[Spike]

I think the main reason is children are brought up to think being straight is normal and maybe the only option. I know when I was a child I didn't know that there could be such a thing as same sex couples, if people were more open with their children about this kind of thing then maybe homophobia would die out

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

BUt it isnt normal. I dont care how you spin it! There is a reason why only men and women can procreate. Its an anomally for sure. Most people would never think, or consider being with the same sex, ever. That is a fact. ANd of course if you are gay, you think people are in denial etc.... NOt true, its because you are different, for one reason or another.
Now, I dont have any problems with homosexuals, and I am not disgusted or anything. Some of my good friends are gay, and we can talk openly about anything.

So my point is, I can perectly understand, people finding it not normal, but People have to be neam spirited, and bad by nature to be homophobic.
Because imo, youre homophobic, if you take some ative ation against homosexuals. like persecute them, call them names, discriminate against them, in jobs, or anything else.

So take out religion, and how you are raised, it will still be about the same percentage of people who are gay.

I agree with Wildcat...

Most straight males I know are not comfortable with seeing 2 gay men together (neither are some females) but this does not mean they are homophobic. I do know one man who, quite disgustingly, is proud to admit that during his punk days, he used to go out "**** bashing"; he uses derogatory language when talking about gays and takes is stupidly far by refusing to listen to music if it is by somebody gay. I really don't have an explanation for him being like this... maybe it's because he is a bit older and was brought up in an age where it was more taboo than it is nowadays..
I actually don't think there is as much homophobia these days and people are quick to label people who don't want it rubbed in their faces as homophobic..

[Stu]

Originally Posted by happyland

Most straight males I know are not comfortable with seeing 2 gay men together (neither are some females) but this does not mean they are homophobic.

That is the point of the thread though. It may not mean they are homophobic, but likewise it does not make being gay abnormal. And actually, yes, I would consider it 'homophobic'. Not in a violent way, extreme way but if seeing two guys kissing creeps you out then obviously you are homophobic to a certain extent. If you are arachnophobic you don't like the look of spiders. They give you the shivers.

Originally Posted by happyland

I really don't have an explanation for him being like this.

I do. It's because he is a fucking moron.

Also, there is still a massive amount of homophobia everywhere. Just because the media and politicians have put on a brave face and accepted it counts for nothing.

[Jack_]

Originally Posted by MrGaryy

Well it's a number of many, many things really. I think in young teens it really just is a fear of going against the grain, I doubt half the 13 year olds labelling people as queer or fags, if you genuinely broke down their personality meant it in an offensive way but they know that if they speak in a way similar to others it will make them more acceptable. Not to excuse that sort of thing or anything, just my personal explanation.

I'd agree with that.

Originally Posted by Lauren

On subject with Stu and Wildcat... I think homosexual 'sex' is neither normal nor abnormal, because it comes under the subject of sex - which is completely 100% natural. The desire of sex is fuelled by our need to reach a sexual pique, and whicever way this is achieved is natural. Nothing to do with procreation in my view.

And this, very good explanation.

Originally Posted by Spike

I think the main reason is children are brought up to think being straight is normal and maybe the only option. I know when I was a child I didn't know that there could be such a thing as same sex couples, if people were more open with their children about this kind of thing then maybe homophobia would die out

This is pretty much what I believe but just put into a simpler form. Like Stu said earlier the thread, hopefully in the next generation homophobia will have been wiped out and only the small few will still be homophobic.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I think that overall people with ginger hair get a far worse treatment. Numbers that is. I realise the odd person gets a hiding but overall I would say that people with ginger hair is a bigger ism or phobia

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Stu

That is the point of the thread though. It may not mean they are homophobic, but likewise it does not make being gay abnormal. And actually, yes, I would consider it 'homophobic'. Not in a violent way, extreme way but if seeing two guys kissing creeps you out then obviously you are homophobic to a certain extent. If you are arachnophobic you don't like the look of spiders. They give you the shivers.


I do. It's because he is a fucking moron.

Also, there is still a massive amount of homophobia everywhere. Just because the media and politicians have put on a brave face and accepted it counts for nothing.

I don't think it's homophobic at all... Being gay is not abnormal, but to a straight man, seeing two men together is ; doesn't mean they feel hatred towards them or fear them...
I also think a lot of gay men feel the need to exaggerate their "gayness" to prove something to the world... I have a gay friend who is very comfortable with his sexuality, he doesn't hide it and is quite open, but him and his partner lead a completely normal life like any other couple.. they don't "camp it up"/only frequent gay bars/walk about with their tongues down each others throats etc. They are comfortable with themselves and don't feel the need to shout to the world "We're gay and we'll show you we're gay and the whole world had better accept it"

And yes you're right, he is an effing moron!

And just to mention your spider analogy... I am not arachnaphobic; I don't scream or shiver when I see a spider. I don't however go out my way to look at them. I don't enjoy looking at them, I don't have a reason for it, I just don't

[Stu]

Originally Posted by happyland

I don't think it's homophobic at all... Being gay is not abnormal, but to a straight man, seeing two men together is ; doesn't mean they feel hatred towards them or fear them...
I also think a lot of gay men feel the need to exaggerate their "gayness" to prove something to the world... I have a gay friend who is very comfortable with his sexuality, he doesn't hide it and is quite open, but him and his partner lead a completely normal life like any other couple.. they don't "camp it up"/only frequent gay bars/walk about with their tongues down each others throats etc. They are comfortable with themselves and don't feel the need to shout to the world "We're gay and we'll show you we're gay and the whole world had better accept it"

And yes you're right, he is an effing moron!

And just to mention your spider analogy... I am not arachnaphobic; I don't scream or shiver when I see a spider. I don't however go out my way to look at them. I don't enjoy looking at them, I don't have a reason for it, I just don't

I still think they are homophobic to a certain extent. They are uncomfortable seeing gay men.

Camp gay men will always exist, it's just who you are. I feel a twinge of campness in me sometimes. It's not something you can control and it's not something you fake FFS. Why are straight people shoving it down my throat [lolz] that they are straight by only frequenting straight bars and jamming each others tongues down there throats?

See how ridiculous that argument sounds? Gay people are proud to be gay. Good for them. Do you not think, maybe, the fact that they brag about it MAY have something to do with the fact that homophobia still exists and grown men are still uncomfortable around gays?

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Stu

I still think they are homophobic to a certain extent. They are uncomfortable seeing gay men.

Camp gay men will always exist, it's just who you are. I feel a twinge of campness in me sometimes. It's not something you can control and it's not something you fake FFS. Why are straight people shoving it down my throat [lolz] that they are straight by only frequenting straight bars and jamming each others tongues down there throats?

See how ridiculous that argument sounds? Gay people are proud to be gay. Good for them. Do you not think, maybe, the fact that they brag about it MAY have something to do with the fact that homophobia still exists and grown men are still uncomfortable around gays?

I'm not saying all gay men "fake" campness, but some certainly do.. I used to be involved in the fashion industry where there were plenty of gay males around. Many of them used to completely change when working and would slip into this ultra camp persona and mince about flamboyantly, air kissing and using smutty innuendo towards everyone but then later away from work the campness would have mysteriously disappeared...

I don't actually think my argument is ridiculous at all... Straight people don't go about saying they are proud to be straight and feel the need to brag about it so why do gays? I think it is the ones that feel they need to brag about it that are actually uncortable with themselves..

BTW I am not on here dissing gays or condoning homophobia in any way at all... In my opinion , the world would be a pretty dull place if we were all the same..

[Stu]

Originally Posted by happyland

Straight people don't go about saying they are proud to be straight and feel the need to brag about it so why do gays?

Because typically, in my world, straight people don't come under fire a whole lot and gay people do? Maybe things are different in yours.

[Lee.]

What about females? How do women here feel about seeing two women together?

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Stu

Because typically, in my world, straight people don't come under fire a whole lot? Maybe they do in yours.

No, they don't in my world either but then neither do gay people... There will alway be people who can't accept something that doesn't fall within their narrow minded ideas but that applies to a lot more than just homophobia..

I think many gay people seem to have a chip on their shoulder and feel more persecuted than they actually are...

[Stu]

Originally Posted by happyland

No, they don't in my world either but then neither do gay people... There will alway be people who can't accept something that doesn't fall within their narrow minded ideas but that applies to a lot more than just homophobia..

I think many gay people seem to have a chip on their shoulder and feel more persecuted than they actually are...

I think you have a chip on your shoulder, to be honest. To deny that there is a large degree of mistrust, fear and anger towards gay people in the world is just plain daft, and wholly absurd. It's like people who assume racism no longer exists just because we have black people on d'telly.

A lot of people still hate them. A lot of people still don't understand them. A lot of people are still ashamed of them. And thus, from that, the gay pride element emerges.

To coin a phrase : ''Go figure''.

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Stu

I think you have a chip on your shoulder, to be honest. To deny that there is a large degree of mistrust, fear and anger towards gay people in the world is just plain daft, and wholly absurd. It's like people who assume racism no longer exists just because we have black people on d'telly.

A lot of people still hate them. A lot of people still don't understand them. A lot of people are still ashamed of them. And thus, from that, the gay pride element emerges.

To coin a phrase : ''Go figure''.

Why would I have a chip on my shoulder? I am not denying there is homophobia but my original point was that just because straight males feel some discomfort on seeing two men kissing etc does not mean that they are homophobic. I'm not saying it's right and I'm not saying being gay is wrong but I think some gay people need to get over themselves, accept what they are and stop giving a sh!t what other people think..

[BGT-FAN!]

Sterotypes in the media, e.g Jack form will and grace, chris crocker, graham norton etc etc

[Stu]

Originally Posted by happyland

Why would I have a chip on my shoulder? I am not denying there is homophobia but my original point was that just because straight males feel some discomfort on seeing two men kissing etc does not mean that they are homophobic. I'm not saying it's right and I'm not saying being gay is wrong but I think some gay people need to get over themselves, accept what they are and stop giving a sh!t what other people think..

You have a chip on your shoulder because watching them give visible displays of pride, which they are entitled to, bothers you.

Simple.

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Stu

You have a chip on your shoulder because watching them give visible displays of pride, which they are entitled to, bothers you.

Simple.

What? Where exactly have I said that? Nothing much bothers me to be honest... including gays!
I think we will have to agree to disagree over this one. I think you have misunderstood me slightly. I personally have absolutely nothing against gay people but I think they should accept that not everyone does accept them and just get on with it.. I am not condoning violence, hatred or aggresion towards them but I can see why a straight male feels uncomfortable seeing two men together. That's all..

[Stu]

Originally Posted by happyland

What? Where exactly have I said that? Nothing much bothers me to be honest... including gays!
I think we will have to agree to disagree over this one. I think you have misunderstood me slightly. I personally have absolutely nothing against gay people but I think they should accept that not everyone does accept them and just get on with it.. I am not condoning violence, hatred or aggresion towards them but I can see why a straight male feels uncomfortable seeing two men together. That's all..

I know your not condoning those things, but you have said repeatedly and have made it quiet clear that gay's who are over the top with displaying the fact that they are gay annoy you and that you feel it is unnecessary.

So once again, with feeling,

A lot of people still hate them. A lot of people still don't understand them. A lot of people are still ashamed of them. And thus, from that, the gay pride element emerges.

To coin a phrase : ''Go figure''.

Don't get me wrong, I know your not homophobic and I know you don't condone homophobia. That's all cool.

I can see why a straight male feels uncomfortable seeing two men together.

And that is homophobia. Like it or not. A very, very, very small condition of homophobia, I will grant you, but it's still there. If I were 'uncomfortable' being outdoors in social situations I would be a bit of an agoraphobic. There are different kinds of homophobia. They don't all go around chucking nail bomb's into clubs named after tools.

[Lauren]

Originally Posted by happyland

What about females? How do women here feel about seeing two women together?

I don't feel anything? I've probably seen it and not thought twice about it. I'm honestly not THAT arsed where people put their bits to be perfectly honest.

[Stu]

Originally Posted by Lauren

I don't feel anything?

Shit.

All bets are off, lads. Put your cameras and dicks away.

[Lauren]

Originally Posted by Stu

Shit.

All bets are off, lads. Put your cameras and dicks away.

Bahahaha!

[Lee.]

Originally Posted by Stu

I know your not condoning those things, but you have said repeatedly and have made it quiet clear that gay's who are over the top with displaying the fact that they are gay annoy you and that you feel it is unnecessary.

So once again, with feeling,



Don't get me wrong, I know your not homophobic and I know you don't condone homophobia. That's all cool.



And that is homophobia. Like it or not. A very, very, very small condition of homophobia, I will grant you, but it's still there. If I were 'uncomfortable' being outdoors in social situations I would be a bit of an agoraphobic. There are different kinds of homophobia. They don't all go around chucking nail bomb's into clubs named after tools.

And that point is where we disagree... To me, that isn't homophobia but just a natural feeling. Here's a point actually; I know 2 gay men who feel uncomfortable, almost repulsed if they see a straight couple kissing... Is that ok?

[Stu]

Originally Posted by happyland

And that point is where we disagree... To me, that isn't homophobia but just a natural feeling. Here's a point actually; I know 2 gay men who feel uncomfortable, almost repulsed if they see a straight couple kissing... Is that ok?

Of course not. I have no idea how that argument made it to the internet. Christ.

[zotler.]

I don't understand how I know a lot of straight men who find homosexual men couples disgusting, whereas they find female homosexual couples 'hot'. Is this just them being a dick? -.-

[supernoodles!]

Originally Posted by zotler.

I don't understand how I know a lot of straight men who find homosexual men couples disgusting, whereas they find female homosexual couples 'hot'. Is this just them being a dick? -.-

Straight men only find lesbians 'hot' because its basically two of what they are attracted too,there not going to find two gay men attractive because they don`t fancy men.

[Stu]

Originally Posted by supernoodles!

Straight men only find lesbians 'hot' because its basically two of what they are attracted too,there not going to find two gay men attractive because they don`t fancy men.

But attraction aside it is still hypocritical. They find something morally bankrupt about one and not the other. Being gay is being gay. Don't matter if you are a man or woman.