[Withano]

Originally Posted by arista

Of Course he will NOT
he got thousands voting for him
massive support


But as The Brexit Party did so well
he had no chance of a win

A couple thousand isn’t very much and it’s not like he has much to fall back on. So.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Withano

A couple thousand isn’t very much and it’s not like he has much to fall back on. So.

Sure

[reece(:]

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by reece(:

No no, to be 'fair' you have to add the Tory vote to hard brexit (despite the tory party being divided..), and discount Labour! Otherwise you are manipulating statistics

[reece(:]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

No no, to be 'fair' you have to add the Tory vote to hard brexit (despite the tory party being divided..), and discount Labour! Otherwise you are manipulating statistics

Oh yes the hard brexit Tories including hard brexiteer MPs Ken Clarke, Dom Grieve, Amber Rudd and Phillip Hammond etc !!! (the latter said he would vote against a no deal Tory whip)

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by reece(:

Oh yes the hard brexit Tories including hard brexiteer MPs Ken Clarke, Dom Grieve, Amber Rudd and Phillip Hammond etc !!! (the latter said he would vote against a no deal Tory whip)

I've many Conservative friends too, who don't want anything like a hard brexit.
They either want a deal or to revoke article 50 altogether.

I have very few Labour friends who would support a no deal or hard brexit.
They want another referendum.

Labour much moreso to a beneficial deal or remain should be the road we go on.
With another public vote on the issue.

Corbyn is in difficulty, he really wants to leave.
Labour voters mostly want to remain and the membership want a new referendum.
If Corbyn won't deliver what his voters want and membership wants..
He maybe should now after 5 years as leader.
Re think his position as leader.

The Conservatives have a big problem, Theresa May had an agreement to deliver a brexit.
Her hard-line group of the Party blocked leaving with that.
Now in a leadership election process with a likely stronger hard-line pro brexit leader to come.

They lost votes left,right and centre, falling to only 9% of the votes here.
Doesn't say much as to who is on offer in their leadership election.

It's a straight switch from UKIP to The Brexit party.
UKIP won 24 seats last time.
These have 28 now.
Up to 32% from 27% last time.
So a few more votes and seats admittedly but not earth shaking.

Labour must in my view, wish to get another vote to the public.
I'm now a convert to that myself.

A general election will only deliver another hung Parliament.
Likely compounding the problems in place now even more.

[reece(:]

Labour's David Lammy, Ian Murray and Martin Whitfield have blasted Corbyn's mess of an EU election and indecision

[Liam-]

He tired to make both sides happy, which in circumstances like these ones, will never work

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Liam-

He tired to make both sides happy, which in circumstances like these ones, will never work

Thats all he ever ****ing does. He needs to actually make a decision on something and stick to it, rather than flip flopping all over trying to please both sides. I genuinely can't believe I fell for all his bluster not that long ago and voted for him. I am polar opposite on him now, where I did think he was the saviour of the country for gods sake Its hilarious looking back, almost like joining a cult, I ignored everything bad and just thought he was amazing. His speeches were great, but I see now that its basically just..saying the right words for wherever you are speaking at. No actual...plan or..go. Just words. So, no good at all really.

[Vicky.]

See stuff like this.. 'Jeremy Corbyn has hinted the Labour Party may move towards backing a second referendum after a dismal European elections.'...hinted isn't really good enough. Put the damn foot down and chose.

https://metro.co.uk/2019/05/27/corby...WVkCdobyvNaGus

[Twosugars]

Corbyn's problem is he is a brexiter leading a remain party. 75% of Labour members are remain.
He is a brexiter and for all the wrong reasons to boot. He's ruining the party.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

Corbyn's problem is he is a brexiter leading a remain party. 75% of Labour members are remain.
He is a brexiter and for all the wrong reasons to boot. He's ruining the party.

Agreed, hes the main reason I feel I cannot vote for Labour these days, after voting for them since I could!

He will cling on though, and anyone challenging him will be defeated. The only way he will go is if he voluntarily steps dpwn, which is unlikely. Mind, I think being wiped out in a GE might finally make him take notice. Unfortunately, I stil think people will be loyal and vote Labour regardless, so they won't get the crushing defeat they deserve. Having said that, the Tories deserve a bigger defeat. But..who on earth will defeat them? I know Lib Dems have picked up a lot of support in this, but willl that translate into GE votes? I really want both Lanbour and Tories to be wiped out so they rethink everything, but am unsure who I want to wipe them out as the other options are..dodgy too.

The only good thing about this ****show, is that the next GE is slightly unpredictable. The bad thing, is that there is a chance, albeit a small one, that Farages party will get a lot of seats, and they appear to be further right than the Tories in their views (mind, of course their views aren't that known, given people voted for them without knowing them to start with...) :S

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

He is a brexiter and for all the wrong reasons to boot. He's ruining the party.

What are his wrong reasons, and in your opinion what would be some right reasons, if any?

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Twosugars

Corbyn's problem is he is a brexiter leading a remain party. 75% of Labour members are remain.
He is a brexiter and for all the wrong reasons to boot. He's ruining the party.

same here with our dutch Labour party, also pro-EU but the difference with our labour and british labour lies in the fact we have a better leader

Asscher (despite some criticism from fellow politicians) he's overall liked by an older and younger generation, also not anti-semitic what Corbyn also had been accused of by some


PVDA (had been more popular in parliament back in the days of wim kok, ruud lubbers) but i'm pleased they were the majority party for us in these elections

[Tom4784]

Have they actually detailed any policies or plans yet or do they believe they don't ever have to do that since they got a bunch of uninformed ignorant people voting for them anyway so they don't need to be accountable for anything?

[Parmy]

Come on corbyn..do the right thing and resign.

[arista]

[Underscore]

Must say it has been so satisfying to see the Tories (and to a lesser extent Labour) suffer.

[Alf]

The Right seemed to do well in Europe.

Will you still be pro EU if the right takes over it?

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Alf

The Right seemed to do well in Europe.

Will you still be pro EU if the right takes over it?

yes i'll still be pro EU, and some of the far right countries have been warned few times already (yes looking at you Hungary, with evil dictator orban)

so i can see some of those getting kicked out if they go too far


and if Farage keeps trolling (like he does now with his brexit party) well EU can also kick out UK themselves, way before October 31st


most take it very much seriously in european parliament

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

yes i'll still be pro EU, and some of the far right countries have been warned few times already (yes looking at you Hungary, with evil dictator orban)

so i can see some of those getting kicked out if they go too far


and if Farage keeps trolling (like he does now with his brexit party) well EU can also kick out UK themselves, way before October 31st


most take it very much seriously in european parliament

You make the current EU sound like fascists with all this censoring and de-platforming. I thought you was suppose to be bigging them up?

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Alf

You make the current EU sound like fascists with all this censoring and de-platforming. I thought you was suppose to be bigging them up?

oh, so we should allow ''far right'' countries to stay in our EU


Hungary's Orban has done evil things, he controls women wether or not they should have children or not (which is a big no no since everyone can decide for themselves if you want children or not)

closed borders to prevent terrorism no no either because you can still have terrorists in your country

[Crimson Dynamo]

Did anyone ever find out what the failing Labour party's stance was on Brexit?

[Livia]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Did anyone ever find out what the failing Labour party's stance was on Brexit?

I think it's a secret.

[joeysteele]

Labour has not captured the unifying ground and now needs to really come down on one side.
I think it should take the anti brexit line.

Labour has been consistent, it has always wanted a customs union arrangement, as close to the single market as possible and never in support of no deal.
That's pretty clear to me.
The country and Parties are divided on the best way forward.
It was never going to be easy, Labour are not the government.
The Conservative party is.

The mess is theirs but to be fair the mess is understandable.
Theresa May who I dislike totally, got an agreement the best she could..
It's some of HER party who wrecked that and her premiership, no one else.

The fudge from Labour on another vote is what Labour needs to clear up.
It should support one unconditionally.
Stop trying to unite those who have no wish to be unified.
Corbyn needs to lead and not muddle things as he has on the referendum so far.

Things are not clear or easy on brexit, it's not wrong to try to find a way to fuse together two sides but it's failed for Labour.
Mainly because of Corbyn's mixed thinking on another vote.

The Conservative message is unclear too.

The SNP, Greens, Plaid Cynru and Lib Dems want to remain.
That's clear, that works.
In remaining nothing changes.

The Brexit supporters in Parliament need to be more honest.
Some want a soft brexit they call it.
Some an arrangement like May's agreement.
Some want out at any cost to everyone.

This was always going to be difficult.
Now 3 years on, a lot has been learned, and changed.

If we'd got moving out a year after the referendum, instead of the sideshow of Mrs May's general election.
Fine.

Two further years on from that.
I hated the thought of another vote, now 3 years on, I've changed my mind.

I'm sure I'm not the only one to do so either.

If brexit supporters really do believe, the Country still wants to leave.
Then why they fear another vote is beyond me.

If I believed I'd win a vote and win another too, I'd love to have and be eager to have such votes.

I think Corbyn's problem may be more about, he wants to leave for his agenda and so fears another vote going the other way.
That for me is the only confusion for me as to Labours stance.

For the life of me, I'll never understand why Corbyn helped support the ERG wing of the Conservatives and the DUP, by whipping his MPs against May's agreement with the EU.

I feel, if he fails now to support another public vote.
He should be replaced too.