[Ammi]

Originally Posted by toronto_matt

i would attack that persons intellect not their physical features..

say what you want about helen, she has never once mentioned or criticized the way ashleigh "looks", only the way she "acts"

calling someones face or someone as a whole ugly as an "insult" is pretty much as low as you can go, its shallow and its just downright rude. its pretty much scrapping the bottle of the barrel..

..I agree that an attack one physical appearance is the lowest...and I don't recall Helen doing so as such with Helen but (I think) that Helen has made some remarks about Ashleigh's 'face' in terms of the expressions etc she pulls but I may be wrong about that but if I recall the whole DR rant with Ashleigh, she said she was ugly when she went off on one type thing..?..I'm not saying that's right but its a more general thing said in anger rather than some of the specifics that have been said about other housemates and some by Helen herself as well as others...also I think the 'lowest' for me is specifics that would obviously be sensitive to someone like Ashleigh's acne which has been referred to so many times on here and elsewhere on social sites...its picking at a 'weakness/sensitivity' in with someone, no better than if it were a disability....

[JTM45]

I remember Helen saying stuff about Ashleigh's skin and her having spots and she slagged off her hair several times saying it looked like straw.
She was really stretching to try and find anything though.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by JTM45

I remember Helen saying stuff about Ashleigh's skin and her having spots and she slagged off her hair several times saying it looked like straw.
She was really stretching to try and find anything though.

..oh thanks, I couldn't recall but yeah, those are specifics about someone's appearance and Ashleigh has obviously got teenage acne so that would be a sensitivity..I'm not saying that calling someone ugly based on their appearance is right either but if I recall, she was referring to how Helen looked when she was going off on one....

[Ammi]

..I personally also think that personalities/unpleasant ones can strip people of their physical beauty..I'm sure people who don't like Ashleigh feel that as well, it's the inside shining through because that's the true beauty of someone....and they don't 'look' the same to you anymore...

[tanussa]

I'm like u, I thought helen was really horrible at the. beginning, but as series has gone on u can tell she honest, sincere and i know who I would rather have in my corner between her and ashleigh, ashleigh doesnt care one bit for.the various HMs who have been supposedly close to her in the house just uses them as support.

[Ammi]

..it's funny how we see things differently..(the beauty of it..)..because if I was to choose someone 'in my corner'..it wouldn't be someone who shrieks insults and abuse at people who may not like me or whatever...if I wanted for that to happen and felt it was acceptable then I would do it for myself....

[tanussa]

helen would have yor back more than ashleigh, cos the only back she has is her own

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by tanussa

helen would have yor back more than ashleigh, cos the only back she has is her own

..I have no idea who would 'have my back' more but the thing I am saying is I have my own back and that's all I would want...

[Cold Sweat]

Originally Posted by toronto_matt

i would attack that persons intellect not their physical features..

and say what you want about helen, she has never once mentioned or criticized the way ashleigh "looks", only the way she "acts"

calling someones face or someone as a whole ugly as an "insult" is pretty much as low as you can go, its shallow and its just downright rude. its pretty much scrapping the bottle of the barrel..

but hey, shes lovely right! ashleigh to win!

I think Ashleigh's opinion was that she doesn't see somebody that horrible as being attractive - was that not what she implied to Chris?

I "get" that opinion, for instance... I consider Danielle Lloyd to be a very ugly person.

[Razor]

They are my top three and have been from the beginning.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by toronto_matt

someone really has to help me with this, i started off LOVING chris and christopher from the start and throughout most of the series

ashleigh, i was always so so on, especially during her month long hiding in corners with danielle moaning and snickering stage but i never actually "disliked" her

and helen, my god, i despised her, i could not stand her! i honestly thought there was no way i could dislike a housemate ever again as much as i did her BUT

something happened, dont ask me what, there just came a point where i realized chris, christopher and ashligh started to really get to me and i found myself while not "liking" helen per say, but i started to understand her more and slowly but surely, the tables completely flipped and i found myself pro helen!

its madness i know..

i know there are alot of hardcore helen fans out there that have loved her from the start, but is there anyone else that started off absolutely despising the woman to now wanting her to win? i mean, i cant be the only one.. can i?

Yes exactly the same for me Toronto,Helens one of my faves now but really disliked her at the beginning,lets hope others have been openminded as to Helen.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Cold Sweat

I think Ashleigh's opinion was that she doesn't see somebody that horrible as being attractive - was that not what she implied to Chris?

I "get" that opinion, for instance... I consider Danielle Lloyd to be a very ugly person.

I also think it's ashleighs nastiness that makes HER ugly too

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by tanussa

helen would have yor back more than ashleigh, cos the only back she has is her own

Ashleigh wouldn't have your back,she'de just fill it will holes!

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..it's funny how we see things differently..(the beauty of it..)..because if I was to choose someone 'in my corner'..it wouldn't be someone who shrieks insults and abuse at people who may not like me or whatever...if I wanted for that to happen and felt it was acceptable then I would do it for myself....

Yes, have to agree with that, why anyone would want someone bleating, swearing and refusing to listen "in their corner" is beyond me... I'd be horrendously embarrassed. I'd probably end up telling her to pipe down... And then she'd turn on me and get bitchslapped (metaphorically, with words, of course... Not condoning physical violence)

[bots]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Yes, have to agree with that, why anyone would want someone bleating, swearing and refusing to listen "in their corner" is beyond me... I'd be horrendously embarrassed. I'd probably end up telling her to pipe down... And then she'd turn on me and get bitchslapped (metaphorically, with words, of course... Not condoning physical violence)

Ash has managed to get on with her without any issues. In my opinion, Ash is highly underrated, rather than making a drama and a crisis out of everything, he just quietly gets on with people. A lesson to be learned there I think.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Ash has managed to get on with her without any issues. In my opinion, Ash is highly underrated, rather than making a drama and a crisis out of everything, he just quietly gets on with people. A lesson to be learned there I think.

Absolutely right.
I think he is massively underrated,he has been a calming element in the house and aprt from some early misguded quotes,I do't think he has said or done anything really unpleasant since,despite having good reason to do so.

[Jules2]

Originally Posted by Achilles

I disagree with the entire contents of this thread

Me to, loved Christopher in his role as prosecutor, didnt he speak well. I have loved Chris since the beginning and was so grateful when Ashleigh went to him after Danielle left and told him that she wanted his friendship. He had been left out along with a few others. Their friendship is one of loyalty and trust along with Christopher.

On the other hand I was amazed at the amount of HMs read out by Christopher, whom Helen had had "fights" with. One forgets a lot.

CHRIS: ASHLEIGH and CHRISTOPHER for my final three.

[Jules2]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..I agree that an attack one physical appearance is the lowest...and I don't recall Helen doing so as such with Helen but (I think) that Helen has made some remarks about Ashleigh's 'face' in terms of the expressions etc she pulls but I may be wrong about that but if I recall the whole DR rant with Ashleigh, she said she was ugly when she went off on one type thing..?..I'm not saying that's right but its a more general thing said in anger rather than some of the specifics that have been said about other housemates and some by Helen herself as well as others...also I think the 'lowest' for me is specifics that would obviously be sensitive to someone like Ashleigh's acne which has been referred to so many times on here and elsewhere on social sites...its picking at a 'weakness/sensitivity' in with someone, no better than if it were a disability....

Hi to both, imo an insult is an insult no matter what is given much is said in the heat of the moment and many have been guilty of the same thing. What Ash, Helen and Pav are doing now to discredit Chris ad Ashleigh to the public, is beyond belief. They have never ever said before that they didnt like their relationship. Everyone stood up for Chris with Zoe being the main comforter.

Helen has a lot to answer for, in the papers it is said that she is going after another footballer, mind you we cannot always believe the papers, but this person is 40. How old is Helen, 27? This in itself proves that they are now using tactics to get the public on side. She is not honest at all. Also I do not remember Chris asking her to go abroad with him? He told her she was the most sexiest, a great compliment for her as she was downing herself at the time.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Ashleigh wouldn't have your back,she'de just fill it will holes!

My take too now, there comes times in a good number of peoples lives where they really need someone to help to or evn fight their corner.
IF and I stress 'if' Helen liked you and trusted you, then she is likely someone who would go tooth and nail to help you against someone or anything against you.

By the same token she could be likely ruthless against someone she didn't like at all,especially as to herself.
However,of the 2,she would be the one I would want on my side rather than not.

Whereas Ashleigh would possibly just sit back and say little or nothing,she would chat with you afterwards but probably not be in that ring with you at your side when really needed.
Speaking for me from what I have observed in the house by both of them, That is the conclusion I have personally reached.

[booboomartin]

Originally Posted by toronto_matt

someone really has to help me with this, i started off LOVING chris and christopher from the start and throughout most of the series

ashleigh, i was always so so on, especially during her month long hiding in corners with danielle moaning and snickering stage but i never actually "disliked" her

and helen, my god, i despised her, i could not stand her! i honestly thought there was no way i could dislike a housemate ever again as much as i did her BUT

something happened, dont ask me what, there just came a point where i realized chris, christopher and ashligh started to really get to me and i found myself while not "liking" helen per say, but i started to understand her more and slowly but surely, the tables completely flipped and i found myself pro helen!

its madness i know..

i know there are alot of hardcore helen fans out there that have loved her from the start, but is there anyone else that started off absolutely despising the woman to now wanting her to win? i mean, i cant be the only one.. can i?

no, your not. i feel exactly the same. i now find ashleigh so two faced. she along with chris are the two most nastiest in the house. when it comes to helen, they say everything behind closed doors.i cannot understand why christopher is friends with ashleigh, he must have a short memory when it comes to the treatment of him by her. neither her or chris have the balls to say what they really would love to say to helen, and when ashleighs devotees see her as someone so sweet well, please pass me the bucket. her devotees got rid of winston because they saw him as a threat to their princess (yuk), it was tactical voting at its worst. Helen to win

[user104658]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Ash has managed to get on with her without any issues. In my opinion, Ash is highly underrated, rather than making a drama and a crisis out of everything, he just quietly gets on with people. A lesson to be learned there I think.

Ash is very emotionally stable, as shown when none of them bought the "angry ash" task at all. He wasn't even being very angry, just moaning about t-shirts, and they were still all like "... Ash is on a task, he never gets angry..." . He's genuinely very laid back and he has a calming influence on Helen, they are polar opposites emotionally (Helen has very little control) but that strangely makes them fit together well. I can't imagine what she would have been like without Ash offering perspective and a calm aura... With just people like Winston, Mark, etc. winding her up even more. I think she may even have overstepped the mark and been removed.
He's only occasionally been sucked into a bit of negativity and for the mostpart, as I said in another thread, has been the only housemate (except maybe Christopher, though not any more) who has genuinely seemed to like everyone and want everyone to get along. If he was to run into any of the other housemates in the street in 6 months time, he would be genuinely happy to see them.

As for comparing Helen and Ashleigh I do think some people are a little blind to the faults of both girls. If you wouldn't trust one, you shouldn't trust the other - they really do have exactly the same personality type and are, first and foremost, self-serving. Neither of them have ever stood up for another housemate unless the issue also affected them.

[wormsinfested]

I use to like all three of them, but chris and ashleigh just got more and more dreadful & douchy.

I still like christopher and hope he wins, because he is the only one in there with good morals even after all the times he has been talked down on, been laughed at and nominated.

[Tip]

I wouldn't say I particularly like any of them.

At a push I suppose if I had to interact with any of them it would be Chris, Christopher and (just about) Ash.

I would be embarrassed if Helen had my back - and I agree she's a lot more palatable when she isn't shouting - but I'll never have any interest in her unless she does something with her life which is pretty incredible.

I agree that Ashleigh is no saint and again, not someone I'd be interesting in interacting with.

[susie q]

Originally Posted by mrflibble

So do I I don't know what's so bad about being 'closed off', but maybe that's because that's how I am. I am extremely introverted, I love being alone and I only like having a small, close group of friends. So I find the Chris/Christopher/Ashleigh group very real, honest and relatable for me.

Whereas I feel Helen's manipulative with her 'good' side, lacks self-awareness and a filter, and is just plain nasty. I don't feel that it's good that she voices every single thought that pops into her head and is completely predictable because that means she has no ability or will to change her bad traits, doesn't care if she hurts other people and never reflects on anything she does. Just because we 100% know she is a nasty, aggressive and loud person doesn't mean we should like her for it.

It's a very difficult thing to show restraint and remain polite and cordial with people you don't like and keep a level-head when things aren't going your way and when people show these qualities I consider them a strong person and someone who I would say I liked. Helen shows none of these and Chris/Christopher/Ashleigh have (to different extents). The Ashleigh crew also demonstrate a lot of intelligence and thought, unlike the Helen crew.

Great post

[MarcusMel]

I feel sorry for Helen and her abysmal lack of self worth and her wish to attack anybody who challenges any respect she feels she has for herself.

Ashleigh, seems to have too much undeserved self-respect and can't seem to let herself relax or be around with those that don't give her the respect she demands of them.

Ash, I don't see him as being nice. I still remember the look he had when up for eviction in the first week. It was a look that I felt could kill and still sends a shiver to my soul. If Ash doesn't like you, then life would be having every stupid thing you did mentioned over and over to drive you into anger and misery.

Christopher, Suspect that his energy and enthusiasm are like a dog greeting its master, overwhelming bounce and happiness, it is all too much of a good thing and very tiring to live with.

Pav, seems like someone who is swimming outside their comfort zone and trying to come to terms with a new situation. Did they show him during the 'finalist' task?

Chris :- Doubt anybody can get close to understanding him. See and analyses the world about him but can't communicate or more to the point be appreciated for the way he perceives the world. Probably the most misunderstood person of this BB series.