[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Labour MPs have demanded a meeting with the editor of the Sun newspaper for approving a front-page story that falsely claimed one in five British Muslims had sympathy with those who have left to fight for Islamic State in Syria.

The 10 MPs said in a letter to the Sun on Thursday: “We are writing to request a meeting with you regarding your recent story ‘1 in 5 Brit Muslims’ sympathy for jihadists’ from Monday 23 November.”

Shabana Mahmood, Labour MP for Birmingham Ladywood, led the Labour backbench call for an explanation from Tony Gallagher, the tabloid’s editor. The MPs said they were worried about the impact “flawed” and “misleading” stories have in stoking hate crimes.

They said editorial decisions “have consequences on attitudes to Muslims in the UK”, adding that this week there had been an “alarming increase” in attacks on British Muslims.

“Figures this week show that in one week since the barbaric Paris attacks hate crimes against Muslims have increased by 300% in the UK,” said the parliamentarians, who included Rushanara Ali, Labour MP for Bethnal Green and Bow, and Liam Byrne, Labour MP for Birmingham Hodge Hill.


http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...m-survey-story

[Kizzy]

Did the sun ask every British Muslim if they had sympathy for jihadists?

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Did the sun ask every British Muslim if they had sympathy for jihadists?

yes, that is how polls work...

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

yes, that is how polls work...

I'm surprised that they were all so honest in their responses... that at least is commendable.

[Denver]

What a utter knob

[GiRTh]

Youtube video

[GiRTh]

Youtube video

It looks like if he gets in power he's gonna do it. This seems to be what he is saying.

[Northern Monkey]

Any terrorists would either carry a fake one or just not carry one at all.It would'nt work.

[Crimson Dynamo]

At lest he is trying to address a massive problem.

Look at France and Belgium at the moment....



now there is a success story

[Samm]

He's a ****

[Livia]

It's been done. Didn't turn out well.

[JoshBB]

If the past counts for anything, it's that we must learn for it. ID Cards were one of the first tools of oppression used against the Jewish people in WW2 and we must never go down that path again.

Honestly, all this dehumanisation and vilification of muslims.. makes me wonder if he's ever met any? Though there are not that many in my town, all the muslims I've ever spoken to seem like lovely people. I don't doubt there are bad eggs just like any grouping of people, but it's not 'most' of muslims, which is what the media makes out.

[DemolitionRed]

I agree Josh, the press have a lot to answer for. The more we alienate these people and the more we take away their sense of belonging, the more likely they are to kick back at us with equal hatred.

[lostalex]

i don't really see the point. i can already tell who is a muslim very easily. they tend to stick out. i have pretty good musdar.

[Ammi]

..we have no weapons against IS, none..I don't mean armies or governments but the general public because the general public are the targets and the vulnerable...what we do have though and the only thing we have is to not allow communities to turn on each other, to be suspicious of each other and most definitely not to be in some way 'labelled' as a potential 'enemy'...that's exactly what IS want, it really is one of their strongest weapons if we allow it...paranoia, suspicion etc..destroying us without raising a weapon to do so..and good old Donald, giving them exactly what they want...

..obviously in my job, we do PREVENT training and like any safeguarding stuff, it's about things being there that would cause concern..but not looking for them to be there, not scrutinising for them to be there..because if we do that, then we'll be looking from a perspective of negativity and a perspective of suspicion and then that's when a community completely dissolves../job done IS, glad to serve you...

[kirklancaster]

I know this is going to lower me in the 'Tibb Popularity Lists' even more, but I'm sorry - I cannot contain myself.

I am sick to ******* death of hearing phrases such as 'Alienating' and 'segregating' and 'ostracising' when it comes to immigrants, especially Muslims.

The British people have opened up this country for them, welcomed them with open arms, and extended jobs or benefits to them, provided housing for them to live in, and Mosques for them to worship in. We have even allowed them to practice Sharia Law in some forms.

And yes, SOME Muslims DO integrate, and ARE friendly, but a whole LOT more do not and are not.

A whole lot more HAVE clustered themselves into 'Ghettos' as LeatherTrumpet so rightly says, and they do not WANT to 'mix' with the indigenous British. They do not WANT to accept our laws, our customs and traditions, our 'Way of Life. They do not WANT to integrate.

Some of you may have 'lived side by side' with Muslims and found no problem, no hostility, no threat, and that's YOUR own direct experience which is good. There is however, another side to the coin - Muslim areas which are virtually 'No Go' to Non-Muslims and even British Policemen.

Parts of Southall and Tower Hamlets in London, parts of Burnley in Lancashire, and Bradford and Huddersfield in Yorkshire - among many others - all have Muslim ghettos where white non-Muslims who know the areas well, steer clear of.

Integration - like Racial Tolerance - is a 'two way sword', and not ALL immigrants who come here WANT any part of either.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

I know this is going to lower me in the 'Tibb Popularity Lists' even more, but I'm sorry - I cannot contain myself.

I am sick to ******* death of hearing phrases such as 'Alienating' and 'segregating' and 'ostracising' when it comes to immigrants, especially Muslims.

The British people have opened up this country for them, welcomed them with open arms, and extended jobs or benefits to them, provided housing for them to live in, and Mosques for them to worship in. We have even allowed the to practice Sharia Law in some forms.

And yes, SOME Muslims DO integrate, and ARE friendly, but a whole LOT more do not and are not.

A whole lot more HAVE clustered themselves into 'Ghettos' as LeatherTrumpet so rightly says, and they do not WANT to 'mix' with the indigenous British. They do not WANT to accept our laws, our customs and traditions, our 'Way of Life. They do not WANT to integrate.

Some of you may have 'lived side by side' with Muslims and found no problem, no hostility, no threat, and that's YOUR own direct experience which is good. There is however, another side to the coin - Muslim areas which are virtually 'No Go' to Non-Muslims and even British Policemen.

Parts of Southall and Tower Hamlets in London, parts of Burnley in Lancashire, and Bradford and Huddersfield in Yorkshire - among many others - all have Muslim ghettos where white non-Muslims who know the areas well, steer clear of.

Integration - like Racial Tolerance - is a 'two way sword', and not ALL immigrants who come here WANT any part of either.

I think you make some good points on what you're saying, but sadly it's very different to what Donald Trump wants which is to setup a way for the Governments in future to make you have to have ID just to go to your nearest shop, because don't believe that it will just be for Muslims is his real intentions.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

I know this is going to lower me in the 'Tibb Popularity Lists' even more, but I'm sorry - I cannot contain myself.

I am sick to ******* death of hearing phrases such as 'Alienating' and 'segregating' and 'ostracising' when it comes to immigrants, especially Muslims.

The British people have opened up this country for them, welcomed them with open arms, and extended jobs or benefits to them, provided housing for them to live in, and Mosques for them to worship in. We have even allowed them to practice Sharia Law in some forms.

And yes, SOME Muslims DO integrate, and ARE friendly, but a whole LOT more do not and are not.

A whole lot more HAVE clustered themselves into 'Ghettos' as LeatherTrumpet so rightly says, and they do not WANT to 'mix' with the indigenous British. They do not WANT to accept our laws, our customs and traditions, our 'Way of Life. They do not WANT to integrate.

Some of you may have 'lived side by side' with Muslims and found no problem, no hostility, no threat, and that's YOUR own direct experience which is good. There is however, another side to the coin - Muslim areas which are virtually 'No Go' to Non-Muslims and even British Policemen.

Parts of Southall and Tower Hamlets in London, parts of Burnley in Lancashire, and Bradford and Huddersfield in Yorkshire - among many others - all have Muslim ghettos where white non-Muslims who know the areas well, steer clear of.

Integration - like Racial Tolerance - is a 'two way sword', and not ALL immigrants who come here WANT any part of either.

There are a few places in the UK I would consider no go areas but none of them are Muslim. There's a lot of sink estates in England, especially London and Birmingham, that have Pakistanis, Bangladeshi and Afro-Caribbean communities. If you want to rant on about how us Brits have opened this country for all these immigrants, then you can't just speak about Muslims, you have to include Orthodox Jews, Hindus and the Afro Caribbean who use all sorts of feral Christian religions.

Blaming ghetto situations on one specific religion is yet another 'bait and switch' Kirk. Sink estates and no go areas are not a religious issue, rather one of general poverty and alienation...and if you want to moan about all these bloody immigrants and how 'we' the Brits have welcomed these unappreciative people with open arms, lets at least include all ethnic minorities and not just the ones you don't like.

Oh and please don't tell me Orthodox Jews, Hindus and AC's don't form their own large communities...but then, why shouldn't they?. If they want to keep themselves to themselves what's the problem. I lived in Hackney for a while and not once did I get to have a conversation with an Orthodox Jew. I didn't leave Hackney resentfully believing Orthodox Jews were intolerant of people outside their faith, I just accepted they rarely mix and that's the way it is.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

There are a few places in the UK I would consider no go areas but none of them are Muslim. There's a lot of sink estates in England, especially London and Birmingham, that have Pakistanis, Bangladeshi and Afro-Caribbean communities. If you want to rant on about how us Brits have opened this country for all these immigrants, then you can't just speak about Muslims, you have to include Orthodox Jews, Hindus and the Afro Caribbean who use all sorts of feral Christian religions.

Blaming ghetto situations on one specific religion is yet another 'bait and switch' Kirk. Sink estates and no go areas are not a religious issue, rather one of general poverty and alienation...and if you want to moan about all these bloody immigrants and how 'we' the Brits have welcomed these unappreciative people with open arms, lets at least include all ethnic minorities and not just the ones you don't like.

Oh and please don't tell me Orthodox Jews, Hindus and AC's don't form their own large communities...but then, why shouldn't they?. If they want to keep themselves to themselves what's the problem. I lived in Hackney for a while and not once did I get to have a conversation with an Orthodox Jew. I didn't leave Hackney resentfully believing Orthodox Jews were intolerant of people outside their faith, I just accepted they rarely mix and that's the way it is.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

There are a few places in the UK I would consider no go areas but none of them are Muslim. There's a lot of sink estates in England, especially London and Birmingham, that have Pakistanis, Bangladeshi and Afro-Caribbean communities. If you want to rant on about how us Brits have opened this country for all these immigrants, then you can't just speak about Muslims, you have to include Orthodox Jews, Hindus and the Afro Caribbean who use all sorts of feral Christian religions.

Blaming ghetto situations on one specific religion is yet another 'bait and switch' Kirk. Sink estates and no go areas are not a religious issue, rather one of general poverty and alienation...and if you want to moan about all these bloody immigrants and how 'we' the Brits have welcomed these unappreciative people with open arms, lets at least include all ethnic minorities and not just the ones you don't like.

Oh and please don't tell me Orthodox Jews, Hindus and AC's don't form their own large communities...but then, why shouldn't they?. If they want to keep themselves to themselves what's the problem. I lived in Hackney for a while and not once did I get to have a conversation with an Orthodox Jew. I didn't leave Hackney resentfully believing Orthodox Jews were intolerant of people outside their faith, I just accepted they rarely mix and that's the way it is.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

There are a few places in the UK I would consider no go areas but none of them are Muslim. There's a lot of sink estates in England, especially London and Birmingham, that have Pakistanis, Bangladeshi and Afro-Caribbean communities. If you want to rant on about how us Brits have opened this country for all these immigrants, then you can't just speak about Muslims, you have to include Orthodox Jews, Hindus and the Afro Caribbean who use all sorts of feral Christian religions.

Blaming ghetto situations on one specific religion is yet another 'bait and switch' Kirk. Sink estates and no go areas are not a religious issue, rather one of general poverty and alienation...and if you want to moan about all these bloody immigrants and how 'we' the Brits have welcomed these unappreciative people with open arms, lets at least include all ethnic minorities and not just the ones you don't like.

Oh and please don't tell me Orthodox Jews, Hindus and AC's don't form their own large communities...but then, why shouldn't they?. If they want to keep themselves to themselves what's the problem. I lived in Hackney for a while and not once did I get to have a conversation with an Orthodox Jew. I didn't leave Hackney resentfully believing Orthodox Jews were intolerant of people outside their faith, I just accepted they rarely mix and that's the way it is.

There's a difference between forming large communities and expecting the existing communities to make exceptions for you.

Try walking round Whitechapel in a short skirt, or with a cigarette in your hand and I guarantee you will be approached and castigated about your attire or the fact you're smoking and don't have a penis. And then try walking round Stamford Hill (or indeed Hackney) in the same outfit and watch the Orthodox Jews ignore you. That's the difference. We make exceptions for Muslims that we never make for other religions. I've never heard anyone worry about upsetting the Hindus because the Hindus don't expect us to change our national identity to fit in with them.

[kirklancaster]

There ARE Muslim 'No Go' areas throughout the UK - I have been there and so have others on here, if any have the courage to stand up against the usual over-heated backlash every time some do speak the truth.

"There's a lot of sink estates in England, especially London and Birmingham, that have Pakistanis, Bangladeshi and Afro-Caribbean communities."

I am NOT disputing what you say above about other 'ethnic' ghettos but my post was confined to 'Muslims' because this thread is specifically about Muslims and the comments to which I referred and responded to were made by posters on this thread specifically about Muslims.

"If you want to rant on about how us Brits have opened this country for all these immigrants, then you can't just speak about Muslims, you have to include Orthodox Jews, Hindus and the Afro Caribbean who use all sorts of feral Christian religions."


My post was NOT a rant unlike your response here. You are the one doing the ranting Red, and again, my post was confined to 'Muslims' because this thread is specifically about Muslims and the comments to which I referred and responded to were made by posters on this thread specifically about Muslims. If you want to discuss other 'ethnic' ghetto's please start a new thread and I will gladly contribute.

"Blaming ghetto situations on one specific religion is yet another 'bait and switch' Kirk. Sink estates and no go areas are not a religious issue, rather one of general poverty and alienation..."

I am NOT "Blaming ghetto situations on one specific religion" - that is clearly NOT what I said - I am saying that SOME Muslim immigrants freely ELECT to insulate themselves from the rest of mainstream Britain, and CHOOSE to create their own 'ghettos', and OPT not to integrate and accept our way of life, our laws and traditions, and if you KNOW differently, then you are living in la la land. '

"...and if you want to moan about all these bloody immigrants and how 'we' the Brits have welcomed these unappreciative people with open arms, lets at least include all ethnic minorities and not just the ones you don't like. "

Now this is totally unacceptable. Do not presume to know me and know what or who I "don't like". You do not know me. You do not know my likes and dislikes.

You are totally - and clearly - wrong in stating this last on so many counts:

a) I have already stated WHY I did not include any other 'ethnic minorities' (a misnomer if ever there was one where certain parts of the UK are concerned) and my explanation is both logical and true - Do we start discussing apples, pears and bananas on a thread which is specifically discussing oranges?

b) "Moaning about bloody immigrants" is NOT what I was doing - I was moaning about certain people forever using certain cliched terms when talking about Muslims; "I am sick to ******* death of hearing phrases such as 'Alienating' and 'segregating' and 'ostracising' when it comes to immigrants, especially Muslims" - is EXACTLY what I said. It's there in my post for you to check.

I was merely STATING FACTS about some Muslims - and that truth seems to have so illogically enraged you that you misrepresent what I actually said and caused you to respond with this ilogical 'rant'.

"Oh and please don't tell me Orthodox Jews, Hindus and AC's don't form their own large communities...but then, why shouldn't they?. If they want to keep themselves to themselves what's the problem."

And??? What is your point? And what has it to do with my post?

"I lived in Hackney for a while and not once did I get to have a conversation with an Orthodox Jew. I didn't leave Hackney resentfully believing Orthodox Jews were intolerant of people outside their faith, I just accepted they rarely mix and that's the way it is."

Good for you. I have lived in Islington for a time and Minehead and Scarborough and Manchester for a time - among other locations - and I have made lots of friends with Orthodox Jews as well as Non-Orthodox Jews, and even dated a couple of Jewish girls in my youth. What have Jews in particular got to do with my post which was specifically on Muslims for the reasons I stated?

Or is this just more 'back-door' tactics of mildly slating Judaism because you perceive from my posts that I am 'Jew Friendly'? You know, the way you did with Christianity because I am a Christian when you needlessly wrote: "and the Afro Caribbean who use all sorts of feral Christian religions."?

I was not slating all Muslims - neither the religion nor the people - but stating a plain fact about SOME which I KNOW of from my own direct experience, so your over-reaction is really uncalled for.

Incidentally, the way that certain posts on here ALWAYS attract applause emoticons from certain members REGARDLESS of any truth or merit or lack of them, in the post, is both predictable AND laughable.

[Vicky.]

Up their own arse rich guys with disgusting views should be made to wear ID badges tbh. I cannot imagine the kind of person who would vote for this idiot, I really can't.

[Kizzy]

Scary isn't it?

[bots]

I think if Trump ends up being president - and he may well do ... it is America, he will be assassinated within days of taking office