[joeysteele]

People can go on about Labour all they like, however all the treaties signed as to the EU would have been signed by Conservatives or Labour no matter who was in power and so the free movement of EU citizens would be happening regardless.

Immigration got out of hand in their time in power latterly, Labour rightly has to be blamed for that.

However, not now, this Prime Minister, foolishly in 2010, promised to cut immigration to the tens of thousands.
He failed bigtime because it is probably unachievable anyway.
That is now totally and only his govts. fault, not Labours, he doesn't even have the figures falling,as Labour did by 2010 after the peak in 2005.
That is his fault again.

The point is, yes, halt illegal immigration when you come across it, he obviously has no will to put in more resources to do so, so he will need to just hope for the best as to that.
Then make full use and nurture the success that immigration brings to the UK, where all statistics show, that the benefits of immigration to the UK far outweigh any of the negatives as to it.

Then admit, as Labour and all other parties should too, that none have the right policy as it it at all and realise that divisions as to immigration are never going to bring any solutions.
Hammer out a policy,that can be continuous, fair and welcoming as to the positives to all immigration to the UK from wherever.
Stop this we know best attitude from all parties, when in fact all they do as has been shown over the last 5 years is make things even worse.

One of the first steps all parties should also take,obviously excluding the more irrational UKIP leadership's thinking currently,is to stop right now, allowing immigration to be blamed for most of the UKs ills at present.
Take any problems there may be of immigration out of the political arena with a strong and appropriate united front to putting in place a policy as to same.

Stop allowing the demonisation of immigrants and also the nastier side too of the likes of UKIP,blaming foreign immigration for just about everything.

Labour failed on immigration, the Conservatives too failed in coalition over the last 5 years on immigration and if they really try to press ahead thinking they have all the answers to it themselves now, the Conservatives will fail badly again over the next few years too.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

People can go on about Labour all they like, however all the treaties signed as to the EU would have been signed by Conservatives or Labour no matter who was in power and so the free movement of EU citizens would be happening regardless.

Immigration got out of hand in their time in power latterly, Labour rightly has to be blamed for that.

However, not now, this Prime Minister, foolishly in 2010, promised to cut immigration to the tens of thousands.
He failed bigtime because it is probably unachievable anyway.
That is now totally and only his govts. fault, not Labours, he doesn't even have the figures falling,as Labour did by 2010 after the peak in 2005.
That is his fault again.

The point is, yes, halt illegal immigration when you come across it, he obviously has no will to put in more resources to do so, so he will need to just hope for the best as to that.
Then make full use and nurture the success that immigration brings to the UK, where all statistics show, that the benefits of immigration to the UK far outweigh any of the negatives as to it.

Then admit, as Labour and all other parties should too, that none have the right policy as it it at all and realise that divisions as to immigration are never going to bring any solutions.
Hammer out a policy,that can be continuous, fair and welcoming as to the positives to all immigration to the UK from wherever.
Stop this we know best attitude from all parties, when in fact all they do as has been shown over the last 5 years is make things even worse.

One of the first steps all parties should also take,obviously excluding the more irrational UKIP leadership's thinking currentlyis to stop right now, allowing immigration to be blamed for most of the UKs ills at present.
Take any problems there may be of immigration out of the political arena with a strong and appropriate united front to putting in place a policy as to same.

Stop allowing the demonisation of immigrants and also the nastier side too of the likes of UKIP,blaming foreign immigration for just about everything.

Labour failed on immigration, the Conservatives too failed in coalition over the last 5 years on immigration and if they really try to press ahead thinking they have all the answers to it themselves now, the Conservatives will fail badly again over the next few years too.

Joey, can you reproduce on here just WHERE the OFFICIAL UKIP Party line is that immigration is to blame for ALL the UK's ills - as you and other Labourite's keep claiming?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Joey, can you reproduce on here just WHERE the OFFICIAL UKIP Party line is that immigration is to blame for ALL the UK's ills - as you and other Labourite's keep claiming?

Can you reproduce where Joey suggested they were to blame for ALL the UKs ills?

He said most, and he's not far wrong there is he?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Can you reproduce where Joey suggested they were to blame for ALL the UKs ills?

He said most, and he's not far wrong there is he?

farage isn't blaming the immigrants hes blaming the eu and the politicians for allowing such enormous net migration

your leftists pals are mostly to blame for trying to ban free speech on the matter....im amazed you ever quote orwell hed have been disgusted by the new labour thought police and their mass censorship and perversion of the English language,,,,,their best tactic was anyone who disagrees with them gets labelled a sexist or a racist or a bigot....new labour were the spawn of satan. evil evil people spinning lies and wages illegal wars against millions of impoverished people

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Can you reproduce where Joey suggested they were to blame for ALL the UKs ills?

He said most, and he's not far wrong there is he?

You aren't being clever Kizzy - not at all. I'm asking a perfectly reasonable question in a polite manner, but OK, pedantics aside, 'most' and 'just abouts' then.

And yes he IS wrong. But it is futile trying to debate that or any other subject with someone like you who constantly uses circular arguments and misrepresentations and who blindly ignores empiric irrefutable evidence which defeats her arguments to still post the same nonsense argument, and who still supports an idiot like Russell Brand despite him being clearly shown to be a total moronic buffoon, liar, and notoriously shameless 'U' Turner.

So I think I'll just wait for Joey's response thank you.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

You aren't being clever Kizzy - not at all. I'm asking a perfectly reasonable question in a polite manner, but OK, pedantics aside, 'most' and 'just abouts' then.

And yes he IS wrong. But it is futile trying to debate that or any other subject with someone like you who constantly uses circular arguments and misrepresentations and who blindly ignores empiric irrefutable evidence which defeats her arguments to still post the same nonsense argument, and who still supports an idiot like Russell Brand despite him being clearly shown to be a total moronic buffoon, liar, and notoriously shameless 'U' Turner.

So I think I'll just wait for Joey's response thank you.

I was only pointing out you had misquoted him, it's so so annoying when that happens and leads to all kinds of confusion.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Joey, can you reproduce on here just WHERE the OFFICIAL UKIP Party line is that immigration is to blame for ALL the UK's ills - as you and other Labourite's keep claiming?

Oh come on, Nigel Farage even tried to blame being late for a meeting in Wales on immigration.

I simply do not like or support the the always negative approach UKIP takes on immigration and to me, and to others,it comes across as deliberate demonisation of immigrants.

They may have valid points,as all parties do,for me they go about it the wrong way,so I have big concerns at their real agenda, of course that is only my view, I could be wrong.
As I have said,I do not myself believe any party has the solutions or right policies as to immigration.

One thing I have to give UKIP is, absolutely they were right to point out that it should not be that anyone coming to the UK can just get benefits paid right off to them.
I also add, no way do I believe either of the main 2 parties would be even now looking at when benefits could be paid to those migrating here,had UKIP not got that at the top of the agenda.
That was a positive criticism of the system UKIP made,no doubt at all as to that.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Oh come on, Nigel Farage even tried to blame being late for a meeting in Wales on immigration.

I simply do not like or support the the always negative approach UKIP takes on immigration and to me, and to others,it comes across as deliberate demonisation of immigrants.

They may have valid points,as all parties do,for me they go about it the wrong way,so I have big concerns at their real agenda, of course that is only my view, I could be wrong.
As I have said,I do not myself believe any party has the solutions or right policies as to immigration.

One thing I have to give UKIP is, absolutely they were right to point out that it should not be that anyone coming to the UK can just get benefits paid right off to them.
I also add, no way do I believe either of the main 2 parties would be even now looking at when benefits could be paid to those migrating here,had UKIP not got that at the top of the agenda.
That was a positive criticism of the system UKIP made,no doubt at all as to that.

Thank you for responding Joey and for your fairness - especially the emboldened text.

I will agree to disagree on the rest.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

People can go on about Labour all they like, however all the treaties signed as to the EU would have been signed by Conservatives or Labour no matter who was in power and so the free movement of EU citizens would be happening regardless.

Immigration got out of hand in their time in power latterly, Labour rightly has to be blamed for that.

However, not now, this Prime Minister, foolishly in 2010, promised to cut immigration to the tens of thousands.
He failed bigtime because it is probably unachievable anyway.
That is now totally and only his govts. fault, not Labours, he doesn't even have the figures falling,as Labour did by 2010 after the peak in 2005.
That is his fault again.

The point is, yes, halt illegal immigration when you come across it, he obviously has no will to put in more resources to do so, so he will need to just hope for the best as to that.
Then make full use and nurture the success that immigration brings to the UK, where all statistics show, that the benefits of immigration to the UK far outweigh any of the negatives as to it.

Then admit, as Labour and all other parties should too, that none have the right policy as it it at all and realise that divisions as to immigration are never going to bring any solutions.
Hammer out a policy,that can be continuous, fair and welcoming as to the positives to all immigration to the UK from wherever.
Stop this we know best attitude from all parties, when in fact all they do as has been shown over the last 5 years is make things even worse.

One of the first steps all parties should also take,obviously excluding the more irrational UKIP leadership's thinking currently,is to stop right now, allowing immigration to be blamed for most of the UKs ills at present.
Take any problems there may be of immigration out of the political arena with a strong and appropriate united front to putting in place a policy as to same.

Stop allowing the demonisation of immigrants and also the nastier side too of the likes of UKIP,blaming foreign immigration for just about everything.

Labour failed on immigration, the Conservatives too failed in coalition over the last 5 years on immigration and if they really try to press ahead thinking they have all the answers to it themselves now, the Conservatives will fail badly again over the next few years too.

embarrassing post. new labour are distusting murderous lying bigots....the tories have been too slow but now that Europhile clegg is out the tories can take action.....theyre scrapping child benefits going aborad, theyre bringing in 5 yrs to qualify for benefits and paying in national insurance, theyre bringing in a eu referendum, theyre tergetting illegal immigrants harder than ever.....they realise now how out of contro, this is....a city the size of Cardiff arriving on this small island every year is the road to insanity

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by the truth

embarrassing post. new labour are distusting murderous lying bigots....the tories have been too slow but now that Europhile clegg is out the tories can take action.....theyre scrapping child benefits going aborad, theyre bringing in 5 yrs to qualify for benefits and paying in national insurance, theyre bringing in a eu referendum, theyre tergetting illegal immigrants harder than ever.....they realise now how out of contro, this is....a city the size of Cardiff arriving on this small island every year is the road to insanity

I have not a thing I even want to say to you as to any topic, thank you very much.
I told you that yesterday.
The post is not embarrassing to me since I mean all I have said in it but I want no more of your nasty insults.

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

Not to you Josh because despite your obvious intelligence your naivety is alarming.

I don't think that I am naive at all. My area is still 96.8% white british, and yet seems to be one of the most racist and anti-immigration areas in the country.. which proves that it has everything to do with naivety, but to those who actually think we have too many immigrants. People on the local facebook page which has quite a lot of active posters on it, many have said they believe our town is only 40% white now which is very laughable.

Obviously my town is not the only one in England and so I cannot speak for everyone, but I have not yet seen a statistic in which there are more immigrants than "natives".

Originally Posted by the truth

lol what complete and utter lies....typical of the brainwash spin weve had from new labour for the past 20 years...for starters millions of net immigration directly effects the nhs the housing the poverty the welfare state the child benefits the economy everything is directly connected etc etc
as were in the eu we have no real control over our borders, weve allowed vats amounts of illegal immigrants many of whom are criminals plus we should have a points system allowing us to select who comes in

this is a total fiasco. Europe is a disaster as we see with the tens of thousands drowing at sea.....the endless European countries bankrupt, the 50%+ youth unemployment across several European nations....the EU hasn't even handed its own accounts in

ps have you actually read the eu constituton? didn't think so

how dare you or anyone from new labour call anyone racist again....the most discriminatory act in the history of this country came from new labour when they illegally murdered 1 million innocent Iraqis and they actually dare to preach about discrimination...new labour should burn in hell for eternity

I don't support New Labour at all by the way.. the new right-wing policies on immigration are very alarming to me. Also in terms of Iraq.. yes that was was disgusting and should never have happened, but it was also mostly Bush who convinced Blair (who I would like arrested) to do all of this. It was racism that led to the war also.

Originally Posted by the truth

embarrassing post. new labour are distusting murderous lying bigots....the tories have been too slow but now that Europhile clegg is out the tories can take action.....theyre scrapping child benefits going aborad, theyre bringing in 5 yrs to qualify for benefits and paying in national insurance, theyre bringing in a eu referendum, theyre tergetting illegal immigrants harder than ever.....they realise now how out of contro, this is....a city the size of Cardiff arriving on this small island every year is the road to insanity

I'll just not reply anymore if you actually think that..