[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

In a ‘democracy’ trying every trick in the book to overturn a democratic vote. It’s a democracy when it suits.

To many Corbyn does pose a threat to the security of this country in many ways and as we all have to live here everyone has a right to a say on that.

Corbyn does concern me with how extremely left he is if you want my honest opinion, but at this point I don't think the country and the people within the country can take anymore of the Tories austerity plans or privatisation of public services for much longer. Yes they've got money back but look at how they're doing it, and also do you think that the people are benefiting from these schemes? Are we actually living our lives? Or are we slowly becoming more dependent on stuff like Jobseeker's and loans just to get by? As I've already said I understand the fears that alot of people have about Jeremy Corbyn, but personally I don't think that any of us can handle the Tories schemes for much longer, I know that this will sound silly but it's like watching a Movie villain ruling the real life situations of the UK and it's sickening to me.

I also don't like the 1984 element of Theresa May and the rest of the Tories wanting to invade people's privacy on their Phones and Computers, that to me is just disgraceful and a slippery slope. And again is something I'd moan about alot more but it's nothing to do with the discussion on this thread.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

In a ‘democracy’ trying every trick in the book to overturn a democratic vote. It’s a democracy when it suits.

To many Corbyn does pose a threat to the security of this country in many ways and as we all have to live here everyone has a right to a say on that.

You have no reason to say that whatsoever, it's just a nonsense thing to say because it could never happen. it wouldn't even get enough backing to be brought as a question for the house of commons...

If you thought about it in a realistic fashion instead of the knee jerk 'i hate corbyn' goto reaction you'd realise this.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

You have no reason to say that whatsoever, it's just a nonsense thing to say because it could never happen. it wouldn't even get enough backing to be brought as a question for the house of commons...

If you thought about it in a realistic fashion instead of the knee jerk 'i hate corbyn' goto reaction you'd realise this.

I have every reason. It isn't just about nuclear weapons but his views on all sorts of issues that could put our security at risk. He is not the pure and honest old man you think he is despite your repeated attempts to convince us all he is.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

In a ‘democracy’ trying every trick in the book to overturn a democratic vote. It’s a democracy when it suits.

To many Corbyn does pose a threat to the security of this country in many ways and as we all have to live here everyone has a right to a say on that.

You mean like the right we had a say on regarding austerity or the right we had a say on regarding the selling off of the NHS?

A democracy is supposed to represent its people and not divide those people down the middle. Anyone who pays any attention to politics can see that the Tory party continually and surreptitiously try to fragment and even disenfranchise democracy.

[bots]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

You mean like the right we had a say on regarding austerity or the right we had a say on regarding the selling off of the NHS?

A democracy is supposed to represent its people and not divide those people down the middle. Anyone who pays any attention to politics can see that the Tory party continually and surreptitiously try to fragment and even disenfranchise democracy.

The conservatives set out what it was going to do, and the people voted for them in the last 2 elections. Is it only democracy when the result is a labour win?

[DemolitionRed]

Anyone who believes we are better off with a private healthcare system shouldn't only take a look at the costs but consider, even if they can afford an all singing dancing insurance policy, they may find the exemptions incurred over a period of years a very real problem.

Anyone who believes the NHS can't work need to do some research into what's gone on and what is still going on behind the dark doors of parliament. Neolib thinkers like May, Cameron, Johnson, Mogg and Blair want a Mont Pelerin Society where the less responsibility a government has, the better. At first it was easy, but now the public are becoming suspicious and voices are being raised.
Regarding the NHS, we have been hoodwinked to a point of no return. As our children grow older they simply won't have the same privilege's around health as we've had and I find that tragic.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Anyone who believes we are better off with a private healthcare system shouldn't only take a look at the costs but consider, even if they can afford an all singing dancing insurance policy, they may find the exemptions incurred over a period of years a very real problem.

Anyone who believes the NHS can't work need to do some research into what's gone on and what is still going on behind the dark doors of parliament. Neolib thinkers like May, Cameron, Johnson, Mogg and Blair want a Mont Pelerin Society where the less responsibility a government has, the better. At first it was easy, but now the public are becoming suspicious and voices are being raised.
Regarding the NHS, we have been hoodwinked to a point of no return. As our children grow older they simply won't have the same privilege's around health as we've had and I find that tragic.

The thread isnt about that its about whether you think public services in the UK are on their knees or not

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

The thread isnt about that its about whether you think public services in the UK are on their knees or not

The NHS are very deliberately on their knees. Sorry you didn't understand that.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

The NHS are very deliberately on their knees. Sorry you didn't understand that.

The NHS has been in trouble for awhile sadly, hopefully some MP's will rise through the ranks and sort the NHS out.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

The NHS has been in trouble for awhile sadly, hopefully some MP's will rise through the ranks and sort the NHS out.

what part?

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Its a cry we are familiar with from those in the Labour Party or on the extreme left

Edits that to include the Green Party, the Liberal Democrats and the SNP.

[Livia]

The NHS has more spent on it now than at any time in the past; ten times what was spent on it sixty years ago. when 11% of the public services budget spent on it. That figure is now almost 30%. The fact that the population is ageing seems to have come as a bit of a shock to both the government and the NHS. In my opinion, the NHS would be more cost-effective if they managed the money better. It's run like every other public service but if it was run like a business, that might be different. And furthermore, NHS priorities are shot when they're denying cancer treatment but funding breast augmentation, sex changes and IVF, while the world is struggling with the beginning effects of overpopulation.

[smudgie]

Re the NHS.
Too many people to look after nowadays, we are living too long.
Too many time wasters as well.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by smudgie

Re the NHS.
Too many people to look after nowadays, we are living too long.
Too many time wasters as well.

Time wasters should be fined - I have long believed that. It may sound harsh but we have to put a stop to it and direct that money where it is actually needed.

[Twosugars]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Time wasters should be fined - I have long believed that. It may sound harsh but we have to put a stop to it and direct that money where it is actually needed.

agree in principle, but it may be difficult

[bots]

wake up call, the NHS isn't going to be sorted out because there just isn't enough money to pay for EVERYTHING that anyone could possibly ever want.

It may depress some, but the simple reality is that it is due to it's success at prolonging and extending life that it has a problem. If it was on its knees it wouldn't be saving lives, and therefore there would be less demand on it. It's simple economics

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

wake up call, the NHS isn't going to be sorted out because there just isn't enough money to pay for EVERYTHING that anyone could possibly ever want.

It may depress some, but the simple reality is that it is due to it's success at prolonging and extending life that it has a problem. If it was on its knees it wouldn't be saving lives, and therefore there would be less demand on it. It's simple economics

None of that is true. If you believe this then sorry but you believe the Tory lie.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

None of that is true. If you believe this then sorry but you believe the Tory lie.

are you saying that there is enough money to pay for EVERYTHING that anyone could possibly ever want?

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

are you saying that there is enough money to pay for EVERYTHING that anyone could possibly ever want?

No, that would be silly but that's not what I said.

Professor Richard Murphy explains it much better than I could.

"There is no limit to the amount of money a government can create if it so wishes. Money creation is, after all, costless. It is also technically limitless. That does not mean a government should be reckless. There is, of course inflation to consider. But that is what tax is for. It is government spending that creates the ability to tax. Where else, after all, does enough government created money to pay tax come from if government does not create it in the first place? Quite emphatically, it is not tax that creates the capacity for government to spend; that capacity always exists. Instead it is taxation that limits inflation when the government is spending to meet social purpose, for example, by funding the NHS. And spending in that way is always desirable, and there is always a gain to society, until the point is reached then the economy is working at its capacity, from which point the UK as a whole has been so far adrift for so long a time. That’s precisely why any constraint on NHS spending is inappropriate at present"

http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/?s=privatization

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

are you saying that there is enough money to pay for EVERYTHING that anyone could possibly ever want?

Tbf the DUP got £1.5bn out of our Government so it's not out of reach that they could actually put more money into the NHS.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

None of that is true. If you believe this then sorry but you believe the Tory lie.

No different to you believing all the Corbyn/Labour lies. It comes down to opinion.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

No different to you believing all the Corbyn/Labour lies. It comes down to opinion.

There's enough fact out there for it not to be an opinion.

Do I believe Corbyn can save the NHS? No I don't.
Do Believe Corbyn will attempt to save the NHS?... yes.

That's opinion!

[Crimson Dynamo]

I wonder how much is robbed out of the NHS each year?

out the back door etc...

[Withano]

Yes

[Kazanne]

I think there is a lot of waste and greed,just this week there was a story of some who worked in the NHS who had ripped it off to the tune of a million quid over time,plus I know councils who spent ridiculous amounts out on sending glossy calendars out to all their tenants every year,these are not cheap calendars ,and must cost thousands,also their council vans painted with bloody Wallace and Grommit advertising how caring the council is,lol really did they actually need those vans painting? they could use that money for the repairs that should be done instead of claiming they have no money all the time,so I don't think the government alone can be blamed ,there is a LOT of greed and waste in these companies, the government will be fighting a losing battle throwing money at people who are intent on wasting and looking after themselves, but I guess some have to blame someone.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-new...n-scam-4706806