[Z]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Sedatives remain in your body for months? Never knew that. Thought it would be like..a week.

Traces are still in your hair follicles etc, like how dope tests are carried out but can catch people out from months previously.

[the truth]

if anyone knows how to lie and cover things up its corrupt doctors and specialists. with some of them its become 1 of the main parts of their job description

[Josy]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Hmm according to this, which links to the Portuguese police files, the McCann's said from the start that the patio doors were closed but not locked, and somewhere else on the site it gives a pretty detailed abduction theory which gives a few reasons why the window might have been opened:

There was no fingerprints from anyone else on the window though apart from Kates.

(According to numerous websites online)

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Josy

There was no fingerprints from anyone else on the window though apart from Kates.

(According to numerous websites online)

But wouldn't a child abductor be very likely to wear gloves?

[Josy]

Originally Posted by Lee.

But wouldn't a child abductor be very likely to wear gloves?

I have no idea

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Josy

There was no fingerprints from anyone else on the window though apart from Kates.

(According to numerous websites online)

And also, I do not believe that Kate's would have been the only fingerprints on a window used by hundreds of holidaymakers.

[Josy]

Originally Posted by Lee.

And also, I do not believe that Kate's would have been the only fingerprints on a window used by hundreds of holidaymakers.

I read numerous times on those different sites (the links that have been posted) that the only fingerprints found on the window/frame were Kates and the window had recently been washed too.

Not got a clue how they would find out about the washing of it but yeah that's what I read.

Originally Posted by the truth

No thats your deliberate misinterpretation of whats been said
They didnt dictate, but they may have managed to subdue, avoid, stall etc the media and the language barrier assisted in this

So I have deliberately misinterpreted it, but your argument is that they "may" have been able to stall it because of the language barrier? If I was a criminal, I'd move to Portugal. Seems like you only have to talk in English, but really slowly and in a portuguese accent that you "no comprende whata they a sayina'" and you're home free.

Originally Posted by the truth

if anyone knows how to lie and cover things up its corrupt doctors and specialists. with some of them its become 1 of the main parts of their job description

That is completely baseless.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by the truth

the mccanns admitted it on crimewatch....did you not watch the show? them and all their friends did it

They didn't admit to doing it AFTER Maddie vanished. Did you watch the show?

[Marsh.]

I assumed the only fingerprints that could be identified were Kate's.

So, hers were the only prints full stop?

[Josy]

Originally Posted by 08marsh

I assumed the only fingerprints that could be identified were Kate's.

So, hers were the only prints full stop?

I'm trying to find the part I read about the fingerprints, you could well be right though.

[user104658]

It's all splitting hairs... They're guilty of causing her death no matter what happened that night.

Let's imagine a child DID die in an accident after being left by their parents, alone, in a holiday appartment, after the children had clearly been distressed the previous night, and even if they reported it there and then.

Would they be regarded as innocent victims, or even applauded as heroes as the McCanns have been at times? Or would they RIGHTLY face the heat publicly and possibly even legally, for blatant careless neglect causing the death of their child?

I strongly suspect the latter.

That in mind - let's sat its exactly as they say. She didn't have an accident, instead, an abductor broke in, took her, and killed her or worse. Why is the response any different? Why does it matter WHAT happened to her? Why isn't it, in fact, even worse?

They are guilty as sin, whether it's a covered up accident or an abduction, and it's a bloody tragedy that from some people, they probably get more sympathy than the poor girl herself.

Now, you can say "they've suffered enough by losing her, imagine how they must feel, they're deserving if public sympathy" and all I can say in response is... I have a 3 and a half year old girl. If my careless, selfish, ridiculously neglectful actions lead to her death I would not WANT any sympathy, from anyone. I would want the worst that the world could throw at me.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

It's all splitting hairs... They're guilty of causing her death no matter what happened that night.

Let's imagine a child DID die in an accident after being left by their parents, alone, in a holiday appartment, after the children had clearly been distressed the previous night, and even if they reported it there and then.

Would they be regarded as innocent victims, or even applauded as heroes as the McCanns have been at times? Or would they RIGHTLY face the heat publicly and possibly even legally, for blatant careless neglect causing the death of their child?

I strongly suspect the latter.

That in mind - let's sat its exactly as they say. She didn't have an accident, instead, an abductor broke in, took her, and killed her or worse. Why is the response any different? Why does it matter WHAT happened to her? Why isn't it, in fact, even worse?

They are guilty as sin, whether it's a covered up accident or an abduction, and it's a bloody tragedy that from some people, they probably get more sympathy than the poor girl herself.

Now, you can say "they've suffered enough by losing her, imagine how they must feel, they're deserving if public sympathy" and all I can say in response is... I have a 3 and a half year old girl. If my careless, selfish, ridiculously neglectful actions lead to her death I would not WANT any sympathy, from anyone. I would want the worst that the world could throw at me.

At what point should this become the case?

Like say a child dies when their parent is in the bath, or while their having dinner out in their garden, or if they pop next door for a few minutes to borrow something, are the parents responsible for the death in all of these cases?

[user104658]

Originally Posted by MTVN

At what point should this become the case?

Like say a child dies when their parent is in the bath, or while their having dinner out in their garden, or if they pop next door for a few minutes to borrow something, are the parents responsible for the death in all of these cases?

When they leave their distressed children completely alone for hours on end, in a foreign country, so that they can go out for drinks with their buddies.

Pretending that this is acceptable parenting, or comparable to popping out for a few minutes, is utter madness.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

When they leave their distressed children completely alone for hours on end, in a foreign country, so that they can go out for drinks with their buddies.

Pretending that this is acceptable parenting, or comparable to popping out for a few minutes, is utter madness.

It wasn't for hours on end though, they were checking every half hour, I know you will say that they did do it for hours in previous nights but the fact that it happened on the night they never went half an hour without checking them shows that this can happen at any time or at any point when you leave your children unattended, even just for a few minutes

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

When they leave their distressed children completely alone for hours on end, in a foreign country, so that they can go out for drinks with their buddies.

Pretending that this is acceptable parenting, or comparable to popping out for a few minutes, is utter madness.

god, you have got it bad!

you cant do enough to make them out to be monsters,

they where not distressed when they left them, foreign country, yes a holiday resort, not war torn country.

it was not an 18 to 30 holiday and they where getting smashed every night.

how many parents are drunk or on drugs at night while in charge of their kids?
bloody thousands!

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

god, you have got it bad!

you cant do enough to make them out to be monsters,

they where not distressed when they left them, foreign country, yes a holiday resort, not war torn country.

it was not an 18 to 30 holiday and they where getting smashed every night.

how many parents are drunk or on drugs at night while in charge of their kids?
bloody thousands!

No, they weren't BUT they had been distressed enough the night before to mention it to the parents on the morning. I don't think they're monsters but they were selfish and neglectful.

[Vicky.]

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic111.html

Hmm. Cant believe I have never checked for other peoples statements tbh. Seems some of the restaurant employees make the timeline shorter than the Tapas 9 do. Child discovered missing at around 9.30 and the search began

(Checking the first line of each statement takes you to the PJ released files, so the statements seem to be real)

Edit. That does kind of fit in with a statement I read at one point a while ago, in which apparently the witness heard someone shouting 'Madeleine, madeleine' at about 9.30. Will try to find it

Spoiler:

Between approximately a quarter past nine and half past nine we left the Tapas bar to go home, we walked across the MW reception area, crossed the road and a semi circular path to return to the apartment, were we put the children to bed and a short while later did the same ourselves. I do not remember seeing or hearing anyone during our return to the apartment. When I crossed the road outside the MW reception I remember there were cars parked, I remember taking some time to see if I could cross the road because there were cars parked to my left and I was carrying I****. They were about six metres away from me and i calculate that some (inaudible) metres from the back of Gerry's apartment, I do not remember anything about these cars, it was normal for cars to be parked there and in the morning they were no longer there. My wife mentioned on the following day that she vaguely remembered someone calling "Madeleine, Madeleine", this was after we had crossed the road from the MW reception and before entering our apartment. She does not remember where the sound came from or whether it was in an urgent tone, not paying any more attention to it and only remembered the following day when we heard about Madeleine's disappearance".

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/STEPHEN-CARPENTER.htm

Between 9.15 + 9.30 ish

[Marsh.]

Where are they asking for sympathy?

The interviews are pleas for information so the mystery of where Maddie is can be solved.

[user104658]

They're not monsters, they're just the same typically self-involved parents that embody the attitude of the entire western world. That doesn't make it any less neglectful (they have admitted themselves that Madeleine asked where they were the night before as thy were crying, they were distressed, and these "parents" were aware of that).

Leaving your kids alone to go OUT with friends is not bloody OK! and the fact that "loads of other people do it" doesn'take it any better, it only makes it more depressing.

[user104658]

Also to add, anyone who would leave toddlers out of sight AND SOUND of a supervising adult even for a few minutes, is being careless. Yes you can go to the toilet, go upstairs, go for a shower, but you can always at least hear them if they need you.

I also don't understand the "where do you draw the line" argument? Why not argue that the other way? Accidents can happen in only a few moments, so why not throw caution to the wind and go to work leaving them? Leave them a sandwich and some water, they'll probably be fine.

[Kizzy]

Yes and when these things do happen the parents who are negligent are hauled over the coals as a rule... except now.
It's not always enough to say they have suffered enough.
The case they have brought against the detective is not beneficial to the case is it?

[Z]

The fact the British government personally intervened on the behalf of the McCanns and their personal connections to Tony Blair and Gordon Brown makes me believe even more than while they may not necessarily be guilty of her accidental death and subsequent cover up; there is certainly some kind of sinister government involvement in all of this that wouldn't be the case if they were a family of street cleaners who went down to the pub and left their three children home alone.

Quite simply, they've been given special treatment because they were affluent white doctors in a foreign country and their little girl has a cute face. That's why it's become a media fixture and that's why they've been given special treatment. I believe them to be guilty of negligence regardless of what actually happened to Madeleine and I think it's shocking they've not been fined, if not jailed for the amount of police time, energy and money they've wasted on this case. It's not going to be solved unless Madeleine escapes or the person responsible comes forward - whether that's an abductor, or one of the McCanns themselves. Truly depressing. It's been six years, no one has any information, they should accept this and just hope that they'll have good news one day. People aren't going to remember something after 6 years that they didn't already know.

[Ammi]

..I don't get the waste of police time and energy, if it does lead to finding out what happened to Madeleine ..not that I think it will but a parent wouldn't ever stop trying though...

[Z]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..I don't get the waste of police time and energy, if it does lead to finding out what happened to Madeleine ..not that I think it will but a parent wouldn't ever stop trying though...

They've been hiring private investigators for years, they've held up police investigations by not cooperating fully, they've got the police looking at the case once again despite absolutely no new information coming to light, they've just changed the way they've looked at the investigation... the case has gone cold, they're just flogging a dead horse for more money because they don't have any other options, they don't want to accept that their poor decision making led to this situation. I have never once seen them accept any level of criticism or blame. They've got a terrible public image because they've turned themselves into public figures. This is the reason they get criticised. Nobody has ever criticised April Jones' parents for letting her play outside unattended. Nobody has ever criticised the Wells or Chapman families for letting Holly and Jessica go out by themselves. There is a world of difference between a tragic kidnapping and what the McCanns did.