[user104658]

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

More like not giving a damn if it was illegal...I would say.

I genuinely think he thought that because he tricked and exploited them into sex work rather than literally chaining them up, it was "down to them" and he couldn't be held accountable for it.

That said there are videos of him and his brother getting verbally and physically abusive too. The ones where the girls end up sobbing in a heap and then Tate apologists try to tell everyone it's "just role play".

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

I genuinely think he thought that because he tricked and exploited them into sex work rather than literally chaining them up, it was "down to them" and he couldn't be held accountable for it.

That said there are videos of him and his brother getting verbally and physically abusive too. The ones where the girls end up sobbing in a heap and then Tate apologists try to tell everyone it's "just role play".

There are videos of the so called victims that are saying they're not victims.

[Alf]

Do I lie or do I just not sentence a person before all the evidence and facts are given?

[bots]

why dont you post this in the tate thread rather than this one

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Alf

There are videos of the so called victims that are saying they're not victims.

:facepalms: Pumps aren't found not guilty of. Pimping because the people they pimped say they don't feel like victims, it's a crime either way.

He's also done it to countless women so having one or two who are loyal to him is not surprising. You know what he's accused of, right? The whole "scam" is getting women to adore him so that they'll work for him in the sex industry.

Its illegal. Full stop.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

:facepalms: Pumps aren't found not guilty of. Pimping because the people they pimped say they don't feel like victims, it's a crime either way.

He's also done it to countless women so having one or two who are loyal to him is not surprising. You know what he's accused of, right? The whole "scam" is getting women to adore him so that they'll work for him in the sex industry.

Its illegal. Full stop.

How are you the only one that has access to the facts and evidence of this case?

You've sentenced this guy without trial. Maybe question your mindset because it's coming across very tyrannical and authoritarian.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Alf

How are you the only one that has access to the facts and evidence of this case?

You've sentenced this guy without trial. Maybe question your mindset because it's coming across very tyrannical and authoritarian.

I'm not, you just are only getting your info from one source, clearly.

I've seen and heard him speak, I've seen videos of him slapping girls about, I've heard the ways he tells you g men they should be living their lives. I don't need a judge or jury to tell me that the guy is a dangerous Redpill piece of trash. Why do you need other people to tell you what your opinion should be?

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

I'm not, you just are only getting your info from one source, clearly.

I've seen and heard him speak, I've seen videos of him slapping girls about, I've heard the ways he tells you g men they should be living their lives. I don't need a judge or jury to tell me that the guy is a dangerous Redpill piece of trash. Why do you need other people to tell you what your opinion should be?

I've seen videos of him bragging about being a pimp and how he can have as many women as he wants,but how a woman can't do the same. Typical double standard mysogyny at it's finest .

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

I'm not, you just are only getting your info from one source, clearly.

I've seen and heard him speak, I've seen videos of him slapping girls about, I've heard the ways he tells you g men they should be living their lives. I don't need a judge or jury to tell me that the guy is a dangerous Redpill piece of trash. Why do you need other people to tell you what your opinion should be?

I've seen the video of him slapping a girl around. From that video it looked like it was some sort of sex game and there was no reason to suggest from the video that it wasn't with the woman's consent. Some people are kinky.

I need other people to tell me so that I can eventually get to the truth, because like you, I don't know what's gone on.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Alf

I've seen the video of him slapping a girl around. From that video it looked like it was some sort of sex game and there was no reason to suggest from the video that it wasn't with the woman's consent. Some people are kinky.

**** off Alf if its the video I've seen she's clearly shocked when he slaps her and by the end she's crying. There's debate and then there's a step too far, this is just disgusting.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

**** off Alf if its the video I've seen she's clearly shocked when he slaps her and by the end she's crying. There's debate and then there's a step too far, this is just disgusting.

Was it the video where she's on the bed and then it cuts to them stood up by a door?

I only saw it once, from what I remember, the part on the bed looked like she was playing along. The part when they were stood up looked more aggressive, but who knows what some people get upto in the bedroom behind closed doors.

Some people pay to get tied up, whipped, trodden on and all-sorts.

[Crimson Dynamo]

[Crimson Dynamo]

[Crimson Dynamo]

[Crimson Dynamo]

Sturgeon admitting that when people found out that male prisoners being sent to womens prisons she stepped in but if people did not find out she didnt bother ...

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Sturgeon admitting that when people found out that male prisoners being sent to womens prisons she stepped in but if people did not find out she didnt bother ...

She needs to go ASAP

[bots]

she is pushing responsibility on to the prison service and then tying herself in knots trying to answer questions. Surely Scottish people will say enough is enough

[Niamh.]

And here is a Trans Activist responding to the interview basically saying that yes male rapists should be housed with women and Nicola Sturgeon is transphobic.

Spoiler:

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

And here is a Trans Activist responding to the interview basically saying that yes male rapists should be housed with women and Nicola Sturgeon is transphobic.

Spoiler:

They're not wrong to be fair, Nicola is trying to have her cake and eat it too... which is why she's stumbling around all over the place. The truth of course is that she knows what the sensible answer is but - like many people - is afraid of being branded transphobic (politically) and more importantly afraid of "aligning with Tories". She's spitting the Kool-Aid at people but I'm very, very doubtful that she's actually swallowed any herself. I don't see "real" ideology in her - just a political position she's decided to take.

She may well of course believe that trans rights are important too - as many of us do - but she recognises the objective reality that there is a fundamental difference between a woman and a trans woman.

[Crimson Dynamo]

like mosy people she believes trans women are trans women and to "believe" they are real born women is crazy but is too scared to say it

this is where we are with actual political leaders in 2023

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

They're not wrong to be fair, Nicola is trying to have her cake and eat it too... which is why she's stumbling around all over the place. The truth of course is that she knows what the sensible answer is but - like many people - is afraid of being branded transphobic (politically) and more importantly afraid of "aligning with Tories".

Oh yeah for sure but I'm glad that it's all been spelled out so plainly for all to see now and right in proper main stream media. The message is :

If you think male rapists who say they identify as women should not be housed with female prisoners, you are transphobic.

I think that makes the vast majority of the general public transphobic then

[user104658]

The sad irony is that we'd probaby be lightyears ahead on trans rights and safety if it WAS acknowledged that trans women are not women, but people who have chosen to live as women, accepted that for what it is and set about finding innovative solutions for trans people specifically that have nothing to do with trying to shoehorn them into women's spaces and women's rights. Trans people (the ones who were already trans - not the ones who fake it to get into a different prison specifically) genuinely are both;

1) A risk to women in women's prisons, even if non-violent, they are a psychological risk to a building full of captive traumatised women.

but also

2) At significant risk of harm in male prisons.

The real issue is never going to be addressed if we just keep pretending that one or the other "must be" the appropriate decision.

[Alf]

Youtube video

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

The sad irony is that we'd probaby be lightyears ahead on trans rights and safety if it WAS acknowledged that trans women are not women, but people who have chosen to live as women, accepted that for what it is and set about finding innovative solutions for trans people specifically that have nothing to do with trying to shoehorn them into women's spaces and women's rights. Trans people (the ones who were already trans - not the ones who fake it to get into a different prison specifically) genuinely are both;

1) A risk to women in women's prisons, even if non-violent, they are a psychological risk to a building full of captive traumatised women.

but also

2) At significant risk of harm in male prisons.

The real issue is never going to be addressed if we just keep pretending that one or the other "must be" the appropriate decision.

Yep, the foundations were built on a simple lie "TWAW", forcing people to swallow that lie was never going to be sustainable and we've been saying for years now that trying to make everyone bend to your will like they have been was eventually going to harm genuine trans people, ie those who actually have dysphoria. And it's actually harmed LGB acceptance too which I hate to see.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

The sad irony is that we'd probaby be lightyears ahead on trans rights and safety if it WAS acknowledged that trans women are not women, but people who have chosen to live as women, accepted that for what it is and set about finding innovative solutions for trans people specifically that have nothing to do with trying to shoehorn them into women's spaces and women's rights. Trans people (the ones who were already trans - not the ones who fake it to get into a different prison specifically) genuinely are both;

1) A risk to women in women's prisons, even if non-violent, they are a psychological risk to a building full of captive traumatised women.

but also

2) At significant risk of harm in male prisons.

The real issue is never going to be addressed if we just keep pretending that one or the other "must be" the appropriate decision.

Because people and the system are both stupid and tone deaf .

For e.g dressing rooms / changing rooms , this only works if there's individual cubicles with doors & locks . Look at the mess Primark caused.... with mixed gender dressing rooms. All that separated was a curtain . So of course predators took advantage,and tried to harass a woman in there .

As for the bathroom issue, I know some say we have to be careful of misgendering down a slippery slope. I will agree that some masculine women have been mistaken for men in women's bathrooms ...which is really unfortunate for them.

But whether we like it or not , our eyes will always judge a very masculine looking person as 'male' & a very 'feminine' person as female. That's just how our brains work.

And if you identify as the opposite gender, you should atleast make the effort to pass... especially so you don't stick out like a sore thumb . I know not everyone will like that but it's socially a fact . A man with a beard and a wig walking into a woman's bathroom...is going to make other women uncomfortable.

Also I think there should be more disabled / stand alone toilets. I go to a office building that is mixed gender toilets ,but it's like going to a disabled toilet. You have your own space . Same with coffee shops etc. The only thing I hate is when some men leave the toilet seat up .

As for the prison argument , if you're clearly exploiting a loophole and only 'transitioned' after you've committed a crime / been arrested and you're a 'trans woman' . Then straight in the men's prison you go. Also another thing which will make sense is to have an entirely different wing and block with just trans prisoners, so that other prisoners feel safe .