[DemolitionRed]

Who really goes to food banks? This is an informative read.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Who really goes to food banks? This is an informative read.

Ill health is a very common feature. Almost two-thirds of users had a health condition, half of households using food banks included someone with a disability and a third had mental health problems.

This does not surprise me one bit. Obviously nothing at all to do with ATOS and their ilk repeatedly removing PIP/DLA (which is for both employed and unemployed disabled people) from so many people

Which yes, has been going on a long time as I believe it was Labour that originally contracted them. But they have got progressively worse with time ( I assume the bonuses they receive for saying people are fine went up or something), and fairly recently the government changed the goalposts even more so to speak, meaning that whilst people still have the same disability/symptoms they always did, it has simply been decided that they are not as ill anymore...which is causing the long term disabled a hell of a lot of stress and creating even more (usually successful) tribunals against obviously wrong decisions.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

https://fullfact.org/economy/how-man...ing-foodbanks/

Your link begins: In brief
Claim
Nurses have been using food banks.
Conclusion
Media reports show that at least some individual nurses and trainees have visited food banks. We don’t have solid evidence of the scale of use.

No solid evidence which is what I said.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Your link begins: In brief
Claim
Nurses have been using food banks.
Conclusion
Media reports show that at least some individual nurses and trainees have visited food banks. We don’t have solid evidence of the scale of use.

No solid evidence which is what I said.

You said you were dubious about nurses having to use them as you have only ever seen one sensationalized press claim of one nurse having to and said there was nothing otherwise to support this. There is other stuff to support this, was my point...coming from The Royal College of Nursing rather than just random press articles?

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Your link begins: In brief
Claim
Nurses have been using food banks.
Conclusion
Media reports show that at least some individual nurses and trainees have visited food banks. We don’t have solid evidence of the scale of use.

No solid evidence which is what I said.

Here is the evidence...

A registered nurse in a London hospital will, on average, earn around Ł28,000 per year.
After tax and NI the take home pay is going to be around Ł22,000

If she/he is single and renting a one bed flat, the average rent will be between Ł1,000 and Ł1,500 pcm or Ł12,000 and Ł18,000 per year.

Then there are contract fees, rates, utility bills, travel expenses, clothing, sundries and food and she/he has to pay for all of that with the tiny amount of money left.

Single hospital professionals, at least in London, are known to use food banks.

Edited to add. I forgot to add student loan. From this year onwards a nursing student isn't eligible for a bursary and will now have to pay back a student loan. I just looked it up and a two-year course is Ł20k and that doesn't include living costs. A newly qualified nurse is going to have an average debt of Ł40k

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Here is the evidence...

A registered nurse in a London hospital will, on average, earn around Ł28,000 per year.
After tax and NI the take home pay is going to be around Ł22,000

If she/he is single and renting a one bed flat, the average rent will be between Ł1,000 and Ł1,500 pcm or Ł12,000 and Ł18,000 per year.

Then there are contract fees, rates, utility bills, travel expenses, clothing, sundries and food and she/he has to pay for all of that with the tiny amount of money left.

Single hospital professionals, at least in London, are known to use food banks.

Lots of ordinary people have to live on similar sums, with the same life costs and don't necessarily use food banks. I'm not suggesting nurses don't deserve a pay rise but 22 k a year is hardly a destitute salary. Also you'd get a 3 bedroom house on the outskirts of London for 1000 k a month. There is one not far from where I live for that price. A one bedroom flat would be a lot less.

And again you aren't giving any real evidence that nurses en masse have to use food banks.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

You said you were dubious about nurses having to use them as you have only ever seen one sensationalized press claim of one nurse having to and said there was nothing otherwise to support this. There is other stuff to support this, was my point...coming from The Royal College of Nursing rather than just random press articles?

It's still only hearsay, no actual evidence is presented. I could say Vicky told me the sky is green.

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

The growing dependency on food banks should never be presented as a good thing. It's a failure of the state that food banks are becoming a necessity for a lot of people.

Or an excuse for some

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Just seen this...whilst of course, there are bad apples in any bunch and to deny some people spend wages/benefits on loads of unneeded stuff whilst claiming poverty would be ridiculous, people like this would be highly unlikely to get a referral. And a referral is needed, you can't just walk in and demand a food parcel.

We once had to use a foodbank, a few years back when I became ill and there was a 3 month delay in processing my ESA claim.

We had to give bank statements and such, to prove we had not just had income and spent it irresponsibly. We had to prove that cash we had got in the weeks prior had not been spent on stuff like drink. As I recall, we actually had a bit of a problem as we were on key/card gas and electric and there was 50 quid 'unaccounted for' and of course we did not have a receipt for the gas/electric we had topped up, as...why keep receipts once the credit is on? Local shop redid them for us as I live in a relatively small village and they knew us and remembered us topping up. But I am fairly sure we would not have got the referral had we not been able to provide that receipt

Yet a nurse in full time employment can get it....something dont add up.

[Beso]

Dont doctors and nurses get discounted, if not free food at the hospitals they work at?

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by jaxie

Lots of ordinary people have to live on similar sums, with the same life costs and don't necessarily use food banks. I'm not suggesting nurses don't deserve a pay rise but 22 k a year is hardly a destitute salary. Also you'd get a 3 bedroom house on the outskirts of London for 1000 k a month. There is one not far from where I live for that price. A one bedroom flat would be a lot less.

And again you aren't giving any real evidence that nurses en masse have to use food banks.

What outskirts of London?
If you have to catch a daily commuter train (and not a bus) its going to be very expensive if you're not subsidized for that train.

22k a year in London is definitely a bottom end salary if you are living on your own. I know I couldn't survive on it or maybe I could but I'd be scraping the bone.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Who really goes to food banks? This is an informative read.

does it state what they spend the money they do get on?

[Crimson Dynamo]

Claim

Nurses have been using food banks.


Conclusion

Media reports show that at least some individual nurses and trainees have visited food banks. We don’t have solid evidence of the scale of use


https://fullfact.org/economy/how-man...ing-foodbanks/

Or what the individual nurses spent their money they had on!

[user104658]

Claim
Poverty doesn't exist and isn't a problem, it's just lazy freeloaders.

Conclusion

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Claim
Poverty doesn't exist and isn't a problem, it's just lazy freeloaders.

Conclusion

Some people are good at 'Self blame strengthening'. Personally, I blame the government and their right wing allies for this fairly common working class attitude towards anyone less fortunate than themselves. Some people are just subservient to their masters.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Claim
Poverty doesn't exist and isn't a problem, it's just lazy freeloaders.

Conclusion

exaggerating a point till it bleeds and then reacting to your own exaggeration is hardly worthy of "serious debate"

this isnt twitter

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Some people are good at 'Self blame strengthening'. Personally, I blame the government and their right wing allies for this fairly common working class attitude towards anyone less fortunate than themselves. Some people are just subservient to their masters.

I love when you make a point and then go on to ironically confirm it

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

I love when you make a point and then go on to ironically confirm it

And I love it when you make sarcastic mediocre comments because it displays your thinking.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

And I love it when you make sarcastic mediocre comments because it displays your thinking.

yes it does when I reply to one of yours

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Some people are good at 'Self blame strengthening'. Personally, I blame the government and their right wing allies for this fairly common working class attitude towards anyone less fortunate than themselves. Some people are just subservient to their masters.

Only a 'working class attitude' - really! You appear to suggest that you would class yourself as at least 'middle class' and do not appear to have a very positive attitude towards those you consider 'working class'. And you accuse the Tories!!!

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Only a 'working class attitude' - really! You appear to suggest that you would class yourself as at least 'middle class' and do not appear to have a very positive attitude towards those you consider 'working class'. And you accuse the Tories!!!

Now now are you attempting to put words in mouths?...tsk

[Kizzy]

I think that the attitudinal shift has come from the establishment, a few yrs ago would working people and families using foodbanks be so acceptable generally?
Personally I doubt it and it all plays into the 'austerity' myth that it is ok for people to lie in want because 'austerity' especially when you hear statements like this..
“I don’t think the state can do everything,” he said. “It tries to provide a base of welfare that should allow people to make ends meet during the course of the week, but on some occasions that will not work. And to have charitable support given by people voluntarily to support their fellow citizens, I think is rather uplifting and shows what a good, compassionate country we are.”

If it were only people on welfare using food banks it would be bad enough and yet it isn't, and the govt are not acknowledging this they are effectively saying that they will not aid those who can not aid themselves.
As we are a 'civilised society' the onus falls on us to help... there is no question of calling for landlords to reduce exorbitant rents, the energy cabal of capping prices of paying a decent living wage, of reducing VAT....nothing that would actually help and not in the way of what many see as 'handouts'.

I 100% agree with the churches position that he is unChristian, as he has seemingly stated that there is nothing that the establishment can or will do for those in need and if their communities cannot help then they are to starve.
How else can his statement be interpreted?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ther-uplifting

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Claim
Poverty doesn't exist and isn't a problem, it's just lazy freeloaders.

Conclusion

I didn't say any of that. Why is it that you feel it necessary to misrepresent people by projecting some bull you are making up onto them?

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Some people are good at 'Self blame strengthening'. Personally, I blame the government and their right wing allies for this fairly common working class attitude towards anyone less fortunate than themselves. Some people are just subservient to their masters.

Are you not one of the peons who work for a living then? What a horrible patronising attitude to the working class. What brought this scathing ridicule on? Someone said they don't think 22k a year is a poverty line salary.

Why is it necessary to attack or make nasty remarks about those with a different view?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

I didn't say any of that. Why is it that you feel it necessary to misrepresent people by projecting some bull you are making up onto them?

Who said you did?... Nobody that I can see :/