human beings.
To sum up what kind of species human beings are, look at the kind of economic system we live under. Capitalism.
Even if the starving in Africa managed to get out of poverty, what would they do then? Maybe join the army and take part in a good ole war? Maybe move to the west and become a filthy capitalist themselves, watch the television and see more starving children. Then turn a blind eye and think to themselves "at least I got my ****, thats all that matters"
I feel sorry for the planet having such a disgusting species infecting its surface for so long.
Human beings love to war, they love killing and death. They don't give a **** about other human beings, they just pretend they do to ease their conscience.
Humans are not civilized, they are barbarians with technology.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Grimnir

I don't care anymore because I have realised that human beings are disgusting creatures.
All over the world since the dawn of man, they fight and kill each other like rabid dogs.
Still today the so called western civilized world is killing thousands a year and they don't give a ****. They enjoy it.
Throughout Africa they are killing each other in petty wars.
Every country in the world is a ****hole filled with disgusting human beings.
To sum up what kind of species human beings are, look at the kind of economic system we live under. Capitalism.
Even if the starving in Africa managed to get out of poverty, what would they do then? Maybe join the army and take part in a good ole war? Maybe move to the west and become a filthy capitalist themselves, watch the television and see more starving children. Then turn a blind eye and think to themselves "at least I got my ****, thats all that matters"
I feel sorry for the planet having such a disgusting species infecting its surface for so long.
Human beings love to war, they love killing and death. They don't give a **** about other human beings, they just pretend they do to ease their conscience.
Humans are not civilized, they are barbarians with technology.

You're a cheerful soul, if only we could all have that positivity

[Cromwell1900]

Originally Posted by Grimnir

I don't care anymore because I have realised that human beings are disgusting creatures.
All over the world since the dawn of man, they fight and kill each other like rabid dogs.
Still today the so called western civilized world is killing thousands a year and they don't give a ****. They enjoy it.
Throughout Africa they are killing each other in petty wars.
Every country in the world is a ****hole filled with disgusting human beings.
To sum up what kind of species human beings are, look at the kind of economic system we live under. Capitalism.
Even if the starving in Africa managed to get out of poverty, what would they do then? Maybe join the army and take part in a good ole war? Maybe move to the west and become a filthy capitalist themselves, watch the television and see more starving children. Then turn a blind eye and think to themselves "at least I got my ****, thats all that matters"
I feel sorry for the planet having such a disgusting species infecting its surface for so long.
Human beings love to war, they love killing and death. They don't give a **** about other human beings, they just pretend they do to ease their conscience.
Humans are not civilized, they are barbarians with technology.

Well Said Grimner.

You won't get the Joyseekers to read further than a few lines of that but anyone who values Truth over personal Joy will.

Originally Posted by Ammi

You're a cheerful soul, if only we could all have that positivity

Ever considered that looking for positivity in everything and everyone is slightly unrealistic in a "Serious Debates Forum" There is nothing Positive about blind spotting a well supported POV simply because it displeases you either.

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by Patrick

No, bored of them.

Ditto

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Cromwell1900

Well Said Grimner.

You won't get the Joyseekers to read further than a few lines of that but anyone who values Truth over personal Joy will.




Ever considered that looking for positivity in everything and everyone is slightly unrealistic in a "Serious Debates Forum" There is nothing Positive about blind spotting a well supported POV simply because it displeases you either.

I have considered that there is a middle ground between 'the world is evil, all men are disgusting creatures who kill each other like rabid dogs, and enjoy it' and 'we're all god's angels, sniffing flowers and hugging trees and making sweet love and music'. I'm not sure what you're trying to prove, other than you can read

[Cromwell1900]

Where is the Middle ground in Africa then. Surely if you were an African you would see only Gremnirs point of view.

Still Big Business exploit it for it's minerals make deals with Warlords rather than legit Governments in order to secure those Minerals for our Playstations and Jewellery shops, forcing people to move from there homes (near Water btw) else risk a date with a Machetee.

Gremnirs point of view is very valid at least to some African's. If you want to critisise that view then offer more than sarcasm i think.

Tell us what good Man has done for anything other than Himself for instance?

[Kazanne]

Wherever people are from doesn't matter it is only geographic,if someone is suffering we should help,afterall we are all human and should feel compassion,especially to those poor kids.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Cromwell1900

Where is the Middle ground in Africa then. Surely if you were an African you would see only Gremnirs point of view.

Still Big Business exploit it for it's minerals make deals with Warlords rather than legit Governments in order to secure those Minerals for our Playstations and Jewellery shops, forcing people to move from there homes (near Water btw) else risk a date with a Machetee.

Gremnirs point of view is very valid at least to some African's. If you want to critisise that view then offer more than sarcasm i think.

Tell us what good Man has done for anything other than Himself for instance?

Hundreds of billions of pounds have been raised for Africa and it still hasn't had a long term effect. There are still everyday, men, women and children dying with lack of food and water. Am I saying we should stop sending relief, we should stop trying, we should let them die? No we keep doing it because we like to think we can save lives, that the help we give can make a difference, and that makes us disgusting creatures, barbarians, rabid dogs!!
If I was in Africa, I don't agree that point of view would be valid, I believe they would agree that without the help that has managed to get through, things would be far worse, and I think they would believe man was good, not evil. What has man done? - he's done what he can, it's not enough but we've tried and will continue to do so, despite corrupt governments, for one reason only, because some, no, most people are good. And there's no freebies in it for us.

[joeysteele]

I do feel sorry for Africa,yes.

I also think that the relief organisations and charities need to come together, combine the resources and save on costs too. I also think Nations have to insist all aid, financial or otherwise goes direct to those who need it.
No more handing over funds to the Govts of those Nations to squander.
We can intervene in other Countries when we want to get rid of a leader of that Country so there must be a way all the Nations, that want to donate help, can come together and see it through to the very end and to the source where it is needed most.

Education of the people too as to avoiding having further children they cannot yet provide for needs to be done,if the Church/es are a stumbling block to that happening then the Church/es should donate massively to feed the starving children.

It is a disgrace in the 21st century still, that the Nations of the World allow chidlren to be born to die, to starve to death when all they need is food, water and simple medication.
Only the real hardest of people could look at the TV and see those starving chidlren and not feel sorry for them.It's heartbreaking to see.

No child anywhere in the World, should be born to die or be allowed to die for the want of simple basic needs.

[Cromwell1900]

Africans see Charity as Guilt Money rightly or wrongly.

They see European/American Companies move into there land then fence it off. The Company hires local Mercenaries to Police the Border of that fence because inside that fence there are Diamonds. At this point good Men invite as many local people as possible to work inside the fence and pay them an incredible wage, then if the Border needs extending for more exploration the Mercenaries are asked to go out and offer good money to the local people for them to move to a new area, the Mercenaries knock on doors and politely ask if they could buy there home and land, agreement is made everyone is happy. The African economy grows, because of it's natural resources. Charity is not needed etc.

Of course the last paragraph was a work of pure fiction, but rather me tell the true story of what really happens i will simply say

Some Men Profit whilst paying starvation wages
Some Men Hack, Rape and intimidate the locals away
Some Men Allow it because they are being bribed
Some Men Don't investigate claims of brutality because of good tax revenues
Some Men are Apathetic because "what could they do about it anyway"
Some Men Are Bored of the topic
Some Men like fancy Jewels and don't worry about there origin

Charitable giving should not be necessary if the Wealth of Africa remained in Africa, and it's resources not pimped out to Western Companies by Corrupt African officials.

It is only the fact that people do give to Charities that suggests Men are capable of caring for it's fellow human's but until we control Our Businesses, how can we claim the Charity is sincere.

Many Men have leaked information about corrupt Businesses so clearly Men are not all bad. But the good guys are not winning the fight beyond the camera lens.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Cromwell1900

Africans see Charity as Guilt Money rightly or wrongly.

They see European/American Companies move into there land then fence it off. The Company hires local Mercenaries to Police the Border of that fence because inside that fence there are Diamonds. At this point good Men invite as many local people as possible to work inside the fence and pay them an incredible wage, then if the Border needs extending for more exploration the Mercenaries are asked to go out and offer good money to the local people for them to move to a new area, the Mercenaries knock on doors and politely ask if they could buy there home and land, agreement is made everyone is happy. The African economy grows, because of it's natural resources. Charity is not needed etc.

Of course the last paragraph was a work of pure fiction, but rather me tell the true story of what really happens i will simply say

Some Men Profit whilst paying starvation wages
Some Men Hack, Rape and intimidate the locals away
Some Men Allow it because they are being bribed
Some Men Don't investigate claims of brutality because of good tax revenues
Some Men are Apathetic because "what could they do about it anyway"
Some Men Are Bored of the topic
Some Men like fancy Jewels and don't worry about there origin

Charitable giving should not be necessary if the Wealth of Africa remained in Africa, and it's resources not pimped out to Western Companies by Corrupt African officials.

It is only the fact that people do give to Charities that suggests Men are capable of caring for it's fellow human's but until we control Our Businesses, how can we claim the Charity is sincere.

Many Men have leaked information about corrupt Businesses so clearly Men are not all bad. But the good guys are not winning the fight beyond the camera lens.

.....and probably never will, but still we try, man can't be all bad................