[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Lostie!

Precisely, you said "people", not "some" or "certain" people. I've found people usually backtrack or blame "semantics" because of their own poor word choice.

And I'm sure there are examples of people disliking (and also liking, for that matter) housemates based on their ethnicity, I never once denied that, that would be denying racism exists altogether. I simply don't believe that was the driving factor in Tiffany (and various others before her) not winning.

And I find that people usually incite semantic discussions when they're desperately seeking an argument, or to be offended - or both.

Okay then? But I think the evidence is stacked against you. If countless black women have been evicted over white males when most of the time they've done nothing wrong except...well, be black, if black women can be labelled 'aggressive' and 'unsafe' yet white women can act even more aggressively and people laugh it off, if there can be forty something series and no black woman has ever won...then yes I think there's some deep rooted issues. And passing them off as 'well they need to cast better black women' like many people do as if they've all been the ****ing same is what's actually wildly offensive, not pointing it out.

[Lostie!]

Originally Posted by Jack_

And I find that people usually incite semantic discussions when they're desperately seeking an argument, or to be offended - or both.

I incited nothing, you made a sweeping claim and I wanted clarification on what exactly you meant / who exactly it was referring to. None of which would have been necessary if the wording of your frankly provocative statement wasn't so broad in the first place.

And if you want to find people desperate to be offended by something, I'd look closer to home.

Don't see much point in the two of us engaging in any futher conversation on the issue, I don't see much chance of a common ground being reached.

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Lostie!

I incited nothing, you made a sweeping claim and I wanted clarification on what exactly you meant / who exactly it was referring to. None of which would have been necessary if the wording of your frankly provocative statement wasn't so broad in the first place.

And if you want to find people desperate to be offended by something, I'd look closer to home.

Don't see much point in the two of us engaging in any futher conversation on the issue, I don't see much chance of a common ground being reached.

Well only one other person responded (and nowhere near as dramatically either) so it can't have been that provocative can it? Maybe you were just looking for an argument, yes I think that's it

LOL I knew that was coming. It's a predictable but entirely false statement I'm afraid. Believe it or not it actually takes a lot for me to be offended, and anyone who knows me that well would vouch for that - I wouldn't constantly defend the boundaries of comedy if I was easily offended. I don't find the inequality that minorities often experience in reality TV offensive, I find it disappointing. There's a difference.

I could have told you that before you even quoted my first post, but sure, I agree.

[Lostie!]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Well only one other person responded (and nowhere near as dramatically either) so it can't have been that provocative can it? Maybe you were just looking for an argument, yes I think that's it

Well then you need to "think" again. I responded in the way I did because you said "people" (without even bothering to specify whether you meant all or some of those "people") who take issue with such frequent accusations of racism are guilty of either racism or turning a blind eye to racism themselves and it happens to be a topic I feel strongly about, considering I'm mixed race and have been on the receiving end of the very thing you saw fit to accuse a group of people (of which I was one of) of being guilty of.

As I said, it's just another of an increasing amount of examples of people feeling perfectly content with accusing people they know nothing about of being racist and it's absolutely shameful (and, contrary to what you think, certainly does trivialise the issue).

I don't give a damn how many or few responded, that doesn't make it any less provocative and if you don't like being asked to answer for and actually explain the claims you make, don't bother making them in the first place or at least attempt to word them better.

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Lostie!

Well then you need to "think" again. I responded in the way I did because you said "people" (without even bothering to specify whether you meant all or some of those "people") who take issue with such frequent accusations of racism are guilty of either racism or turning a blind eye to racism themselves and it happens to be a topic I feel strongly about, considering I'm mixed race and have been on the receiving end of the very thing you saw fit to accuse a group of people (of which I was one of) of being guilty of.

As I said, it's just another of an increasing amount of examples of people feeling perfectly content with accusing people they know nothing about of being racist and it's absolutely shameful (and, contrary to what you think, certainly does trivialise the issue).

I don't give a damn how many or few responded, that doesn't make it any less provocative and if you don't like being asked to answer for and actually explain the claims you make, don't bother making them in the first place or at least attempt to word them better.

I shouldn't have to specify, if I say 'people' and you take that to mean every person that's ever existed ever then that's your problem I still stand by what I said, but I will change the wording now for you if it's so incredibly difficult to surmise what I most likely meant: some people don't like the thread title being pointed out because they either know it's true, or worse, are guilty of it themselves. Hopefully this puts such a ridiculous discussion to bed because it should be quite obvious that I couldn't possibly be talking about everyone, it's a turn of phrase that has common usage and not many people genuinely think it applies to all. When I say 'people don't like argumentative housemates' I cannot possibly mean everyone because quite clearly some people do. The same would apply here and in other instances of the use of the word 'people'. I am not about to overthink every word I use in every sentence I ever construct just to be absolutely sure that already blindingly obvious meanings are evident to everyone that reads them, that should go without saying. Such incessant self analysis of semantics would be akin to those who go around saying 'in your opinion' implying people need to write 'IMO' at the end of everything they post on a forum just to be absolutely clear that, shock horror, their post is their bloody opinion. It all goes without saying, quite frankly. And now you've managed to involve me in a discussion of semantics after all so congratulations on that.

Funnily enough I was actually accused of racism on here once before, and on another occasion someone insinuated as much, so to make out I have no idea of the seriousness of such accusations when I've been on the receiving end of them is silly. The difference is in those instances there was no evidence to support the claims, they didn't even make out they had any evidence and they most certainly did not know anything about me. I, however, believe there is evidence to justify the claims I am making. It is not widespread and it does in no way apply to every member of this forum, nor every single viewer of this show, but it does exist.

I couldn't care less who wishes to respond to my posts, I'm merely pointing out that it can't have been that provocative if only one person kicked up a fuss over it (queue more people doing so now or something) and that as you've already said, there isn't much point in us continuing this discussion (or most other ones to be quite frank) as we aren't going to agree. Feel free to continue and I will respond, but it seems a bit bizarre to say that and then continue replying?

[Lostie!]

Originally Posted by Jack_

I shouldn't have to specify, if I say 'people' and you take that to mean every person that's ever existed ever then that's your problem I still stand by what I said, but I will change the wording now for you if it's so incredibly difficult to surmise what I most likely meant: some people don't like the thread title being pointed out because they either know it's true, or worse, are guilty of it themselves. Hopefully this puts such a ridiculous discussion to bed because it should be quite obvious that I couldn't possibly be talking about everyone, it's a turn of phrase that has common usage and not many people genuinely think it applies to all. When I say 'people don't like argumentative housemates' I cannot possibly mean everyone because quite clearly some people do. The same would apply here and in other instances of the use of the word 'people'. I am not about to overthink every word I use in every sentence I ever construct just to be absolutely sure that already blindingly obvious meanings are evident to everyone that reads them, that should go without saying. Such incessant self analysis of semantics would be akin to those who go around saying 'in your opinion' implying people need to write 'IMO' at the end of everything they post on a forum just to be absolutely clear that, shock horror, their post is their bloody opinion. It all goes without saying, quite frankly. And now you've managed to involve me in a discussion of semantics after all so congratulations on that.

This reminds me of the people who go around insulting people and then say "Well you chose to be insulted, not my fault". Of course you should have to specify if you insist on making such strong claims and accusations in such a broad, generalised manner. It's not even slightly comparable to the "in my opinion" example.

Originally Posted by Jack_

Funnily enough I was actually accused of racism on here once before, and on another occasion someone insinuated as much, so to make out I have no idea of the seriousness of such accusations when I've been on the receiving end of them is silly. The difference is in those instances there was no evidence to support the claims, they didn't even make out they had any evidence and they most certainly did not know anything about me. I, however, believe there is evidence to justify the claims I am making. It is not widespread and it does in no way apply to every member of this forum, nor every single viewer of this show, but it does exist.

Thanks for the clarification that I so unreasonably sought.

Originally Posted by Jack_

I couldn't care less who wishes to respond to my posts, I'm merely pointing out that it can't have been that provocative if only one person kicked up a fuss over it (queue more people doing so now or something) and that as you've already said, there isn't much point in us continuing this discussion (or most other ones to be quite frank) as we aren't going to agree. Feel free to continue and I will respond, but it seems a bit bizarre to say that and then continue replying?

I replied again because you decided to make an inaccurate assumption as to why I responded as strongly as I did even after I'd already stated why I feel so strongly on the issue. Since I actually have an iota of self respect I wanted to set you straight on that. Nothing bizarre about that. I stand by the fact that we have nothing more to say to each other on the issue of racism playing a significant role in BB results, but if you're going to misrepresent me I will gladly continue to respond and reaffirm the actual facts.

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Lostie!

This reminds me of the people who go around insulting people and then say "Well you chose to be insulted, not my fault". Of course you should have to specify if you insist on making such strong claims and accusations in such a broad, generalised manner. It's not even slightly comparable to the "in my opinion" example.

lmfao it's nothing of the sort. Again, if you choose to take 'people' to mean every person that's ever existed, that is your problem. I doubt any person that's ever used that word in a sentence has ever been referring to everyone, and I'm pretty damn sure most people understand that. All this is is petty semantics, and you know full well it is. It is completely akin to the 'IMO' example and actually if I remember correctly you may be one of the people who has pulled people up on that before so it's unsurprising you think they are unrelated. Anyway, I've given you my already obvious clarification so unless you need me to repeat it again why don't we end this completely pointless part of the discussion?

Originally Posted by Lostie!

Thanks for the clarification that I so unreasonably sought.

You are so very welcome is there anything else you need me to clarify? How about pointing out my original post in this thread was '...in my opinion'? Actually that's a good one, yeah. People may disagree but I posted it because it was my opinion. Can't really think of any other obvious things that need clarifying but please do make sure to point them out to me if you spot them!

Originally Posted by Lostie!

I replied again because you decided to make an inaccurate assumption as to why I responded as strongly as I did even after I'd already stated why I feel so strongly on the issue. Since I actually have an iota of self respect I wanted to set you straight on that. Nothing bizarre about that. I stand by the fact that we have nothing more to say to each other on the issue of racism playing a significant role in BB results, but if you're going to misrepresent me I will gladly continue to respond and reaffirm the actual facts.

Let me make this clear: I can totally understand why racism is an issue so close to your heart, and it goes without saying that I am sorry you have had to experience it, but to jump on a post that was so obviously not directed at every person ever in the manner than you did, as I have already explained above and in several other posts - was really quite unnecessary. I will end this post here for fear of recycling what I've already explained, but it is nothing more than semantics I'm afraid. It doesn't take a genius to work out that I couldn't possibly be talking about everyone that's ever posted on here or anyone that's ever watched the show, it's common sense.