[Northern Monkey]

A one sided propaganda story from a left wing remain UK rag quoting or paraphrasing from an EU rag

Using words like "disastrous" and "devastating"

Disastrous and devastating for the people who read the Indy and Guardian.Remainers who want either soft Brexit or no Brexit.

Talk about project fear.No wonder a section of remainers are all paranoid and anxiety filled reading stuff like that.

It basically told us absolutely nothing.It's straight up scaremongering.
It told us that the EU are going in with their starting position and so are we.It's in both sides interest to give and take and meet in the middle somewhere and both sides know this.It will be "devastating" or "disastrous" for the EU if we just tell them to feck off and leave.They want a good deal with us as much as we do.

[DemolitionRed]

This report was clearly leaked for a reason but its still a concern. Regardless of how we voted, we need to get to the bare bones of what’s going on.

What’s clear in May's general election campaign is, her promises are misguided and she’s a stubborn woman with little compromise. The claims she’s making in both her election campaign and Brexit are being heavily criticised by independent experts.

This is a PM who refuses debate with anyone who opposes her. At PM question time she’s seen to be contemptuous and show destain towards anyone who questions her and I think that’s a worry because it makes this report more believable.

Is the woman who isn’t willing to compromise the right person to take us forward with Brexit and is she being poorly briefed?

Lets try and look beyond "your side" "my side" squabbling because this sort of unhealthy competition just goes round in circles and gets us nowhere. We, regardless of where we sit with Brexit, want the best outcome possible and so questioning this report and questioning her capabilities is crucial, even if you are a Tory supporter.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

This report was clearly leaked for a reason but its still a concern. Regardless of how we voted, we need to get to the bare bones of what’s going on.

What’s clear in May's general election campaign is, her promises are misguided and she’s a stubborn woman with little compromise. The claims she’s making in both her election campaign and Brexit are being heavily criticised by independent experts.

This is a PM who refuses debate with anyone who opposes her. At PM question time she’s seen to be contemptuous and show destain towards anyone who questions her and I think that’s a worry because it makes this report more believable.

Is the woman who isn’t willing to compromise the right person to take us forward with Brexit and is she being poorly briefed?

Lets try and look beyond "your side" "my side" squabbling because this sort of unhealthy competition just goes round in circles and gets us nowhere. We, regardless of where we sit with Brexit, want the best outcome possible and so questioning this report and questioning her capabilities is crucial, even if you are a Tory supporter.

The thing is.....
Who would be a good leader to go into the Brexit negotiations?
Corbyn?
Farron?

As much as i don't like the Tories.Who else is there?
It needs to be someone strong and stable who can take a strong hand into the negotiations.Who can offer that from the three main parties?

Tbh i'd rather have farage go in there than any of them.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

The thing is.....
Who would be a good leader to go into the Brexit negotiations?
Corbyn?
Farron?

As much as i don't like the Tories.Who else is there?
It needs to be someone strong and stable who can take a strong hand into the negotiations.Who can offer that from the three main parties?

Tbh i'd rather have farage go in there than any of them.

Farage for me too. He is a great orator and not easily phased or intimidated. A confident and capable man.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Farage for me too. He is a great orator and not easily phased or intimidated. A confident and capable man.

he comes across as arrogant and not very diplomatic to me. He's not very likeable. Doesn't seem like a good choice for someone who's trying to arrange a deal with the EU, especially after the way he carried on after the result of the vote but it's nothing to do with me

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

he comes across as arrogant and not very diplomatic to me. He's not very likeable. Doesn't seem like a good choice for someone who's trying to arrange a deal with the EU, especially after the way he carried on after the result of the vote but it's nothing to do with me

Personally I like him. OK maybe not the man for this job, but I was referring more to his abilities to negotiate deals and his oratory skills rather than this particular deal. Shame though, I think he would be ideal in many ways.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Farage for me too. He is a great orator and not easily phased or intimidated. A confident and capable man.

But he's far right and far right policies may help you but they won't help businesses and industries

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

But he's far right and far right policies may help you but they won't help businesses and industries

Why do the left never refer to the right as right but always far right? Not an attempt to undermine I wonder.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

The thing is.....
Who would be a good leader to go into the Brexit negotiations?
Corbyn?
Farron?

As much as i don't like the Tories.Who else is there?
It needs to be someone strong and stable who can take a strong hand into the negotiations.Who can offer that from the three main parties?

Tbh i'd rather have farage go in there than any of them.

Someone who can admit when they get things wrong.

We need a more genuine politics and if that means standing up to the hard right of their own party as well as the tabloid media who’s experience has already taught us that they will never be satisfied with anything that compromises their own ideological fixations.

Instead of a general election, it would have been more honest for the government to admit that they had got things wrong and that they now want to work on and communicate a more realistic expectation to the public, as well as give business, organizations and individuals more warning of the need to prepare for what’s coming next.

The government is trying to sell us a plan that has already started to fall apart at the seams.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Someone who can admit when they get things wrong.

We need a more genuine politics and if that means standing up to the hard right of their own party as well as the tabloid media who’s experience has already taught us that they will never be satisfied with anything that compromises their own ideological fixations.

Instead of a general election, it would have been more honest for the government to admit that they had got things wrong and that they now want to work on and communicate a more realistic expectation to the public, as well as give business, organizations and individuals more warning of the need to prepare for what’s coming next.

The government is trying to sell us a plan that has already started to fall apart at the seams.

Neither should they give in to the hard left of their own party. It works both ways. Both extremes are equally distasteful.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Neither should they give in to the hard left of their own party. It works both ways. Both extremes are equally distasteful.

SCREAMS

Its not about giving in to the hard left, its about listening to different options, including options from their own party. Like I've already said, If the government had listened a little more and a little better, it might not be making the fundamental mistakes it has.

[user104658]

Farage mocks and is despised by European politicians - and Brexiteers think he's the man to handle the sensitive diplomacy of setting up trade deals with those same people. ****ing bizarre. But fairly typical of the "we are big and tough and have the upper hand tee hee silly little Europe!" attitude that in fests Brexit mentality, I guess.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Farage mocks and is despised by European politicians - and Brexiteers think he's the man to handle the sensitive diplomacy of setting up trade deals with those same people. ****ing bizarre. But fairly typical of the "we are big and tough and have the upper hand tee hee silly little Europe!" attitude that in fests Brexit mentality, I guess.

Well that's it really, if you do actually want to work with Europe and come to an agreement and get a good deal then 100% he's the wrong man for the job. If you want to go there and say "**** you Europe, you give us what ever we want or piss off, Rule Britannia" then I'm sure Farage would be perfect

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Well that's it really, if you do actually want to work with Europe and come to an agreement and get a good deal then 100% he's the wrong man for the job. If you want to go there and say "**** you Europe, you give us what ever we want or piss off, Rule Britannia" then I'm sure Farage would be perfect

I have to agree.
He is the last person we need to do any negotiating, you need respect on both sides, I am afraid where he is concerned there is no love lost, never mind any respect.

[Livia]

They're quoting from a German newspaper. Germany goes to the polls in the Autumn (after which Merkel is going to be looking for a new job, I reckon). They're hardly going to make it look like the UK will have an easy time. But then... we are an independent country, the people voted it so, so there's not much they can do. If they don't want to trade with us it will harm their imports and exports just as much as it'll hard ours. I predict lots of dummy-spitting in the months to come.

[Northern Monkey]

We need Farage to go in there with union jack boxers on and just pull his trousers down in front of Barnier and say 'chew on that ya bastards' and then walk out.That will set the tone for our starting position i feel.

[Livia]

LOL... Monkey, when I take over the country, I'm making you head of the Diplomatic Corps.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Livia

LOL... Monkey, when I take over the country, I'm making you head of the Diplomatic Corps.

I accept

[Northern Monkey]

This all comes down to semantics on where each side wants to begin negotiating really.
The EU wants to settle citizens rights(which the Cons do also) and this so called 'divorce bill' first wheras the government are saying "there's no deal until we agree the whole deal".
When they actually get down to negotiating then no doubt progress will be made.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

This all comes down to semantics on where each side wants to begin negotiating really.
The EU wants to settle citizens rights(which the Cons do also) and this so called 'divorce bill' first wheras the government are saying "there's no deal until we agree the whole deal".
When they actually get down to negotiating then no doubt progress will be made.

But can all this be done in such a short time? We've taken a year to get this far!

[DemolitionRed]

Brexit plans are plagued with problems but the fundamental issues are with the de-structure of the UK demands and EU’s understanding, specifically when it comes to timing of all these complexities. The EU’s clear and persistent position is that we first sort out the mechanics of withdrawal and then we will start preliminary discussions about the future.

[DemolitionRed]

We keep being told that we are "coming together" so why does it feel like we’ve never been so bitterly divided?

I'm on a rant and I'm also on my lunch break, so I'm off.

[Tom4784]

Also Farage would be the worst ****ing person to head up negotiations. He is an abrasive twat who washed his hands of Brexit as soon as the vote went his way so that he could find himself a permanent position in Donald Trump's arsehole. Nigel Farage is only interested in Nigel Farage and he only picks his causes based on how it'll benefit him. Getting involved in Brexit now won't benefit him which is why he went to the US as soon as he could to get in with Trump.

You need someone who is agreeable and is actually capable of diplomacy, we need a deal more than the EU needs one so we can't go into negotiations with the typical Leaver attitude of 'We don't need the EU. we don't need anyone! RULE BRITANNIA! COUNTRIES SHOULD BE LINING UP TO BEG US FOR DEALS!'

[jaxie]

I like the more classy way that the government has handled this situation by saying they won't get into a tittle tattle war. It shows just how petty the EU and Juncker particularly is. Best thing we will ever do, leaving the EU.

I like the PM's tone today too. "I am a bloody difficult woman."

[Kizzy]

Yeah name calling is really classy :/