[Vicky.]

More on the james obrien thing, and sex segregation being very much needed here

https://fairplayforwomen.com/james-obrien-topshop

In the UK where women have sex segregation, only 10% of sex crime (98% of which is committed by men, 90% of the victims of which are female) is opportunistic. In India, where there is no sex segregation, 90% of sex crime is opportunistic. The women’s liberation movement campaigned for single sex spaces so that women could have a PUBLIC LIFE. Read up on the history of the first women’s public toilet in London. Women were beaten in the streets for wanting that because women’s place was in the home. We are entitled to go about our lawful business without harassment from men, we are allowed to SAY NO TO PENIS in our private spaces. Traumatized women, raped women, religious women, lesbian women, shy women, teenage girls are ALLOWED BOUNDARIES. It’s not about you in the cubicle next to us, it’s about MEN. If you are denying that men are committing epidemic levels of violence and depravity against women and girls, all over the world, you are deluded. You might not be a violent man James, but you still benefit from women’s fear of all the men that are – sex attackers don’t wear a badge! Your lack of awareness of this fact has a name, feminists call it ‘male privilege’.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

https://gendertrender.wordpress.com/...sgender-males/

Also in prison, transwomen are massively over represented.

https://fairplayforwomen.com/transgender-prisoners

Which leads me to conclude, that being a trans actually INCREASES the risk of sex offending. Rather than decreases, as is usually claimed by activists

It's probably more to do with opportunism than because they're trans, as your source points out opportunistic rapes happen more often in places with no sex segregation.

Originally Posted by Vicky.

More on the james obrien thing, and sex segregation being very much needed here

https://fairplayforwomen.com/james-obrien-topshop

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

It's probably more to do with opportunism than because they're trans, as your source points out opportunistic rapes happen more often in places with no sex segregation.

Yup maybe. Even more reason for keeping sex segregated areas sex segregated tbh. And for not putting male people into female prisons, where they would have even more oppurtunity as the females literaly cannot get away from them.

Either way, all evidence points to 'transwomen' retaining a male pattern of offense. At the least

[bots]

do the research on Momentum Vicky and you can make your own mind up about them. People can argue till blue in the face, but the facts are all freely available.

[Oliver_W]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

do the research on Momentum Vicky and you can make your own mind up about them. People can argue till blue in the face, but the facts are all freely available.

She has researched Momentum, and didn't like what she found.

[Northern Monkey]

I do agree with you on the subject as a whole but that mums net thread(what i read of it)is packed full of misandrists too.They moan about being called ‘TERF SCUM’ while making sweeping generalisations about men as a whole.I think they’d get more male support if they dropped that stuff.
They call these trans people a cult while all agreeing and back patting each other.
There is a sense of irony that some of the more radical feminists/misandrists are getting back what they’ve been dishing out to men for so long.That’s certainly not to say that all feminists are misandrists.There are many moderates too.
I do agree though that there definitely seems to be some almost unresolvable problems between the self identifying trans people and womens roles and spaces.
Two ‘progressive’worlds are colliding.
The thing is that trans issues should’nt outweigh more than fifty percent of the populations rights.

[Vicky.]

I will stick up for the womens rights posters on mumsnet here and say that when they say men they tend to mean 'as a class' rather than all men. And its quite right that men (as a class) love talking over women.

I don't think acknowledging the systematic oppression of women by men makes one a misandrist. This obviously does not mean all men oppress women, but its ridiculous to deny that women are oppressed on the whole because of their female biology and the fact that biology also means we are weaker and the ones who bear children. And its those of the sex that sire children and are stronger and larger that do the oppressing of the other group.

This is pretty basic feminism tbh :S Acknowledging these facts, however uncomfortable this makes you.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I will stick up for the womens rights posters on mumsnet here and say that when they say men they tend to mean 'as a class' rather than all men. And its quite right that men (as a class) love talking over women.

I don't think acknowledging the systematic oppression of women by men makes one a misandrist. This obviously does not mean all men oppress women, but its ridiculous to deny that women are oppressed on the whole because of their female biology and the fact that biology also means we are weaker and the ones who bear children. And its those of the sex that sire children and are stronger and larger that do the oppressing of the other group.

This is pretty basic feminism tbh :S Acknowledging these facts, however uncomfortable this makes you.

The issue there though with using language infering that ‘men are the problem’ is if you generalise like that about any other ‘class’ in society(except white People) I.E ‘women are the problem’,’muslims are the problem’,’trans people are the problem’ then you’re shouted down as sexist,racist,transphobic etc etc.
What makes feminists above being called out for the same generalising language?
That kind of stuff can just alienate male readers instead of making them more sympathetic.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

The issue there though with using language infering that ‘men are the problem’ is if you generalise like that about any other ‘class’ in society(except white People) I.E ‘women are the problem’,’muslims are the problem’,’trans people are the problem’ then you’re shouted down as sexist,racist,transphobic etc etc.
What makes feminists above being called out for the same generalising language?
That kind of stuff can just alienate male readers instead of making them more sympathetic.

If there was overwhelming evidence that on any issue 'Muslims' or 'trans people' were the problem, I would have non issue with this being said?

When speaking of violence, and specifically sexual violence, you cannot deny that it is a very male issue on the whole. When talking of sex based oppression, you cannot deny that it has been (and is) males oppressing females by whatever means, not the other way around.

I do believe in 'male privilege' tbh. Sue me.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

If there was overwhelming evidence that on any issue 'Muslims' or 'trans people' were the problem, I would have non issue with this being said?

When speaking of violence, and specifically sexual violence, you cannot deny that it is a very male issue on the whole. When talking of sex based oppression, you cannot deny that it has been (and is) males oppressing females by whatever means, not the other way around.

I do believe in 'male privilege' tbh. Sue me.

It’s really no different though.It could be argued that Islamic terrorism is a muslim problem and trans activists are a trans problem.

As for male privilege my opinion is that males could possibly be privileged in certain areas but then so are women.I’d say it’s pretty equal these days.Men and women are different and prosper in different areas and are oppressed in different ways too.

[Withano]

The job needed to go to someone though? Maybe they was the most qualified applicant? Men can learn about womens rights and laws etc too

You kinda plucked out something controversial that was said, and suggested they dont deserve their title cos of your views on what was said.. but you surely understand that just as many (probably more) agree with what they said and disagree with what the previous officer said? I dont think thats a valid reason to exclude them, what was said is controversial - nobody will please everybody on a topic like that.

If they have a job of womens officer, then they should be thinking of m2f women too - like thats just logical.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

The job needed to go to someone though? Maybe he was the most qualified applicant? Men can learn about womens rights and laws etc too

You kinda plucked out something controversial that was said, and suggested he doesnt deserve his title cos of your views on what was said.. but you surely understand that just as many (probably more) agree with what he said and disagree with what the previous officer said? I dont think thats a valid reason to exclude him, what was said is controversial - nobody will please everybody on a topic like that.

If he has a job of womens officer, then he should be thinking of m2f women too - like thats just logical.

MtF is not a woman. A MtF is a transwoman. Large difference. And transwomen have their own issues, entirely separate from those of females. Given this person has already decided biology is irrelevant, he is clearly unfit to be anyone to represent female issues. Given you know, biology is the reason for female oppression and that.

Withano, I know you pride yourself on being liberal, but please read this, specifically directed at left wing men who think telling women that male people are also women is fine

https://medium.com/@GappyTales/dear-...t-f20fbf6272cf

Covers so many of the issues I see in this.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

MtF is not a woman. A MtF is a transwoman. Large difference. And transwomen have their own issues, entirely separate from those of females. Given this person has already decided biology is irrelevant, he is clearly unfit to be anyone to represent female issues.

But a transwomans officer isn't a job? Perhaps it should be, but until then....

Obviously when theyre discussing abortions, they wont be thinking about transwomen, but they also wont be thinking about infertile or celibate women either, so I'm not sure what the issue is. Not every woman will be directly relevant to every single aspect of the womens officers job description.. but thats okay. I think the idea is more that they will be covered somewhere, and there is a person who will work to think of them when and where they are concerned.

[Vicky.]

No surprise that men think this is fine. Sorry to stereotype but it is odd that it seems to be mainly men who see no issue with this.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

Not every woman will be directly relevant to every single aspect of the womens officers job description.. but thats okay.

But no aspects of this job are relevant to a male?

No every aspect will not be relevant to every woman. But they will understand it more, you know, being of the class of women. Not the class of...men.

[Jamie89]

Originally Posted by Withano

The job needed to go to someone though? Maybe they was the most qualified applicant? Men can learn about womens rights and laws etc too

You kinda plucked out something controversial that was said, and suggested they dont deserve their title cos of your views on what was said.. but you surely understand that just as many (probably more) agree with what they said and disagree with what the previous officer said? I dont think thats a valid reason to exclude them, what was said is controversial - nobody will please everybody on a topic like that.

If they have a job of womens officer, then they should be thinking of m2f women too - like thats just logical.

This tbh. Do we know anything about his competence in the role? Or is that not important?

[Oliver_W]

Vicky, you like Magdalen Berns - in one of her videos, I believe she said transwomen assault women at the exact same rate as other males, but I can't remember the exact quote or context, and if she sourced it, any ideas?

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Vicky, you like Magdalen Berns - in one of her videos, I believe she said transwomen assault women at the exact same rate as other males, but I can't remember the exact quote or context, and if she sourced it, any ideas?

https://gendertrender.wordpress.com/...sgender-males/

Also in prison, transwomen are massively over represented.

https://fairplayforwomen.com/transgender-prisoners

Which leads me to conclude, that being a trans actually INCREASES the risk of sex offending. Rather than decreases, as is usually claimed by activists

[Denver]

Best result

[Vicky.]

I don't understand how to link the original tweet..my link is going to replies?

But it seems this guy has also put himself forward for the Jo Cox women in leadership program. thats meant to be about...increasing women in leadership roles. Not a surprise.

https://twitter.com/rachelherriotts/...96251237269506

Scroll up

[Withano]

Oh wait, your title suggested it was an actual male who got the job? Its an m2f trans person?

I'll be honest, I'm more fine with it now than before now.

Like I just assumed it was a guy who was a bit of a feminist and studied up on the issues and laws. This makes way more sense

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

Oh wait, your title suggested it was an actual male who got the job? Its an m2f trans person?

I'll be honest, I'm more fine with it now than before now.

Like I just assumed it was a guy who was a bit of a feminist and studied up on the issues and laws. This makes way more sense

You were already fine with it

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

You were already fine with it

Yeh - but in a 'well fair enough' type way, they applied for the job and got it which implied they were the best for the role - even without the literal experience of living as a woman, just assumed they were gonna make up for that lack of exp with extra research and studying or something, but now, most of that changes.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Withano

Oh wait, your title suggested it was an actual male who got the job? Its an m2f trans person?

I'll be honest, I'm more fine with it now than before now.

Like I just assumed it was a guy who was a bit of a feminist and studied up on the issues and laws. This makes way more sense

No offence but you're a man it's not men it effects so it's irrelevant if you're fine with it or not

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No offence but you're a man it's not men it effects so it's irrelevant if you're fine with it or not

Should have been specified that they only wanted opinions from females in the OP then - I didn't know?