[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

mocking the gossip tabloids now are we, they are just providing us with news, without the tabloids we would know nothing

please stop

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Personal responsibility in that she had been asked to make an application and she didn't despite 3 years of consultation

I never claimed the private sector could do it any better, but this Department is run by the public sector

Like any department they are run to 'targets' they'll have a quota to get rid off.. cherry picking the old and vulnerable will be easy pickings.

And so to it would be easy for the department to trace this woman via, health, tax, welfare, council records, schools, they just choose not to, or rather they are tasked with so many decisions to be made per day they don't have the time to aid her.
She is just 1 of 100 decisions made a day...

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ay-home-office

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Like any department they are run to 'targets' they'll have a quota to get rid off.. cherry picking the old and vulnerable will be easy pickings.

And so to it would be easy for the department to trace this woman via, health, tax, welfare, council records, schools, they just choose not to, or rather they are tasked with so many decisions to be made per day they don't have the time to aid her.
She is just 1 of 100 decisions made a day...

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ay-home-office

They wasted 3 years in consultation,this started long before Brexit, that doesn't sound like they were railroading her out of the country, she would still be entitled to a full pension even if she was in Jamaica given she has paid over 35 years of NI , it's basically comes down to someone not applying common sense

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Cherie

They wasted 3 years in consultation,this started long before Brexit, that doesn't sound like they were railroading her out of the country, she would still be entitled to a full pension even if she was in Jamaica given she has paid over 35 years of NI , it's basically comes down to someone not applying common sense

It states she stuck her head in the sand about it, that said even when she did ask for help and advice what good was it?
Far from accessing paper trails, data or records she was sent to a detention centre... :/ How?

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Christmas treeza

It states she stuck her head in the sand about it, that said even when she did ask for help and advice what good was it?
Far from accessing paper trails, data or records she was sent to a detention centre... :/ How?

Which brings us neatly back to she didn't fill in the ridiculous paperwork needed, and the jobsworth looking after her case for 3 years didn't care enough to do anything about it apart from agree that computer says no, and waste taxpayer money getting her detained

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Isaiah 7:14

they still manage to get the lottery on tho I bet

Do you have to fill in an application form to buy a lottery ticket

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Candy Cane

Which brings us neatly back to she didn't fill in the ridiculous paperwork needed, and the jobsworth looking after her case for 3 years didn't care enough to do anything about it apart from agree that computer says no, and waste taxpayer money getting her detained

And this guy... and all the people he knows that it's happening to?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...ears-in-the-uk

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Christmas treeza

And this guy... and all the people he knows that it's happening to?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...ears-in-the-uk

now you are moving the goalposts as we were discussing the OP?

if you want a discussion about the new guy "threatened" with removal, then please say so after you have finished with what we were previously discussing.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Candy Cane

now you are moving the goalposts as we were discussing the OP?

if you want a discussion about the new guy "threatened" with removal, then please say so after you have finished with what we were previously discussing.

It's exactly the same issue, sorry if it throws your theory of the lady just being a bit dumb or it being an administrative error out the window.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Christmas treeza

It's exactly the same issue, sorry if it throws your theory of the lady just being a bit dumb or it being an administrative error out the window.

on the contrary it totally reinforces my point that admin are completely incompetent, have either of these people been forced to leave the country..err...no ..what does that tell you, that people in post are incompetent and are far from being passionate about their jobs as you claim, and on top of that are not bothered in the least about wasting public money. :/

and I never once claimed admin ERROR! Or that the lady was dumb!

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Candy Cane

on the contrary it totally reinforces my point that admin are completely incompetent, have either of these people been forced to leave the country..err...no ..what does that tell you, that people in post are incompetent and are far from being passionate about their jobs as you claim, and on top of that are not bothered in the least about wasting public money. :/

and I never once claimed admin ERROR!

No it really doesn't it reinforces my theory that this is nothing but an exercise to remove 'undesirables' regardless of how long they have been resident in this country.

I don't believe that there is any incompetence, in actuality they are doing their job perfectly, I'm certain that this action is their brief.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Christmas treeza

No it really doesn't it reinforces my theory that this is nothing but an exercise to remove 'undesirables' regardless of how long they have been resident in this country.

I don't believe that there is any incompetence, in actuality they are doing their job perfectly, I'm certain that this action is their brief.

They are doing their job perfectly? Neither of these two should have been in the system in the first place. All that time wasted and where are they ....here! If that is your idea of a job done perfectly I really do give up !!! And if as you say they are being briefed to get people out of the country who can legally be here and can't be removed and even if they were removed would still be entitled to benefits/pensions it beggars belief and really stretches the imagination

And finally why are either of these people undesirable in you opinion

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Candy Cane

They are doing their job perfectly? Neither of these two should have been in the system in the first place. All that time wasted and where are they ....here! If that is your idea of a job done perfectly I really do give up !!! And if as you say they are being briefed to get people out of the country who can legally be here and can't be removed and even if they were removed would still be entitled to benefits/pensions it beggars belief and really stretches the imagination

And finally why are either of these people undesirable in you opinion

As I said they are easy pickings for the 100 a day target.

I'm not asking you to agree with me but that's how I see this issue with these cases of people from commonwealth countries who entered as kids and can't prove they were here prior to the 70s having little or no paperwork as evidence.

I don't see why it's so much of a stretch when you've heard of people sitting work capability assessments, being found fit for work and dying the same week!
I've specified who the undesirables are earlier in the thread candy, keep up.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Not at all, I raised my kids to be independent and take responsibility for their own actions but I also raised them with the understanding that empathy and kindness costs nothing.

One in five adults in the UK can't read or write. One in twenty adults in the UK can only read and write up to a 5 year olds standard. Most adults who can't read or write live in shame and rarely ask for help.

We don't know if she had reading or writing problems. Perhaps she did just ignore the letters; perhaps she was more than capable of reading those letters or filling in those application forms but didn't bother. We don't know but because we don't know, we shouldn't presume that she and others just 'can't be bothered'.

How many of those 1in 5 came here and didn’t bother to learn the language of the country they chose to live in. If you can’t speak it you can’t read it either. That is on those people not the country.

[Tom4784]

It's quite ridiculous considering that her family brought her to the UK as a result of an immigration drive. To send someone back to a country they do not know is cruel and nonsensical when they've lived in and contributed to the UK for fifty years.

It reminds me of the struggle the Dreamers in the US are going through, to go after people who were essentially raised in a country and for all intents and purpose ARE British/American is a malicious way of trying to achieve targets.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

How many of those 1in 5 came here and didn’t bother to learn the language of the country they chose to live in. If you can’t speak it you can’t read it either. That is on those people not the country.

Not 1 in 5 immigrants, 1 in 5 of all citizenship in the UK. Does your lack of empathy extend to them too or is it just the immigrants you are spewing hate at?

[bots]

Anomalies do happen in a country of millions of people. The question surely is whether its a common event, and I would expect the answer to be no. Therefore, the immigration department should do the right thing and grant this person legal right to stay. It's an exceptional circumstance and should be treated as such. It really doesn't even warrant a news story to be honest.

On the subject of whether she was remise in completing her documentation, there are a hundred potential reasons for it, all valid, and to suggest she is to blame is yet another form of victim blaming.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Christmas treeza

As I said they are easy pickings for the 100 a day target.

I'm not asking you to agree with me but that's how I see this issue with these cases of people from commonwealth countries who entered as kids and can't prove they were here prior to the 70s having little or no paperwork as evidence.

I don't see why it's so much of a stretch when you've heard of people sitting work capability assessments, being found fit for work and dying the same week!
I've specified who the undesirables are earlier in the thread candy, keep up.

The 100 day target in your link referred to EU citizens unless Jamaica has moved

and this pair don't seem to fall into what your opinion of being an undesirable is, so hence I asked the question Teresa

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Christmas treeza

And this guy... and all the people he knows that it's happening to?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...ears-in-the-uk

Bryan’s situation is compounded by the fact that he has struggled with reading all his life, and has avoided form-filling. “It’s a stigma. It’s hard to tell people that you need help,” he said. As a result, he has very few documents. He has avoided registering with a GP for that reason, and never opened a bank account, initially receiving his wage packet in cash (with tax deductions already made) and latterly having money paid into his partner’s account.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

How many of those 1in 5 came here and didn’t bother to learn the language of the country they chose to live in. If you can’t speak it you can’t read it either. That is on those people not the country.

Well these two obviously speak English! Jamaicans generally speak 'Jamaican English'

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Bryan’s situation is compounded by the fact that he has struggled with reading all his life, and has avoided form-filling. “It’s a stigma. It’s hard to tell people that you need help,” he said. As a result, he has very few documents. He has avoided registering with a GP for that reason, and never opened a bank account, initially receiving his wage packet in cash (with tax deductions already made) and latterly having money paid into his partner’s account.

He trusts his partner enough to pay his wages into his/her account but won't ask them for help with filling out an important form?

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Anomalies do happen in a country of millions of people. The question surely is whether its a common event, and I would expect the answer to be no. Therefore, the immigration department should do the right thing and grant this person legal right to stay. It's an exceptional circumstance and should be treated as such. It really doesn't even warrant a news story to be honest.

On the subject of whether she was remise in completing her documentation, there are a hundred potential reasons for it, all valid, and to suggest she is to blame is yet another form of victim blaming.

I don't think it is victim blaming, we have a Spanish bank account and every now and again we get a letter that is beyond our pidgeon Spanish abilities so we get it read by a Spanish speaker in case they want to freeze our account which they do for non nationals on a regular basis if you don't supply regular ID checks, its down to us to get it sorted and not to ignore it and yes it is ridiculous considering we only pay the bare minimum into the account every year but it's the law of the land so we have to get on with it

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Not 1 in 5 immigrants, 1 in 5 of all citizenship in the UK. Does your lack of empathy extend to them too or is it just the immigrants you are spewing hate at?

I am talking of 1 in 5 of all that live here. Likelihood is that a fair number of those that can’t read are those that came here but didn’t bother to integrate and learn the language/read. You call it hate I call it pointing out the facts.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Candy Cane

I don't think it is victim blaming, we have a Spanish bank account and every now and again we get a letter that is beyond our pidgeon Spanish abilities so we get it read by a Spanish speaker in case they want to freeze our account which they do for non nationals on a regular basis if you don't supply regular ID checks, its down to us to get it sorted and not to ignore it and yes it is ridiculous considering we only pay the bare minimum into the account every year but it's the law of the land so we have to get on with it

Personal accountability. If staying in the country was inportant enough to her you would have thought she would have found the time to make sure she completed the necessary paperwork. She did have 50 years to do so.

If I were emigrating to Australia for instance I would make sure I had dotted every i and crossed every t to ensure no one could kick me out.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

If I were emigrating to Australia for instance I would make sure I had dotted every i and crossed every t to ensure no one could kick me out.

50 years after you had moved there, really? I don't think anyone would after that length of time

One needs to remember the status 50 years ago, which I actually do. People were welcomed with open arms, got jobs, did great work, contributed to our economy. To then move the goalposts on what and what is not correct in terms of documentation 40+ years later is beyond the majority of peoples comprehension.