[cell]

The purpose of an apology is to acknowledge yourself in the wrong and learning from your behaviour. An apology can seem insincere but be true, or can seem sincere and be a lie. The point is to learn from your actions and admit you were wrong, the amount of dramatics and grovelling you put into it won't change if you truly mean what your saying or not. I know I am not a mind reader so whether Denise meant her apologies or not rests with her, not in my opinion.

[Incensed]

Originally Posted by Josy

A half hearted "sorry" then pretending to do it again is not an apology imo, and we saw the twins say at the end of the highlights that she hadnt yet apologised.

Oh Puhleeze! She apologised, if she didn't get down on her knees and beg forgiveness, I guess it doesn't count though

[hijaxers]

Originally Posted by Mac1978

This series has re-engaged me. It's years since I posted on a BB site.

I reckon a clear and even grovelling apology is due here. I've nothing against Denise, but as a revovering alcoholic (of 7 years sobriety) I know a little something about drink related incidents. To adjust the clothing of another person without their permission, is not acceptable behaviour. There was a time that it wasn't acceptable in Britain and Ireland (I'm Irish), and it is certainly still unacceptable in middle America. It has nothing to do with exposing flesh - it has to do with invasion of personal privacy. Denise's behaviour was absolutely wrong.

When you do something silly (and I've done things ten times worse than this) due to booze, people will let you know that your behaviour is unacceptable. Often entire bars full of people will let you know. They're not ganging up on you, they're just letting you know that, not one, but all of them find your behaviour unacceptable. There comes a time when you must man up and realise that it's you, not the rest of the world, that is the problem.

A clear apology acknowledging the wrong-doing will be enough to restore most relationships - but not all. Some people won't forgive. That's their right, and also their problem. But it its your duty to be absolutely unequivical in acknowledging the problems that YOU (and not the people taht reacted to you) caused.

I'm not suggesting that Denise has, or hasn't a problem with booze. I certainly don't know enough about her mindset to call her an alcoholic. But I am saying that SHE (not anybody else) caused this whole row, by her excessive consumption of alcohol. As she started it - she should try to finish it. That'll require a sober and clear apology acknowledging that she, and not the rest of the world, was out of line. If she's already done that (I didn't see the show tonight), then she can't do anymore.

Well lets hope that BB remember that when the next load of housemates go in and the girls think its good fun to rip towels away from the boys - team handed - two sets of rules going on again !!

[Glenn.]

They were right on Bit On The Side last night, the idiot twin saw an opportunity of business and thought,"I'm gonna try and get something out if this", hence the threats of suing.

I don't care what anyone says, she was worried that she wasn't going to get paid for her arse being shown. Has no one seen the pictures of the pair of them online?

Reserved my arse. If she was that reserved she wouldn't take her clothes off for money, or be a playmate for the dirtiest old man on the planet.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by cell

The purpose of an apology is to acknowledge yourself in the wrong and learning from your behaviour. An apology can seem insincere but be true, or can seem sincere and be a lie. The point is to learn from your actions and admit you were wrong, the amount of dramatics and grovelling you put into it won't change if you truly mean what your saying or not. I know I am not a mind reader so whether Denise meant her apologies or not rests with her, not in my opinion.

Telling her "you'll forgive me in the morning" doesn't seem too sincere to more, me like covering her back.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by Glenn

They were right on Bit On The Side last night, the idiot twin saw an opportunity of business and thought,"I'm gonna try and get something out if this", hence the threats of suing.

I don't care what anyone says, she was worried that she wasn't going to get paid for her arse being shown. Has no one seen the pictures of the pair of them online?

Reserved my arse. If she was that reserved she wouldn't take her clothes off for money, or be a playmate for the dirtiest old man on the planet.

Same old argument to justify what Denise did

[Glenn.]

But its a true justification.

They are only in the house for that reason and for no other reason apart from that.

[Jake.]

Did the twins apologize to Gareth? (If yes, ignore this post).

[Sophiee]

I wasn't surprised by this at all. she just saw it as a joke although it wasn't to karissa!

[InOne]

Originally Posted by Glenn

But its a true justification.

They are only in the house for that reason and for no other reason apart from that.

Your logic is odd

So Denise has a right or more right to do it because of what they do for a living?

[Jake.]

If the twins had not have 100% blown it out of proportion and made her feel weak and reduce her to tears (along with Nicola), I could understand her apologising once more. But now? No.

[Marsh.]

Using "alcoholic" as an insult is pathetic.

[MrWong]

Originally Posted by Mac1978

This series has re-engaged me. It's years since I posted on a BB site.

I reckon a clear and even grovelling apology is due here. I've nothing against Denise, but as a revovering alcoholic (of 7 years sobriety) I know a little something about drink related incidents. To adjust the clothing of another person without their permission, is not acceptable behaviour. There was a time that it wasn't acceptable in Britain and Ireland (I'm Irish), and it is certainly still unacceptable in middle America. It has nothing to do with exposing flesh - it has to do with invasion of personal privacy. Denise's behaviour was absolutely wrong.

When you do something silly (and I've done things ten times worse than this) due to booze, people will let you know that your behaviour is unacceptable. Often entire bars full of people will let you know. They're not ganging up on you, they're just letting you know that, not one, but all of them find your behaviour unacceptable. There comes a time when you must man up and realise that it's you, not the rest of the world, that is the problem.

A clear apology acknowledging the wrong-doing will be enough to restore most relationships - but not all. Some people won't forgive. That's their right, and also their problem. But it its your duty to be absolutely unequivical in acknowledging the problems that YOU (and not the people taht reacted to you) caused.

I'm not suggesting that Denise has, or hasn't a problem with booze. I certainly don't know enough about her mindset to call her an alcoholic. But I am saying that SHE (not anybody else) caused this whole row, by her excessive consumption of alcohol. As she started it - she should try to finish it. That'll require a sober and clear apology acknowledging that she, and not the rest of the world, was out of line. If she's already done that (I didn't see the show tonight), then she can't do anymore.

This is a great post.

Agree with it all.

[Jake.]

Originally Posted by 08marsh

Using "alcoholic" as an insult is pathetic.

100% agree. People forget it is a serious condition.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by JH95

If the twins had not have 100% blown it out of proportion and made her feel weak and reduce her to tears (along with Nicola), I could understand her apologising once more. But now? No.

Frankie blew it out of proportion, actually...

[Daviemacscot]

Heff has probably employed a team of telephonists to continuously phone in for "team America" and boost their careers. Plain and simple the ONLY way they could win this after the way they have made it clear this is a business venture and nothing more. They have made great viewing, no doubt. But they surely can't be allowed to win by the British public?!

[Glenn.]

Originally Posted by InOne

Your logic is odd

So Denise has a right or more right to do it because of what they do for a living?

I'm not saying that. Denise apologized after she did it which should of been ok for Karissa but she saw an opportunity to blow it way out of proportion. It was uncalled for.

Like I said, she saw an opportunity to try and make something for herself.

[Jake.]

Originally Posted by InOne

Frankie blew it out of proportion, actually...

No, Frankie was calmly trying to get his point across. But with one of the twins (can't remember which) in the room undermiming him, ge couldn't whisper, let alone shout. One of the twins told Frankie it was none of his business, yet didn't complain when nosey Nicola jumped to their defences.

[iRyan]

Originally Posted by Bojangles

I saw Denise apologise twice,on the sofa and again in the kitchen.

WRONG.

On the sofa, Karissa said "APOLOGIZE!" and Denise THEN said "sorry"

In the kitchen, Denise didn't apologize, she just said "you'll forgive me tomorrow"

Next.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by Glenn

I'm not saying that. Denise apologized after she did it which should of been ok for Karissa but she saw an opportunity to blow it way out of proportion. It was uncalled for.

Like I said, she saw an opportunity to try and make something for herself.

As I've said before, her saying sorry then just looked like she was covering her back.

[iRyan]

Originally Posted by InOne

As I've said before, her saying sorry then just looked like she was covering her back.

This. She never gave a sincere apology even know she knew Karissa didn't like it. Karissa had to ASK Denise to apologize, and that was it.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by JH95

No, Frankie was calmly trying to get his point across. But with one of the twins (can't remember which) in the room undermiming him, ge couldn't whisper, let alone shout. One of the twins told Frankie it was none of his business, yet didn't complain when nosey Nicola jumped to their defences.

Calmly stirring the pot you mean. Nicola was just telling him it was none of his business and by that time her and Denise had kicked off anyway.

[Jake.]

Originally Posted by iRyan

WRONG.

On the sofa, Karissa said "APOLOGIZE!" and Denise THEN said "sorry"

In the kitchen, Denise didn't apologize, she just said "you'll forgive me tomorrow"

Next.

Wrong... she apologised once and then said 'do you forgive me' to which the twin replied 'I will forgive you tommorow' so Denise said 'Ok, you will forgive me tommorow'. Denise didn't say 'you will forgive me tomorrow' randomly, did she?

[Bojangles]

Originally Posted by iRyan

WRONG.

On the sofa, Karissa said "APOLOGIZE!" and Denise THEN said "sorry"

In the kitchen, Denise didn't apologize, she just said "you'll forgive me tomorrow"

Next.

Well if Denise said "Sorry." What is that then nothing more or less but an apology.

[Jake.]

Originally Posted by InOne

Calmly stirring the pot you mean. Nicola was just telling him it was none of his business and by that time her and Denise had kicked off anyway.

But it was none of Nicola's business either, she can't help but stick her beak in and somehow get involved.