Originally Posted by Livia

There are plenty of people like this man peppered around the country. We all know people like this, don't we? Who haven't worked for decades, if ever, and who have milked the system for years. But every thinking person knows that they are they exception rather than the rule and they do not represent the vast majority of people who quite ligitimately claim benefits to which they are entitled. However, the fact is that this man (I use the term "man" in its loosest possible sense) has lived his debauched life expense-free on the back of every hard-working tax-payer in this country. I don't see the point of getting all outraged because a newspaper (again, using the term loosely) points out that he is a freeloading parasite. I would say that's the mildest form on insult for him, considering the crime he committed, one so terrible that it's almost incomprehensible.

I think the wider issue is the fact that the journalistic profession seems to be pushing a lot of the governments divide and conquer platform for them, and extremely successfully at that.

It isn't just one newspaper - the papers that push this narrative are achieving the goals. Look at this forum for example. The people that are turning on people on benefits/welfare because of isolated incidents like this guy, is really disappointing.

I think that' why the Heil really ire's people.

[Kizzy]

History is replete with warnings about what can happen when the crimes of individuals are pinned on entire communities. Today's slurring of the whole category of benefit claimants may not pour over into violence on the streets, because the disparate millions who make recourse to benefits do so for myriad reasons, and are not an identifiable community as such. But this sort of coverage nonetheless suggests that – far from being classless – Britain continues to be scarred by class war. The only real question is where the battle lines are drawn, and a new study, which was heavily trailed by the BBC on Wednesday, suggested that the cleavages that count may be shifting

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...d-and-despised

[arista]

All One Class

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

I think the wider issue is the fact that the journalistic profession seems to be pushing a lot of the governments divide and conquer platform for them, and extremely successfully at that.

It isn't just one newspaper - the papers that push this narrative are achieving the goals. Look at this forum for example. The people that are turning on people on benefits/welfare because of isolated incidents like this guy, is really disappointing.

I think that' why the Heil really ire's people.

Is that really happening though? Does anyone really imagine that everyone on benefits is the same? We all know there are people who milk the system and seem to do okay on it. We also know that they're very much the minority. By saying that there are people like that doesn't reflect on people who are ligitimately claiming and who would work if they could.

We also all know what the Daily Fail is like. I'm sure no one here would read it... or admit to reading it. Being surprised that they make wild generalisations and use shock tactics with their headlines is like being surprised that Playboy has tits in it.

Originally Posted by Livia

Is that really happening though? Does anyone really imagine that everyone on benefits is the same? We all know there are people who milk the system and seem to do okay on it. We also know that they're very much the minority. By saying that there are people like that doesn't reflect on people who are ligitimately claiming and who would work if they could.

We also all know what the Daily Fail is like. I'm sure no one here would read it... or admit to reading it. Being surprised that they make wild generalisations and use shock tactics with their headlines is like being surprised that Playboy has tits in it.

I think it pretty much is happening. Opinions don't have to be shifted so we all think that Philpott is the median, but the new myth that benefit claimants are earning Ł26k is out there enough for Osbourne to use it with workers at Morrisons the other day. It's about eroding opinions. The right can only ever be successful when it convinces people to vote against their own interests. It's all about the packaging, and right now, benefit claimants are being wrapped up nicely and delivered to the hard working Galahads of England.

We have to cut from the poor, because these people are taking from you.

The articles that pop up on here all the time, from a variety of sources, showing single moms with an Ipad. You can see more and more people believing this is the norm. You and I are in the job/work market, but the generation under us are being fed this on a continual loop, so pretty soon, no one will even have any knowledge about how the practices of bankers ground the world to a halt, and it will always be the poor that are holding back the rest of us.

Not for people with nuance, but there are far too many people that are ready and willing to lap up a good versus bad, ready packaged spoonful of medicine packed with benefits sugar.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

I think it pretty much is happening. ...etc. etc...

Yeah, I do see what you mean and have to agree to a certain extent. And Osborne... well, we all know he's a cock, right? But I like to think that most people understand that, while a few will milk the system, most people who claim benefits don't milk it, and given a choice would rather work and have a decent standard of living. It's just that with this particular case, obviously it was his character and personality that made him the monster he is and not the fact that he's lived rent and expenses free for decades... apart from that, I don't see anything that's being said about him that isn't true.

[Kazanne]

Was a good interview on This Morning about the unfairness of the DM story.

[Jack_]

Yeah, Owen Jones was on that wasn't he Kazanne? One of my favourite political commentators. I'll catch up later.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Yeah, Owen Jones was on that wasn't he Kazanne? One of my favourite political commentators. I'll catch up later.

Yes Jack,you'll enjoy it I think.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Yeah, Owen Jones was on that wasn't he Kazanne? One of my favourite political commentators. I'll catch up later.

Yes Owen Jones was good with Ann W.
on Ch5News.

She smacked him down to earth.

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Yes Jack,you'll enjoy it I think.

Good to hear

Originally Posted by arista

Yes Owen Jones was good with Ann W.
on Ch5News.

She smacked him down to earth.

Owen is never smacked down to earth, he does the opposite to any opponent of his actually

[arista]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Good to hear



Owen is never smacked down to earth, he does the opposite to any opponent of his actually

Yes but Ann had it Right

[Kizzy]

This man was a monster, he was prior to his benefits and he remained so.
The right wing media the torygraph, sun, mail, express and times all influence the public.. and they have.
Osborne preaching to blue collar workers like some maniacal evangelical was testament to that.

This was one warning from last year...

"I would really urge particularly Conservative colleagues but people in all parties to be careful. I don't think we can afford to preside over a society where there is a gradual eroding of sympathy for people at the bottom end of the income spectrum and a rapid erosion of sympathy for people on benefits."

She returns to the theme of morality and politics, saying: "I think deliberately to stoke up envy and division between people in order to gain popularity at the expense of children's lives is immoral. It has no good intent.

"There are all sorts of things you have to do when times are tight that have negative consequences but you do them for good purposes. To do something for negative purposes that also has negative consequences – that is immoral

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...onisation-poor
But the case fits in so well with the current

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by arista

Yes but Ann had it Right

Ann never has it right

[Vicky.]

FFS, no surprises here... Osbourne got in there quickly.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...yle-questioned

[arista]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

FFS, no surprises here... Osbourne got in there quickly.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...yle-questioned

So
Thats his Job Vicky.


There is a Problem with "some" people on Benefits

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by arista

So
Thats his Job Vicky.


There is a Problem with "some" people on Benefits

Its his job to exploit the deaths of 6 innocent children to push his antiwelfare agenda?

I dont think so somehow.

I agree that something needs to be done about the benefit system...but using these deaths to score points is ****ing ridiculous.

He may have had a lot of kids to screw the benefit system. This didnt make him a killer anymore than being a doctor made Harold Shipman a killer. Philpott was a killer long before he had those children (attempted murder charges when younger)

If Osbourne has a problem with large families taking the piss...today is really not the time to bring it up.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-22025035

Labour's Andy McDonald described the chancellor's comments after the Philpott sentencing as a "total disgrace", saying the case was entirely separate from the wider debate about welfare.

"It just shows the depths to which they are prepared to stoop in demonising people who find themselves in difficult circumstances," he told BBC Radio 4's The World at One.

I agree 100% with that^

Originally Posted by arista

So
Thats his Job Vicky.


There is a Problem with "some" people on Benefits

Is there any chance you could actually write a paragraph or two, to lay out what you actually believe about these things? You say the same things often, but without any depth or reasoning, and in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary.

Maybe you could answer a few questions?

What caused the financial meltdown?

What is the best way for us to deal with the effects of the recession going forward?

What should the government provide financially to a family of 1 man, 1 woman, and 1 small child?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

FFS, no surprises here... Osbourne got in there quickly.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...yle-questioned

Using this as a way to sway public opinion ... new low even for the tories.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

Is there any chance you could actually write a paragraph or two, to lay out what you actually believe about these things? You say the same things often, but without any depth or reasoning, and in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary.

Maybe you could answer a few questions?

What caused the financial meltdown?

What is the best way for us to deal with the effects of the recession going forward?

What should the government provide financially to a family of 1 man, 1 woman, and 1 small child?

If had time I could write more
I am working

Originally Posted by arista

If had time I could write more
I am working

We can wait. I'm sure you don't work 24hrs a day, so write something later. I'd be interested to know exactly what you think, and what you think are good solutions, and I'm sure I'm not alone here.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

We can wait. I'm sure you don't work 24hrs a day, so write something later. I'd be interested to know exactly what you think, and what you think are good solutions, and I'm sure I'm not alone here.

If its My Contract I will

Originally Posted by arista

If its My Contract I will

WTD prevents you from working 24hrs continually.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Yeah, Owen Jones was on that wasn't he Kazanne? One of my favourite political commentators. I'll catch up later.

Owen Jones was really good this morning Jack, for me anyway he certainly showed the guy from the Sun up for what he was too.

Really good, I like Owen Jones too,glad This Morning had the sense to bring him on for balance.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

WTD prevents you from working 24hrs continually.

I am Private
International Contracts
International Times.


If its my Job - I fecking Finish It.