[Alf]

Originally Posted by Withano

I'm asking why you argued against the point I made when you literally describe yourself, and your poitical values, in a way that would suggest my point is correct.

Well at the moment, the Tories are the only ones that are appealing to me, so I presumed I was one of these chavs? So I sarcastically called myself a chav, because that is what you labelled people like me.

I have no idea whether that answers your question or not, I've had a few beers, and this conversation is confusing me, I don't even know if we're talking on the same lines here.

[user104658]

The reason the Tories currently appeal to certain more chavvy characters these days, I'm convinced, is simply because of their perceived popularity. Like a self fulfilling prophecy. There are many who, basically, just "like to win". Like to be able to say they are on, or are supporting, the "winning side" regardless of who or what that happens to be. So they will identify the group that they feel certain will win, and throw their support behind that group, just so that they can say "yyaaassss we won you lost we won!" at the end of it all.

I believe in football terms they call these people "glory hunters". People who suddenly declare their undying support for whichever team happens to be at the top of the league that year.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The reason the Tories currently appeal to certain more chavvy characters these days, I'm convinced, is simply because of their perceived popularity. Like a self fulfilling prophecy. There are many who, basically, just "like to win". Like to be able to say they are on, or are supporting, the "winning side" regardless of who or what that happens to be. So they will identify the group that they feel certain will win, and throw their support behind that group, just so that they can say "yyaaassss we won you lost we won!" at the end of it all.

I believe in football terms they call these people "glory hunters". People who suddenly declare their undying support for whichever team happens to be at the top of the league that year.

Well I suppose if it makes the losers feel better ,lol, the Tories appeal to me at the moment as they are the only party with some realistic policies and people with a bit of nouse,all the others seem a bit brain dead, and their followers seem to get annoyed easily and then start name calling,knock yourselves out

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Well I suppose if it makes the losers feel better ,lol, the Tories appeal to me at the moment as they are the only party with some realistic policies and people with a bit of nouse,all the others seem a bit brain dead, and their followers seem to get annoyed easily and then start name calling,knock yourselves out

... She said, sounding annoyed and calling people "losers".

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

... She said, sounding annoyed and calling people "losers".

Well whats good for the goose is good for the gander,not nice is it?

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Well whats good for the goose is good for the gander,not nice is it?

I have no problem with people "being insulting" actually. However, I don't like hypocrites. Whining about people name calling whilst name calling, for example.

[jaxie]

Once again lots of labelling and stereotyping going on most particularly from those who try to claim the moral high ground of the left. Do people even realize how much they are doing this? Or that using derogatory terms like chav is just as bad as using derogatory racist or sexist terms?

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Once again lots of labelling and stereotyping going on most particularly from those who try to claim the moral high ground of the left. Do people even realize how much they are doing this? Or that using derogatory terms like chav is just as bad as using derogatory racist or sexist terms?

[RichardG]

I didn't realise people still used the word chav

Very 2010

[Withano]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Or that using derogatory terms like chav is just as bad as using derogatory racist or sexist terms?

Since when was chav a derogatory term at all. Why are you putting it on the same level as racism and sexism. Completely inappropriate.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Withano

Since when was chav a derogatory term at all. Why are you putting it on the same level as racism and sexism. Completely inappropriate.

I had a post deleted because I said someone looked like a redneck. I'd say chav was just as insulting... more so in fact.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Livia

I had a post deleted because I said someone looked like a redneck. I'd say chav was just as insulting... more so in fact.

Seems like you were getting personal.. 'looks like a chav' probably would be a similar level I agree, but I'd never get that personal, no need for it. Both groups exist, stating it so isn't the problem.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Withano

Seems like you were getting personal.. 'looks like a chav' probably would be a similar level I agree, but I'd never get that personal, no need for it. Both groups exist, stating it so isn't the problem.

I was referring to a housemate in Big Brother.

For an intelligent person, you do talk some rubbish sometimes, Withano, you really do.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Withano

Since when was chav a derogatory term at all. Why are you putting it on the same level as racism and sexism. Completely inappropriate.

Oh I see it's only a problem if you aren't saying it.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Oh I see it's only a problem if you aren't saying it.

Its never been a problem (in my eyes) for reasons I've explained throughout the thread
comparing a word that describes a British sub-culture, to words that describe actual hatred towards entire sexes, genders, races, and ethnicities is bizarre, and completely inappropriate.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Once again lots of labelling and stereotyping going on most particularly from those who try to claim the moral high ground of the left. Do people even realize how much they are doing this? Or that using derogatory terms like chav is just as bad as using derogatory racist or sexist terms?

It isn't as bad, using a modern slang term is not as bad as being racist or sexist, maybe those on the left are just more aware of this differential?

Personally I don't think that there is any such thing as a 'chav' it's another made up term to describe a those who fall into a certain socio economic group. There are terms used as a collective term for many groups, 'PC' 'snowflakes' or 'SJWs'

If you have used a collective term yourself it's hard not to suggest you're being hypocritical to finger wag when others do it.

[JTM45]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Once again lots of labelling and stereotyping going on most particularly from those who try to claim the moral high ground of the left.

Oh........The Irony of it!!!!!

[Withano]

Why am I still explain half a sentence from one post 38 posts later lol

Clarification
I dont think all tory voters are chavs and/or wealthy
I dont think all wealthy are tory voters
I dont think all chavs are tory voters
I think chavs and wealthy people are two populations that the tories appeal to in general
I dont think they had the same fanbase two years ago
I think that this is one of the reasons that tory will win, they are expanding in to new groups, whilst their competition is not
I also dont think chav is a derogatory term, there was a mixup about that too
I also take issue with people proposing its on a similar level to racism and sexism

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Withano

Why am I still explain half a sentence from one post 38 posts later lol

Because it's TiBB and people will decide that your posts mean what they want them to mean, so that they can agenda-whine in response (whilst pretending to be amused but oozing passive aggression). Pretty standard, really.

[smudgie]

So basically the Tories are finding popualrity amongst more people, from all walks of life.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by smudgie

So basically the Tories are finding popualrity amongst more people, from all walks of life.

This is the basic summary of my theory! I should have probably worded it like this instead somebody else mentioned the Brexit vote which I also think is a good theory.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by smudgie

So basically the Tories are finding popualrity amongst more people, from all walks of life.

I wouldn't say popularity and I also feel a great many who may end up giving this lot a much bigger majority,will be deeply regretting it soon afterwards.

Often votes are given very begrudgingly and many votes for Labour will be too.
I know many more votes would go to Labour,if Corbyn was not leader.

Once austerity is continued,once even more hardline testing and moving the goalposts as to the sick and disabled rightful claims.
Not to mention more confrontational acts as to the NHS.

Once a much less probably compromising dealing with the Brexit issue comes into play.
I won't add here things like foxhunting.Kazanne and I have long United together detested the very idea of that legal again.

So I see a good many voters in a year or so,full of likely regret after putting that cross for the Conservatives.
Sadly with an increased majority,the bad effect of the things this deceitful PM will then do, will be firmly in place and a great many in great stress and suffering from said legislation.

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I wouldn't say popularity and I also feel a great many who may end up giving this lot a much bigger majority,will be deeply regretting it soon afterwards.

Often votes are given very begrudgingly and many votes for Labour will be too.
I know many more votes would go to Labour,if Corbyn was not leader.

Once austerity is continued,once even more hardline testing and moving the goalposts as to the sick and disabled rightful claims.
Not to mention more confrontational acts as to the NHS.

Once a much less probably compromising dealing with the Brexit issue comes into play.
I won't add here things like foxhunting.Kazanne and I have long United together detested the very idea of that legal again.

So I see a good many voters in a year or so,full of likely regret after putting that cross for the Conservatives.
Sadly with an increased majority,the bad effect of the things this deceitful PM will then do, will be firmly in place and a great many in great stress and suffering from said legislation.

I definitely have to agree with your point about Mr.Corbyn, for all he does attract more members to the party he at the same time loses votes from a lot of what would normally be labour voters.
Had they changed the leadership then I reckon labour would be doing much better in this election.

[Denver]

Corbyn doesn't care about his party and supporters and because of that he has played into the Conservative hands

[Kizzy]

Oh it's been known for years, it began with the bish bosh 'Essex man' and snowballed from there.

'The Oxford English Dictionary (OED) lists the earliest reference to the Essex man as one from 7 October 1990 in The Sunday Telegraph, although a reference to 26 January 1990 issue of Campaign: "Representative [David Amess] of new Essex man, working-class, father electrician, right-wing, keen hanger, noisily rambunctious, no subtlety".'


neo liberal 'chav'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essex_man