[Maru]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

I think it's excellent kids are getting more politically aware. After all politics today will decide their future tomorrow. They have the most to gain or lose.
Besides, people tend to be more open to new ideas when young and have less patience with bs. Pity this awakening didn't come early enough for the Brexit vote. Instead, OAPs decided on something they won't be around for to "enjoy".

I'd argue kids have to do a little bit more living&soul searching before forming constructive opinions on everything from family law to real estate taxes. The finer details.

The drawback of this engagement is it's very easy to get into stress/anxiety cycles with social media being in their faces all the time. Which sometimes leads to internet addiction and other anxiety disorders, as they're being told that everything they do, think breath matters and they must act now, pay attention and make their voices heard (insert other ominous platitudes)... and this "action" is usually simply feeling angry and resentful constantly. Not even getting up and doing anything about it usually, just being angry and allowing it to dominate all their personal life decisions and clearly it effects their emotional state in a negative way, given the state of 24hr news cycle(s).

It is also terrible their physical health if they spend hours in a fixed position so stressed. It can lead to chronic adrenaline (think anxiety), which wear the body down over time. Some people also connect the constant stress with feeling attacked, "Oh I feel so stressed... the threat must be real"... and that can become hard-wired if not curtailed, to respond to stress in unhealthy ways rather than spend the time learning to cope with it. Technology already has a huge impact on how our brains and emotions become wired when developing, so adding politics to this I think is more toxic. I think it's OK to allow children to be a little bit involved, like talking with them and helping them to learn to think critically and interpret the information for themselves, but maybe not so much that they become a statistic.

Have Smartphones Destroyed a Generation?
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...ration/534198/

[Twosugars]

I think you paint a somewhat exaggerated picture of that engagement.
I don't know about US, but here not many grownups study family law or real estate taxes before voting. We don't have endless referendums like US has with their state elections.
And re. social media, well, I think that ship has sailed already. Kids spend loads of time on that anyway, they may just as well do something productive with it from time to time.
Also, how young are we talking about? You said kids, I repeated kids. I had 16+ in mind. Here this is the age of consent to sex, they can drive at 17. At the moment they can vote at 18 (some argue it should be lowered to 16).
The days of idealized childhood from the 50s are over. Young people encounter things like environmental issues, immigration etc from an early age.
Besides if we waited for people to be fully mature (emotional maturity) then according to psychologists we'd have to wait until 25.

[Maru]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

I think you paint a somewhat exaggerated picture of that engagement.
I don't know about US, but here not many grownups study family law or real estate taxes before voting. We don't have endless referendums like US has with their state elections.
And re. social media, well, I think that ship has sailed already. Kids spend loads of time on that anyway, they may just as well do something productive with it from time to time.
Also, how young are we talking about? You said kids, I repeated kids. I had 16+ in mind. Here this is the age of consent to sex, they can drive at 17. At the moment they can vote at 18 (some argue it should be lowered to 16).
The days of idealized childhood from the 50s are over. Young people encounter things like environmental issues, immigration etc from an early age.
Besides if we waited for people to be fully mature (emotional maturity) then according to psychologists we'd have to wait until 25.

It's probably different in the US given we are so highly dependent on our cars. Public transportation is not widespread unless you're in the city and even then it is limited in comparison to other locales. Also our homes tend to be higher in size, things like consumer elections are cheaper, so it's very easy to give a child a device, tell them to entertain themselves and they can spend days in a room in the summer wrapped up in devices... our kids are quite addicted to consumer electronics and media here and is generally cheaper than outdoor entertainment.

I linked the Atlantic article for this because it cites various statistics, such as kids here passing up on usual rights such as getting a car, having sex, having an active social life, spikes in mental health and depression rates, etc... We're just starting to understand the role tech plays in mental health, but when talking about too young for politics, I am mainly talking about folk <16... near voting age is I think it is good to start paying attention since high school is when we start getting a deeper understanding of civics related materials.

It's interesting you mention voting age though... in the 2016 election, they were so sure the youth vote would come out. I've noticed that being politically engaged doesn't always translate to voting numbers. The youth vote (and the # of ppl voting in general) were much lower than people had hoped. So they did not show for Hillary as was claimed to happen. That's always been a problem. Primary voting numbers are an even bigger dumpster fire, forgetting just the youth vote.

That's why I don't think that engagement translates to votes. So I tend to think the "movement" as the kind of mover and shaker is a bit of a joke. It's largely down to a niche group of folk who spend an inordinate amount of time being stressed about things they can't control, rather than being politically "active"... and a large amount of that emotional energy is spent online tweeting into the ether. Now, that's not to say that's true across the board... I knew some people who were highly well-read, studied intensively in their younger years, would attend debates, seminars and were well-ranged in a diverse set of topics... and they were bound to go to great schools and grab great scholarships. But that is extraordinarily rare and is the outlier.

[Ammi]

...I don’t know how ‘patriotic’ I am...With a nooooo, you really have me thinking and overthinking with this, you sneaky person...’patriotism’ is a difficult one, I think...and not really comparable to RoI and ‘pride’ felt there...because historically, Ireland was the ‘suppressed’, the ‘underdog’ type thing....That’s not something that applies with England and ‘being British’...the huge immigration from Ireland to America and the ‘golden land’ opportunities would hold a huge ‘affection’ with Ireland and America...which is also felt, I think...by some, obviously...because there was fleeing from hunger../..poverty etc and to a better life...which is so entwined with British rule and British ownership...so ‘black and white’ of countries and their patriotism can’t really apply equally...I’m also though of the mindset of...’how long do the ‘sins’ of our fore-fathers apply......so yeah, there lies the rub as well...


..I have huge respect for those who have given their lives ....for everything we are today, everything we have with all of our choices and freedoms...without all of the ‘bad stuff’ as well, we just wouldn’t be...like a ‘sliding door’ thing, Britain only ‘is’ because of it all, good, bad and ugly etc...I have huge respect for British sovereignty .....because they devote their whole lives to their country, so to us all...and yeah, they may have quite ‘priveledged’ lives as it were as ‘their payment’...but I’d rather have the freedoms I have as an individual as oppose to ‘a crystal cage’ lifestyle...when we all think about ‘the meaning of life’, type stuff...the Royal meaning is pre-mapped from birth to death...for most Royals anyway....


...I don’t know if I’m ‘patriotic’ but I’m grateful and thankful for everything my life brings...my parents, my children etc...and all those who I’m close to and hold dear, I’m very fortunate and I’m very blessed...nothing would be quite exactly the same if any ‘sliding door’ had not been identical...but then, for those who have suffered through colonisation etc, through ‘British Rule’ ...pride and patriotism doesn’t quite sit snugly either..’I am because other people’s lives were not and were awful’ .but I’m not ‘ashamed’ though in any way because those are things beyond my control or choice...

...it’s interesting though, how Britain is seen with other countries..(...I think something Kizzy touched on...)...with sporting events and such the like...I’ve sometimes heard things like ‘anyone but England’ for the win..that type of thing...which, yeah is quite deflating and sad...we’re a relatively tiny country but not very often seen as the ‘underdog’ in sporting events, so maybe it’s a ‘rooting for the underdog’ thing as well...of Ireland, Scotland, Wales....with Eurovision, it’s hard to feel ‘pride’ and root for the UK, when our songs aren’t up to par in comparison to others......

[waterhog]

is this patriotic enough - every day starts with god save the queen - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4zP0BGWNzI

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

I'm not either, but I've just been wondering for the last ten minutes if the word has just been hijacked by nationalists and has just became a dirty word by association? And maybe thats why I think that I'm not.. hmm

Patriotism is only a dirty word to people who want to force a country to adapt to their ways and abandon it’s own values. If they don’t like the freedoms and protections provided in that country quite frankly they can bugger off and see whether the grass is really greener elsewhere. They probably need their country more than it needs them anyway.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Patriotism is only a dirty word to people who want to force a country to adapt to their ways and abandon it’s own values.

I disagree, I would say one of Britains greatest values is multiculturalism and acceptance, yet those who most regularly use the word (like edl, britain first etc) want the opposite of this quite often. They clearly dont see it as a dirty word, and they clearly do want to abandon some of Britains values.

Good theory, but its not working for me.

[Kizzy]

Recently I don't believe the rights and protections as well as the public services and infrastructure that were the envy of the world are being sufficiently protected, that has impacted also on me. I really would like to see a tidal wave of feeling from the public on social issues and employment rights that would restore my faith in the English.

In the main it is the govt that I feel are working against what it means to be British and that is what is impacting on my feeling towards my country.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

I disagree, I would say one of Britains greatest values is multiculturalism and acceptance, yet those who most regularly use the word (like edl, britain first etc) want the opposite of this quite often. They clearly dont see it as a dirty word, and they clearly do want to abandon some of Britains values.

Good theory, but its not working for me.

Multiculturalism - what an over-used word by some. Many feel it is a word forced on them and question why British people were never given a vote to decide to what degree the majority were expected to accept it. Whether losing their own way of life and identity was ever any part of any ‘deal’.

Brexit demonstrated just how many feel about this and how ‘multiculturism’ is a word bandied about by those trying to convince everyone else it is what this country is about. If you say so. Maybe assuming was never the way to go which is why we have Brexit now. Consequences.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Recently I don't believe the rights and protections as well as the public services and infrastructure that were the envy of the world are being sufficiently protected, that has impacted also on me. I really would like to see a tidal wave of feeling from the public on social issues and employment rights that would restore my faith in the English.

In the main it is the govt that I feel are working against what it means to be British and that is what is impacting on my feeling towards my country.

They stopped being the envy of the world when half the world started to come here and reap the rewards without putting anything in - which has significantly impacted on everyone else.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

They stopped being the envy of the world when half the world started to come here and reap the rewards without putting anything in - which has significantly impacted on everyone else.

And you say you're not a bigot

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

And you say you're not a bigot

So do you.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

They stopped being the envy of the world when half the world started to come here and reap the rewards without putting anything in - which has significantly impacted on everyone else.

Let me guess, you're patriotic and English.

@everyone confused at the responses of the poll, this is why Brits are less keen on the word 'patriotic' how wonderfully demonstrated.

Originally Posted by Withano

I've just been wondering for the last ten minutes if the word has just been hijacked by nationalists and has just became a dirty word by association?

I'll wonder no more

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

So do you.

I'm not going to fall down the rabbit hole of asking you to qualify that statement :/

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

Let me guess, you're patriotic and English.

@everyone confused at the responses of the poll, this is why Brits are less keen on the word 'patriotic' how wonderfully demonstrated.



I'll wonder no more

You wonder away or not. Who cares!

[Withano]

Welp, serious debates had a good two or three week run there. Welcome back I guess Brillo.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

Welp, serious debates had a good two or three week run there. Welcome back I guess Brillo.

Did it really - not from what I have been reading. But of course you would say that in your constant attempts to make me feel unwelcome. Give it up - people know what you are about.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Did it really - not from what I have been reading. But of course you would say that in your constant attempts to make me feel unwelcome. Give it up - people know what you are about.

Originally Posted by Brillopad

You wonder away or not. Who cares!

They were at least consistently of a high calibre than this. grow up a bit mate.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

They were at least consistently of a high calibre than this. grow up a bit mate.

Practice what you preach mate and stop trying to misinterpret threads. I have read them so go read them again or keep your unpleasant opinions to yourself.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I'm not going to fall down the rabbit hole of asking you to qualify that statement :/

Bigot = intolerance to the opinions of others.

Simple. I am not the only one who meets that criteria. You too have proved it time and again.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Did it really - not from what I have been reading. But of course you would say that in your constant attempts to make me feel unwelcome. Give it up - people know what you are about.

Welcome back Brillo

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Bigot = intolerance to the opinions of others.

Simple. I am not the only one who meets that criteria. You too have proved it time and again.

You have even amended the dictionary to make your skewed opinion appear viable!

'The fact of having and expressing strong, unreasonable beliefs and disliking other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life:

religious/racial bigotry'

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dic...nglish/bigotry

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

You have even amended the dictionary to make your skewed opinion appear viable!

'The fact of having and expressing strong, unreasonable beliefs and disliking other people who have different beliefs or a different way of life:

religious/racial bigotry'

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dic...nglish/bigotry

No I have not - that was the first and main definition. You are the one cherry-picking a definition that suits.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

No I have not - that was the first and main definition. You are the one cherry-picking a definition that suits.

Sorry Cambridge university brillo doesn't agree with your definition.....back to the drawing board :/

I expanded you definition btw.... You forgot this bit,

'a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.
"don't let a few small-minded bigots destroy the good image of the city"
synonyms: dogmatist, partisan, sectarian, prejudiced person; racist, racialist, sexist, homophobe, chauvinist, jingoist, anti-Semite; informalmale chauvinist pig, MCP'

[Twosugars]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Sorry Cambridge university brillo doesn't agree with your definition.....back to the drawing board :/

Don't you know? Cambridge University is the hotbed of left-wing liberals sabotaging our dictionaries and frigging foreigners coming over here and taking our university posts!